Gone back to Cubase but here's what will bring me right back

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Bobby L'Avenir wrote:
SLiC wrote:Dear BITWiG

Please make Cubase!


Seriously, I have cubase 8 and used to use it when I was recording a guitar/vocal based track (I now use S1) it is the 'spreadsheet' of DAWs, it does everything pretty well (and is the best for linier complex midi arrangements).

Cubase already exists, don't make BITWiG Studio be like Cubase, I used different DAWs for different jobs, even different moods....BW is fast, fun, great with my modular...starts and finishes tracks, it replaces Live completely for me and 80% of what the more established linier DAWs do.

Sure, fix the bugs (still plenty in Cubase, check the forum!) but pick the DAWs for the task, there is not and never will be one DAW for everything...add all that stuff to BITWiG and it won't be fast and simple anymore, it will be the drop down menu heavy window heavy spreadsheet like DAW that already exists.....
Sometimes it's best to use what's becoming a lost art form properly before posting, READING. I'm not trying to be rude but i posted a comment 5 up from yours in the hope people would have a less limited mind set in this thread as people tend to scan read things, fail to understand what the topic is, then assume what the topic is based on how they think and post comments or opinions accordingly. Would it be cool for me to give you a movie review if i left the theatre after 15 mins? This will always happen though, we live in an age of distraction so people will read things lazy and still feel the need to comment when they have not properly listened (this forum is all text so listening here = reading properly and some have already switched off reading this :hihi: ).

The problem with this is that other distracted or lazy readers who would've had something worth contributing read your post and assume you actually read at least the original post (like you'd expect from a movie reviewer to have watched the whole movie) and have made a logical assessment so no need to read for themselves, so they then without using their own mind take your view point and start posting when your view point was off target because you never read/listened to the point in the first place. even worse some don't post at all, this leads to threads going waaaay of point or dying off. Please go read my post 5 up from yours, and then properly read the original post too.

Also your post makes no sense i places and has quite a lot of limiting beliefs that i for one won't accept. How on earth do you know that bitwig would be full of drop downs menus if they added more features, you don't even know how'd they'd go about it to say such a thing. Also correct me if i'm wrong but the aim Bitwig had was to make a daw that had the best of clip based daws (Ableton) and the best of the standard linear daws (cubase, pro tools, logic, S1). A limited mindset says bitwig will as you say will never be the "one DAW for everything" and that a user should "pick the DAWs for the task", Bitwig have already failed in your way of thinking. Again see my post 5 up from yours for what i feel is a much better way of thinking. Why stop at the 80% you mentioned when you can go for a full 100%?

If people are saying i use logic and bitwig, others are saying i switch between ableton and bitwig, then obviously there's more room for improvement in bitwig. So what do bitwig need to make those improvements? Feedback from users, hence my list. If you use other daws for other tasks, why? What exactly do you use and how does it help you work faster? Why is the guy that helped make the amazing Push for bitwig going back and forth between ableton and bitwig, what are those features ableton has that makes him boot it up?
This is why i started this thread, make a list of your own whilst you're working in the other daw you use, then send it to bitwig and post it here too for us to discuss in a sharing like capacity (you say S1 is "the best for linier complex midi arrangements" ok why?)

Nobody and nothing gets to be the best or even o a platform with the best by telling themselves so early on, they'll never improve or be the best, anything is possible if you aim high, practice proper listening and understanding and work hard, all things i've seen form the bitwig team so far. And before anyone does the scan read thing and comments on this post :hihi: listening doesn't automatically mean you will act on what you've heard, listening and acting are two different things. It just means you're open to listening/feedback/change which will automatically keep you relevant.
The problem I have with your list us I actualy disagree with about half of your requests to BITWiG and don't give a hoot about a lot of the features you want, that list is personal to your needs, not a collectively agreed list (like Abletons vote for features). I would rather BITWiG did things their way, I certainly don't want them to copy any part of Cubase, as there are probably. Enter ways to. E invented (and if they were going to copy anything it should be S1 which was an evolution of Cubase in many areas).

It's posable that BITWiG and the open, modular structure may end up doing something completely revolutionary, like letting a users configure their own DAW the way they want it, which let X face if, is the only way a single DAW can be all things to all people.
X32 and 24C mixers, S88MK3, Live + PUSH 3, Osmose, RedShift 6, Pro3, S4, Tempera, Syntakt, Digitone, OP1-F, OPXY, TR-1000, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!

