KVR Audio

exmatproton · Post by **exmatproton** » Wed Jul 06, 2016 1:38 pm

Ingonator wrote:
recursive one wrote:
Ingonator wrote:
recursive one wrote:
exmatproton wrote: No volume or pan knobs at the filters (again, using the matrix for these basic functions??????)
Indeed, how do I balance the output of two filters if they are running in parallel? Only via mod matrix?

Generally I agree with all exmatproton said.
The "Volume" filter Drive mode allows setting the output volume of the filter with the "Drive" knob which is quite useful when using teh filters in parallel mode.
Thanks, but what if I want to use other filter drive mode?
Combining both the output volume seting and anotehr drive mode is not possible in the same filter.
Anyway you could still use another Drive in one filter while you use the Volume Drive mode in the other one to set a volume balance of both filters.
FWIW multiple Drive modes are also available in the FX section

BTW i do not really comment on if the current solution is perfect i just tell what is possible at the moment...

I rest my case.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:23 pm

recursive one wrote:Yeah, I see, thanks. But is it at least possible to have filter output volume as a target in the modmatrix? Selecting "constant" as the source and setting the mod amount could probably be a workaround (I'm not at my DAW now).

At the moment there is no filter output volume parameter as a mod destination but the Filter Drive parameters for both filters are alraedy available there. If you set the Drive mode to "Volume" you could modulate the output volume of a filter (or both) which could be interesting.

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 4:20 pm

I hope the release is before the month ends!
Please!

Gosh · Post by **Gosh** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 4:23 pm

Cinebient wrote:I hope the release is before the month ends!
Please!

if you are happy with the beta you know you can already buy it...!?
https://www.tone2.com/html/icarus.html

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 4:33 pm

Gosh wrote:
Cinebient wrote:I hope the release is before the month ends!
Please!
if you are happy with the beta you know you can already buy it...!?
https://www.tone2.com/html/icarus.html

But i could use a voucher on best service and save 30 bucks

Not that i don't think it's not worth the full price but it's nice to save a few bucks if possible.

gentleclockdivider · Post by **gentleclockdivider** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 4:49 pm

I just can't fathom why they are still putting out these fugly scanline rendered gui's ,straight from the nineties .
I don't have anything against 3D renders , but adding a few omnilights /scanline render will not yield great results .

Gosh · Post by **Gosh** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:03 pm

Cinebient wrote:
Gosh wrote:
Cinebient wrote:I hope the release is before the month ends!
Please!
if you are happy with the beta you know you can already buy it...!?
https://www.tone2.com/html/icarus.html
But i could use a voucher on best service and save 30 bucks
Not that i don't think it's not worth the full price but it's nice to save a few bucks if possible.

i see... (and have also just received the mail from bestservice)

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Jul 16, 2016 3:28 am

[DELETED]

Astralv · Post by **Astralv** » Sat Jul 16, 2016 3:44 am

I got the e-mail with the voucher but the Icarus is not on the list, or is it?

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat Jul 16, 2016 6:02 am

TheoM wrote:so before i go and read 103 pages, to those who have used it, how does it compare to waldorf hardware wavetable synths? Does it sound as good as them overall? I have a particular affinity for their sound, but the good ones are expensive s/h.

Hardware wavetable is still something i don't really have except for the limited options in the virus ti.

I presume like all tone 2 synths the cpu is very acceptable?

Cheers

So did you check the demo (= public beta) yorself yet? IMO this would be teh best option to see if you like it or not
The CPU use of Icarus usually should not be a problem (of course this also highly depends on which and/or how many features you use). FWIW i had use Icarus on an old Core 2 Quad Q6600 CPU without any audio dropouts even with the most complex patches.

Tone2 Icarus sounds great on it's own, offers tons of features (several i do not really see in other synths in the same way) and i love it (got the Beta since some months). It also offers lots of features not included in any of the Waldorf synths (within e.g. Oscs, Osc Morph modes, filters, Unison modes etc.). It was never planned to be an emulation of and/or a replacement for the Waldorf synths and those got their own unique combination of sound and features.
If there is any hardware synth that was used for an inspiration for some filter (especially teh Hypersaw modes...) it is a Virus TI (and Markus from Tone2 had bought my Virus TI MkI desktop last year...).

Of course besides other things like e.g. the filters (and those ara already quite different in the different Waldorf plugins and also some of the hardware) an important one is that Icarus does not include all the wavetables from the Waldorf synths which is already a big problem for replicating the same sounds. Of course you could try to sample all teh waveforms from those wavetables and rebuild them in in the wavetable editor of Icarus (it could also import single cycle waveforms from WAV files). You could also record a wavetable sweep and import it in Icarus by Resynthesis. That is how i imported some of the original PPG Wave wavetables (from the first 31) from which i only used a few in Icarus so far and someties just single waveforms. AFAIK those original PPG Wave 2 wavetables are the only ones that at the moment are not under some kind of copyright. With the other wavetables from the Waldorf synths this could cause bigger problems.
For example the 100+ new wavetables that Wolfgang Palm had created for PPG Wave 3.V (not the older 2.V...) do not seem to be included in any other Waldorf plugin yet.

