MuTools

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:59 pm

Well, here's the thing, I have around 800 Roland Mc 909 samples, including various pitches from C1 ~ C5 mostly.

I decided to cut them into single cycles for use in MuSynth so spent all of yesterday slicing then up, then afterwards remembering they need tuning. First time I've done this, never used sampler before. So looks like I need to start again!

How do I go about tuning these single cycles? I've Googled all morning trying to search for help or a guide but can't find any useful info. Of course, there are many sites with general advice but they all leave out specifics.

I remember someone here, possibly dakkra, mentioned about retuning adventure kids waveforms from D2 to C4, would you mind explaining the proper process please.

Also, is it worth using all the various pitched samples or just the C4 ones? Would there be much variation to require the others be worth editing? And... Some samples don't have a C4 sample, can these be frequency shifted somehow?

Thanks

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 2:04 pm

If you have a single cycle waveform just drop it onto a oscillator's waveform display and done. No extra work.

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 2:09 pm

So why did dakkra, or whoever it was, repitch adv kids waves? And some of my waves require two or more cycles to be more accurate which causes a difference in pitch from shorter waves? Which is correct?

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:12 pm

Any chance of some help please

I realise single cycles are great on simple waves, but when it's a patch with a varying waveform, how can it be reduced and tuned? I find it clicks/buzzes if too long and if it's a single cycle it doesn't replicate the original patch.

I can only assume that the single cycle format is limited in its possibilities?

bibz1st · Post by **bibz1st** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:18 pm

I would find that info useful too, I havent delved into that area yet

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:21 pm

I've been meaning to learn this for a few years now but haven't had the time!

I reposted my main comments here in the Sampler forums as I suppose that's really where it belongs.

dakkra · Post by **dakkra** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:40 pm

I made a reply on your post in the Sampler Forums

Dakkra

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:45 pm

Thanks dakkra

Taifunk · Post by **Taifunk** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:34 pm

sl23 wrote:Thanks dakkra

+1
Thanks for the great explanation

sl23 wrote:Could you explain how to use this to reduce samples that appear as a random wave, as I have quite a few patches that aren't simply variations on square, sine and saw waves, but are seemingly random waves that perhaps use noise or LFO's to create the original patches.
Is it even possible to replicate these types of patches using the single cycle process?

I answer here for this
yes,you can load the waveform in the oscillator and act directly on the pitch , for a random wave you have to lower the pitch,otherwise you can also load directly the waveform into the sampler and using the loop function,this depends for what purpose should be used,any additional information helps.

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 5:25 pm

Ok Now I'm confused! Not with your comment Taifunk, which I thank you for.

I have used a VST called GTune in Ocenaudio editor to check it's frequency, it is F# = 94.83Hz. Now when I load this sample in MuSynth and play A4, GTune shows A = 220Hz, but A4 should be 440Hz? No matter what sample is used, I get 220Hz why is that?

Incidentally, the only thing active is Osc 1 and I'm using MuLab's virtual keyboard in the top right.

Taifunk · Post by **Taifunk** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:19 pm

are you using the oscillators,right?
you can load any waveform in the oscillator and is automatically tuned and logically they work in a different way from sampler,anyway speaking in an old school way just set an octave up or down in the oscillator to tune the sample and the problem is solved,without elaborating

however, now I'll check because for example on my tuner 440 is shown as A3.

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:25 pm

Don't forget that there is a ambiguity in music world about which one is middle C: C3 or C4. That's why MuLab / MUX Vst have a preference setting for that. Note that this preference is only related to displaying, not processing. Middle C is note number 60 always is ~261.6 Hz.

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:53 pm

@Taifunk:
I got that ok thanks, but you still need to tune the sample before adding to an oscillator, which, yes, that's my purpose here to create loads of MuSynth patches. Although it plays ok within the Oscillator, each octave sample (C1, C2, C3, C4, C5) gives different pitches despite playing the same note. Is this simply down to limitations in sampling?
So do I really need to do anything to single cycles at all? But what about multi-cycles? Is that too much hassle to bother with?

@MuTools:
I remember you saying that before actually! Thanks for the reminder.

Taifunk · Post by **Taifunk** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 9:00 pm

mutools wrote:Don't forget that there is a ambiguity in music world about which one is middle C: C3 or C4. That's why MuLab / MUX Vst have a preference setting for that. Note that this preference is only related to displaying, not processing. Middle C is note number 60 always is ~261.6 Hz.

Thanks Jo, in fact I do not worry about that,there is no doubt.

sl23 wrote:@Taifunk:
I got that ok thanks, but you still need to tune the sample before adding to an oscillator, which, yes, that's my purpose here to create loads of MuSynth patches. Although it plays ok within the Oscillator, each octave sample (C1, C2, C3, C4, C5) gives different pitches despite playing the same note. Is this simply down to limitations in sampling?
So do I really need to do anything to single cycles at all? But what about multi-cycles? Is that too much hassle to bother with?

if I understand correctly, no need of multi-cycles unless you intend to work with the mfo or the sampler using the multisamples.
for example you want to re-create a Tb 303 bass patch in musynth,the best option is to use the single cycle,cut the sample and load in the oscillator tuning the pitch to have the same pitch as the original,without worrying about the rest.
but if you want to create something that uses long samples is best to use the sampler whith the multisample,otherwise it would require a lot of work for you to do the same with other techniques.
help me if I have missed something.

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 9:19 pm

I was afraid of that! But Once I've done the easy stuff I may try the other harder waves to see if they can be approximated in MuSynth. Actually, MuSynth doesn't have an MFO does it? So it'll have to be a Mux? I was hoping to keep all these within the MuSynth presets for simplicity when browsing the patches and a uniform front panel etc. Oh well... see how I get on, even if I can only do half of them it's still another 400 odd presets for MuSynth!

MuTools

KVR Audio

Single cycle waveforms