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SLiC wrote:
Bobby L'Avenir wrote:
SLiC wrote:Dear BITWiG

Please make Cubase!


Seriously, I have cubase 8 and used to use it when I was recording a guitar/vocal based track (I now use S1) it is the 'spreadsheet' of DAWs, it does everything pretty well (and is the best for linier complex midi arrangements).

Cubase already exists, don't make BITWiG Studio be like Cubase, I used different DAWs for different jobs, even different moods....BW is fast, fun, great with my modular...starts and finishes tracks, it replaces Live completely for me and 80% of what the more established linier DAWs do.

Sure, fix the bugs (still plenty in Cubase, check the forum!) but pick the DAWs for the task, there is not and never will be one DAW for everything...add all that stuff to BITWiG and it won't be fast and simple anymore, it will be the drop down menu heavy window heavy spreadsheet like DAW that already exists.....
Sometimes it's best to use what's becoming a lost art form properly before posting, READING. I'm not trying to be rude but i posted a comment 5 up from yours in the hope people would have a less limited mind set in this thread as people tend to scan read things, fail to understand what the topic is, then assume what the topic is based on how they think and post comments or opinions accordingly. Would it be cool for me to give you a movie review if i left the theatre after 15 mins? This will always happen though, we live in an age of distraction so people will read things lazy and still feel the need to comment when they have not properly listened (this forum is all text so listening here = reading properly and some have already switched off reading this :hihi: ).

The problem with this is that other distracted or lazy readers who would've had something worth contributing read your post and assume you actually read at least the original post (like you'd expect from a movie reviewer to have watched the whole movie) and have made a logical assessment so no need to read for themselves, so they then without using their own mind take your view point and start posting when your view point was off target because you never read/listened to the point in the first place. even worse some don't post at all, this leads to threads going waaaay of point or dying off. Please go read my post 5 up from yours, and then properly read the original post too.

Also your post makes no sense i places and has quite a lot of limiting beliefs that i for one won't accept. How on earth do you know that bitwig would be full of drop downs menus if they added more features, you don't even know how'd they'd go about it to say such a thing. Also correct me if i'm wrong but the aim Bitwig had was to make a daw that had the best of clip based daws (Ableton) and the best of the standard linear daws (cubase, pro tools, logic, S1). A limited mindset says bitwig will as you say will never be the "one DAW for everything" and that a user should "pick the DAWs for the task", Bitwig have already failed in your way of thinking. Again see my post 5 up from yours for what i feel is a much better way of thinking. Why stop at the 80% you mentioned when you can go for a full 100%?

If people are saying i use logic and bitwig, others are saying i switch between ableton and bitwig, then obviously there's more room for improvement in bitwig. So what do bitwig need to make those improvements? Feedback from users, hence my list. If you use other daws for other tasks, why? What exactly do you use and how does it help you work faster? Why is the guy that helped make the amazing Push for bitwig going back and forth between ableton and bitwig, what are those features ableton has that makes him boot it up?
This is why i started this thread, make a list of your own whilst you're working in the other daw you use, then send it to bitwig and post it here too for us to discuss in a sharing like capacity (you say S1 is "the best for linier complex midi arrangements" ok why?)

Nobody and nothing gets to be the best or even o a platform with the best by telling themselves so early on, they'll never improve or be the best, anything is possible if you aim high, practice proper listening and understanding and work hard, all things i've seen form the bitwig team so far. And before anyone does the scan read thing and comments on this post :hihi: listening doesn't automatically mean you will act on what you've heard, listening and acting are two different things. It just means you're open to listening/feedback/change which will automatically keep you relevant.
The problem I have with your list us I actualy disagree with about half of your requests to BITWiG and don't give a hoot about a lot of the features you want, that list is personal to your needs, not a collectively agreed list (like Abletons vote for features). I would rather BITWiG did things their way, I certainly don't want them to copy any part of Cubase, as there are probably. Enter ways to. E invented (and if they were going to copy anything it should be S1 which was an evolution of Cubase in many areas).