Again concerning the Waldorf filters those are quite different in the plugins like e.g. Largo, Nave and PPG Wave 3.V (and also in the old PPG 2.V it is slightly different to 3.V) and also those of Microwave XT, Microwave 1 and Wave seem to be quite different to those in e.g. Q, MicroQ or Blofeld (some of the Microwave XT filters are unique anyway and in that way not included in any plugin yet...). The real analog filters in e.g. Microwave 1, Wave and Q+ are a special case too and those are not emulated in any of teh Waldorf plugins yet. Maybe you could choose the 2 Curtis filter modes in Icarus to come close to those in Microwave 1 or Wave but it does not seem to model exactly the same CEM chips (CEM 3389 in the Microwave 1, later the CEM 3387 that was used in the huge Waldorf Wave synth). The "LP Butter 24dB" analog filter model in Icarus (seems to be based on the Saurus 24dB LPF) is closer to a Moog than to a Curtis/CEM (like in Microwave 1, Wave and PPG Wave 2) or the SSM 2044 filter in the PPG Wave 2.2/2.3.
The PPG Wave 2 (before the 2.2/2.3) used a CEM 3320 comparable to those in some Oberheim OB series synths and the Prophet 5 Rev3 (Rev1+2 seemed to be SSM 2040). Maybe the Curtis filter mode in Icraus could be closer to those than to the filtres in e.g. Microwave/Wave and later PPG Wave models (while i do not have the original synths for comparison here).
Concerning the analog filter in Q+ it seems to be similar to the X-Pole filter box and seems to be an own design by Waldorf (like in e.g. the multimode filter in the Pulse 2 that is an own design by Waldorf too).
Not to forget that except the PPG mode in the Q and Blofeld the digtal filters in Largo, Blofeld, Q, MicroQ and also Microwave 2/XT are not modeled on any specific analog filter but are own designs by Waldorf. This is also true for the famous Comb filters in the Q and later the Blofeld (and Largo) while i do not think that the Comb filters in Icarus do sound really similar and got their own sound there.

IMO it is best to judge Icarus based on it's own sound and features and not always compare it to all other existing wavetable synths which at the end is quite pointless anyway like lots of other comparisons here at KVR seem to be...
Thoretically Icarus has most of the features to replace the Waldorf synths but you still could get into problems replicating certain sounds. At the end you have to decide on your own which you prefer or not. Personally i decided to simply use both Icarusn and the Waldorf synths which seems to be the best option IMO...

I also got an Novation UltraNova and in several ways Icarus could be quite similar to it (UltraNova got wavetables too but no custom wavetables support) but again it is no proper replacement. The "Density" feature in the UltraNova Oscs could act similar to the Hypersaw Unison modes in Icarus (in both synths this works with all waveforms, not just a Sawtooth). The "VSync" feature in the UltraNova oscillators (it got 3 Oscs too like Icarus and also two filters) also seems to be somehow comparable to the Sync in the corresponding Osc Morph modes in Icarus. Like with the Sync in Icarus the "VSync" seems to use another "virtual oscillator" for the Sync and not one of teh 3 main Oscs.

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:15 pm

The thing i miss most here (as with many other plug-ins too) is that i can´t set the midi channel input. I would like to play severeal instances...each on it´s own midi channel via a Seaboard Rise. Logic seems to suck to filter midi channels out of instruments which doesn´t support it.
O.k. i figured out how to do it in Logic (just missed the "hidden" auto demix option in the project setting).
So everythingis fine

Muziksculp · Post by **Muziksculp** » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:48 pm

Hi,

Is Icarus going to be officially released this month ?

Muziksculp · Post by **Muziksculp** » Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:32 pm

Hi,

I got an email today from Tone2, stating that Icarus will be officially released in early August !

Looking forward to the official release.

Cheers,
Muziksculp

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:01 pm

Muziksculp wrote:Hi,

I got an email today from Tone2, stating that Icarus will be officially released in early August !

Looking forward to the official release.

Cheers,
Muziksculp

A bit too late then!

exmatproton · Post by **exmatproton** » Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:33 pm

Beta 3 is released. I think it is a great update. Pitch (semi and fine) are added. As are some handy (small) UI changes.

changelog:

New features:

- Added new patches
- New Resynthesis mode "Easy create patch: Resynthesis + PingPong Loop 100%"
- New Resynthesis mode "Easy create patch: Resynthesis + PingPong Loop 50%"
- New Resynthesis mode "Easy create patch: Resynthesis + Repeating Loop"
- Some additional effect templates
- Tool->Copy current FX to FX1/2/3
- Tool->Swap FX1/2/3 and FX1/2/3
- Next to the matrix semitones now can also be accessed with 'Unison Mode->Semi'
- Next to the matrix pitch now can also be accessed with 'Unison Mode->Pitch'

Enhancements:

- Reworked all factory patches
- Enhanced the design of diodes
- Selected tabs are now blue instead of dark
- Osciallators, which are switched to off are greyed out
- Enhanced interpolation to reduce crackles with modhweel, pitchwheel and aftertouch
- Replaced Flanger und Stereo Flanger with a better one
- Slightly enhanced sound of degrader
- Added parameter smoothing for osc volume, osc pan and EQ
- Templates are sorted to the end of the category list
- Slightly enhanced sound of EQ
- Matrix slots 1-18 have been renamed to A/B/C 1-6
- Prevented a long processing time which happened when a huge wav file was selected
- Renamed some morphmodes to make them properly fit to the box
- Colors of wavetable editor in second instance now are the same as the first one

Bug fixes:

- Several minor fixes
- Fixed a small bug in the patch browser
- Fixed a bug with midi program changes
- Mousewheel has been deactivated for osc1 wavetable selector
- Fixed wrong colors on Mac

Tone2 will release Icarus - 3D WaveTable Synthesizer