It's posable that BITWiG and the open, modular structure may end up doing something completely revolutionary, like letting a users configure their own DAW the way they want it, which let X face if, is the only way a single DAW can be all things to all people.
So you disagree with about half which by default means you agree with the other half :dog: My very reason for posting was to discuss this but at least disagree with a bit more class mate. Some people would say S1 is crap and Bitwig should never look at emulating some of the best it has to offer, how rude would it be to phrase it to you as "I don't give a hoot about you or your workfolw and bitwig should copy pro tools"? That's how you came across despite the title of the thread, then to boot you ended by giving your preference after telling me you don't give a hoot about mine :dog: :hihi:

You should check out what Dom had to say about the conception of Bitwig Studio too
9min 50 secs in, listen and if you use that qwerty keyboard again please keep it friendly and constructive, it won't cost you anything at the end of the day.
http://kaneaudio.com/podcast-episode-00 ... ms-bitwig/

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It's become something of a cliche to post a 'why this DAW isn't good enough for me so I am going to use another DAW' thread on the DAW being lefts forum...we have had lost here, there are lots on the Cubase forums to. personally I don't think we need to know why you don't like the software we all like an use, we have at hread for feature requests and an email for bugs. I am sorry if you meant well, but it can come accross the other way (bye losers....) and honestly, BITWiG is work in progress,we all know that and are in for the ride...

Good look with Cubase, for what it's worth I did the 8.5 update today and it's very nice...miss the routing, racks and clips of BITWiG though ;-)
X32 and 24C mixers, S88MK3, Live + PUSH 3, Osmose, RedShift 6, Pro3, S4, Tempera, Syntakt, Digitone, OP1-F, OPXY, TR-1000, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!

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SLiC wrote:It's become something of a cliche to post a 'why this DAW isn't good enough for me so I am going to use another DAW' thread on the DAW being lefts forum...we have had lost here, there are lots on the Cubase forums to. personally I don't think we need to know why you don't like the software we all like an use, we have at hread for feature requests and an email for bugs. I am sorry if you meant well, but it can come accross the other way (bye losers....) and honestly, BITWiG is work in progress,we all know that and are in for the ride...

Good look with Cubase, for what it's worth I did the 8.5 update today and it's very nice...miss the routing, racks and clips of BITWiG though ;-)
Its free speach man. you dont have to read or respond. I think he wanted to talk about features and see if he could get some agrement or not. You two have both a right to an opinion. You like hamburger better he is vegaterian... Lol but you get the point. no real need to say someones opinion os off topic. its just what we ourself desire and we all have an opinion. Same with what kind of movies we like or tv-shows. The argue could make it long but i think its stupid not to let anyone complain. Its their right as users and if another users want to join topic its free for them to do so. but people should have their own thoughts and other shouldnt tell them that their ideas are not good or bad. Wishes are not allways logical but some of us like certain approuches and others dont but its personal mate and his wishes might not be yours and wise versa. :)
desktop: windows 10 x64, i5 4690k, 32gb ram 1600mhz, 2x ssd 128 gb +2x3 tb, asus gtx 970, asus proz gamer motherboard, no external audiocard
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SLiC wrote:It's become something of a cliche to post a 'why this DAW isn't good enough for me so I am going to use another DAW' thread on the DAW being lefts forum...we have had lost here, there are lots on the Cubase forums to. personally I don't think we need to know why you don't like the software we all like an use, we have at hread for feature requests and an email for bugs. I am sorry if you meant well, but it can come accross the other way (bye losers....) and honestly, BITWiG is work in progress,we all know that and are in for the ride...

Good look with Cubase, for what it's worth I did the 8.5 update today and it's very nice...miss the routing, racks and clips of BITWiG though ;-)
It doesn't matter in the grand scheme but my post would only come across as you and a few others took it if you scan read it as i explained a few posts ago. People tend to do this too much which leads to miss communication. I really love bitwig and want the bitwig team to win because that means i/we win, that's call a win win. Why else would i make a list over two weeks as i said in my op and send it in to them? All companies need feeback from their customers to stay relevant, the moment your customer don't care enoguh to feedback is the moment you have to start worring about your products viability. Besides like my mum always said, if you don't ask you don't get, if you were about to board a plane and wanted a window seat you'd have no reason to complain if you didn't get one because you were too lazy to ask when you had the chance. Also i never said i'm leaving bitwig bye bye losers :hihi: far from it.
I'm clearly saying this is what i'd really like to see so i never have open cubase again or, this is what makes me work quick in cubase i'd love to see it in bitwig so i can use it exclusively, because i see it's potential and like it that much. The bugs since 1.3 pushed me back to cubase, I'll be back to bitwig but not as much as before now i realise after the two weeks back in cubase that what i listed are major workflow features that let me work much faster in cubase (with audio mostly). You or someone else might disagree and that was the point of this thread, one guy said S1 is the daw to emulate, okay, why? explain as maybe there's a better way in another daw i've not used that makes more sense, again hence the reason for this thread. Maybe someone has a great idea that's not in any daw and would work even better than how it works in cubase or logic, post it here, let's discuss it in a constructive manner.

You said yourself you just updated cubase, that was a paid update, why did you update for another fee just like i did by the way? What is it about cubase that made you update and wouldn't you like to see those select few features in bitwig so you can stick to one daw, no more dongle, no more paid updates, better customer service, quicker workflow, no more plugins crashes (for me anyway), clips, routing and racks (which i also miss as i did say in my op i miss tons from bitwig) all in one app, wouldn't you like to see this? Make you own list on what had you update cubase, post it here and lets have a chat about it. We might agree, we might disagree, what we agree on might actually make it into a future update, wouldn't that be cool?

People please don't forget that bitwig was conceived as Dom put it himself in that Dom Kane interview as a daw that a cherry picked the best of cubase, logic, ableton etc with some unique features to make it unique in it's own right too. So for me to be saying i'd also like you to cherry pick this other feature form cubase, and this other one from ableton and this one from S1 because that would really help use and love your product more is hardly out of sync with what bitwig was born from now is it? I really don't think that's like going to KFC and asking for a big mac with extra pickle :hihi:

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takaii wrote:
SLiC wrote:It's become something of a cliche to post a 'why this DAW isn't good enough for me so I am going to use another DAW' thread on the DAW being lefts forum...we have had lost here, there are lots on the Cubase forums to. personally I don't think we need to know why you don't like the software we all like an use, we have at hread for feature requests and an email for bugs. I am sorry if you meant well, but it can come accross the other way (bye losers....) and honestly, BITWiG is work in progress,we all know that and are in for the ride...

Good look with Cubase, for what it's worth I did the 8.5 update today and it's very nice...miss the routing, racks and clips of BITWiG though ;-)
Its free speach man. you dont have to read or respond. I think he wanted to talk about features and see if he could get some agrement or not. You two have both a right to an opinion. You like hamburger better he is vegaterian... Lol but you get the point. no real need to say someones opinion os off topic. its just what we ourself desire and we all have an opinion. Same with what kind of movies we like or tv-shows. The argue could make it long but i think its stupid not to let anyone complain. Its their right as users and if another users want to join topic its free for them to do so. but people should have their own thoughts and other shouldnt tell them that their ideas are not good or bad. Wishes are not allways logical but some of us like certain approuches and others dont but its personal mate and his wishes might not be yours and wise versa. :)
Well said :tu:

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askewd wrote:Bitwig is already strong enough to cater for most of my creative needs in one daw from initial ideas to full blown mixing.

However I would say that most of the suggestions on the op's initial list are good suggestions. Nothing too big - most just small but helpful work flow additions that certainly does not mean bitwig needs to 'change' into a cubase clone.
+1

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I really don't think that's like going to KFC and asking for a big mac with extra pickle :hihi:
Nice. Would be a good experiment. :)
Michael Schmalle
http://www.teotigraphix.com
Surfing on sine waves

Maschine4Bitwig - Studio, MK2, MikroMK2, MK1
http://www.teotigraphix.com/bitwig/maschine

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I disagree with the premis/title of the post, you don't have to 'leave' BITWiG if you want to use Cubase. As I said, I am a Cubase user (for about 15 years) and didn't 'leave' Cubase when I bought BITWiG, I just added another option. Either way.....gave fun, that's the point after all, to make music, not lists....I suspect Don et all know what they are doing and are actualy trying to fix the bugs and add the features that many people have been requesting since the software was introduced...I for one am not going to stop using the software altogether just because it can't do it all today, it still does plenty very very well and in some respects better than the rest.

The real question is what sort of DAW is BITWiG designed to be. Live is clearly aimed at live looping and performance and is still the best at that, it is not realy suitable for linear live recording and was never realy designed for that purpose. To me, BITWiG is more like live as there is no comping or loop recording and the audio editing/tools are basic (but ideal for EDM, which is where it excel). Cubase is still the ultimate all rounder (and what I always use for guitar/vocal recording in the studio) but when I record live (2 kids who do musical theatre for my sins!) and have 20 plus inputs, hardly any set up time and one take.....Studio One!

BITWiG replaces Live for me (although I still have Live as I use Max) and I don't think it will ever replace Cubase/S1 without loosing some of the fun and quick and dirty appeal.

Maybe time will prove me wrong, but everytime Bitwigs add a catch up feature with respect to linier DAWs, the big boys will also add more 'can't live without that' features....i
X32 and 24C mixers, S88MK3, Live + PUSH 3, Osmose, RedShift 6, Pro3, S4, Tempera, Syntakt, Digitone, OP1-F, OPXY, TR-1000, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!

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Thanks pal, more constructive comments or observations like this are very welcome :tu:

You wrote a pretty solid review i really liked a little while back, how you finding it after all all the updates since?
Ah cheers. :oops: I understand everybody has slightly different needs when it comes to a DAW so there will be no wish-list that appeals to every single person. I do feel that you & your list is coming from a similar basic place as my own though.

As to how i'm finding it now since the review...

I am VERY encouraged by the recent decision to focus on bug fixing and CPU optimisation. I hope this continues for a good few updates yet before adding any new features! I must admit my faith was wobbling a bit - but that faith is totally restored. I use BW for 2-3 client projects each week, from production to mixing and i really have no problem with BW at all, i love it infact - still get that 'excited' heart rate bump when i open it up on a fresh project :-)

My main gripe right now is that it still doesn't play nicely with Nebula/Acqua plugins - which i happen to use for 80% of my mixing work. the macros wont work, since V1 and neither Acoustica or BitWig seem to wanna nail it. :(


But yeah, other than that - totally happy and simply could now never switch back to a older clunky DAW.

perfect yet - no .... continung to move in the right direction (and fast!) YES! :tu:

Dale

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musiclover55547 wrote:I might be speaking heresy to the crowd here, but I contend that Logic / Cubase are awesome complements to Bitwig / Live. The former are great at late mixing / mastering, the latter at idea generation and early mixing.

Logic Pro X + Bitwig Sudio is less in price than either Cubase or Ableton Live Suite, respectively. Plus you get Alchemy, VCAs, a wide array of plugins including VCA Compressors and EQs that rival many third party offerings. Add the sound Library (Orchestral Content, Apple Loops, etc.), pay $200 for Logic, $250 for Bitwig, and spend the extra $100 on some more RAM.
I think that is spot on. Cubase has its strengths and Bitwig its own. I find that using both gives me two options for approaching a creative problem in very different ways. Often leads to different results...usually a good thing.
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gesslr wrote:
musiclover55547 wrote:I might be speaking heresy to the crowd here, but I contend that Logic / Cubase are awesome complements to Bitwig / Live. The former are great at late mixing / mastering, the latter at idea generation and early mixing.

Logic Pro X + Bitwig Sudio is less in price than either Cubase or Ableton Live Suite, respectively. Plus you get Alchemy, VCAs, a wide array of plugins including VCA Compressors and EQs that rival many third party offerings. Add the sound Library (Orchestral Content, Apple Loops, etc.), pay $200 for Logic, $250 for Bitwig, and spend the extra $100 on some more RAM.
I think that is spot on. Cubase has its strengths and Bitwig its own. I find that using both gives me two options for approaching a creative problem in very different ways. Often leads to different results...usually a good thing.
Yup- pretty much my point...personal I would 'personally' like Bitwig to develop in more esoteric and creative ways and not take the path most trodden; I use it like an instrument/groove box (as I did Live) and often take out just a few tracks to mix back in a linear DAW with guitar/vox/live drums etc. Works great that way right now- no problems, glass half full :D

Why leave? Why not make a big long list of all that's good with Bitwig and be happy :hug:
X32 and 24C mixers, S88MK3, Live + PUSH 3, Osmose, RedShift 6, Pro3, S4, Tempera, Syntakt, Digitone, OP1-F, OPXY, TR-1000, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!

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musiclover55547 wrote:I might be speaking heresy to the crowd here, but I contend that Logic / Cubase are awesome complements to Bitwig / Live. The former are great at late mixing / mastering, the latter at idea generation and early mixing.

Logic Pro X + Bitwig Sudio is less in price than either Cubase or Ableton Live Suite, respectively. Plus you get Alchemy, VCAs, a wide array of plugins including VCA Compressors and EQs that rival many third party offerings. Add the sound Library (Orchestral Content, Apple Loops, etc.), pay $200 for Logic, $250 for Bitwig, and spend the extra $100 on some more RAM.
Would love to use Logic, just give me the link to the PC version. :lol:

That list (I only read the first 20 or so points) makes me want to sell my Bitwig licence... :roll:

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SLiC wrote:
gesslr wrote:
musiclover55547 wrote:I might be speaking heresy to the crowd here, but I contend that Logic / Cubase are awesome complements to Bitwig / Live. The former are great at late mixing / mastering, the latter at idea generation and early mixing.

Logic Pro X + Bitwig Sudio is less in price than either Cubase or Ableton Live Suite, respectively. Plus you get Alchemy, VCAs, a wide array of plugins including VCA Compressors and EQs that rival many third party offerings. Add the sound Library (Orchestral Content, Apple Loops, etc.), pay $200 for Logic, $250 for Bitwig, and spend the extra $100 on some more RAM.
I think that is spot on. Cubase has its strengths and Bitwig its own. I find that using both gives me two options for approaching a creative problem in very different ways. Often leads to different results...usually a good thing.
Yup- pretty much my point...personal I would 'personally' like Bitwig to develop in more esoteric and creative ways and not take the path most trodden; I use it like an instrument/groove box (as I did Live) and often take out just a few tracks to mix back in a linear DAW with guitar/vox/live drums etc. Works great that way right now- no problems, glass half full :D

Why leave? Why not make a big long list of all that's good with Bitwig and be happy :hug:
I say it would be more helpful to breakdown why you don't think bitwig is good enough to mix in which is why you use another daw to do that. Biwig didn't start to be just another daw to make beats before you go back to the old linear way of working for mixdowns, this defeats the purpose of the developers concept if you listen to that Dom speaking in the Dom Kane interview he did somewhere above in a link i posted. They saw a gap, and they felt they could fill it, (and there was and still is a gap they're slowly filling up) now all they need is users to feedback why they still use other liner daws or even ableton as some of you still do so they can look at ways to cover those features in bitwig. I've said what those select few (very basic) features are for me, I don't care if they do it a more esoteric fashion like you want, as long as it's stable, professional and as fast or faster than what I'd normally use, I'm using bitwig and nothing else. So what about you? It's all good to impose limited beliefs and say bitwig will never be this and never be that (which i say is nonsense look at what they've done in 1 year) but at the end of the day if you're not feeding anything constructive back what do expect? List us your top 5 features you love to use in cubase, then your top 5 in S1, is that so much to ask?

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Yeah, I don't see why there is so much of an issue with his list. There are some bug fixes in there, some no brainer tweaks, and some subjective stuff. Even the subjective stuff is not too crazy, for example comping is one of the biggest things in that list and the devs have been planning for comping since before the release. Dom mentioned this in the original Bitwig hype thread. Same with retrospective record. If you don't agree with this or that point you can simply say why. But I think it's clearly constructive, it's just feedback for the devs, they can take it or leave it. Now that Bitwig is not so much of a noobie any more it makes sense to talk about what's going to "bring it home," and maybe that's even more helpful than just listing everything every feature you'd want in a dream daw as it usually goes with feature requests.

Saying "go back to cubase" doesn't make sense because that's clearly not a list of every feature in Cubase, and clearly there are things about Bitwig he prefers or he wouldn't be using it in the first place. He doesn't want Cubase, he wants that stuff added to Bitwig. "You don't have to just use one or the other," well actually I think most people prefer to just use one DAW if they can, there's nothing wrong with wanting one daw that works instead of constantly transferring stuff between program. In fact a lot of people are here because they are tired of Live only being good at one thing. And as far as wanting the daw to take a certain path, well we all do, all we really can do is give feedback and let the devs choose. Once before in the forum I was giving my idea about how a particular feature should work, and instead of telling me why that wouldn't work for some, someone tells me "Well you know, you can't just have everything YOUR way." Well yes, obviously. I knew that, Bobby knows that too. That kind of lecture doesn't really solve anything.

All you gotta do is take a post to say "I disagree with x because I'd rather have it this way."

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