MuTools

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:02 am

I think Michael L has a good idea there, showing info about a module in a window would be useful for many users. Sort of a built in manual.

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:05 am

Michael L wrote:1. A window next to the racks that shows enough info about a module, preset, and feature when you roll over it;

Kind of integrated help like in Live, you mean? There is a related note on the wishlist, indeed.

2. A basic-to-advanced tutorial sequence with a downloadable project or preset for each, using existing MuTools and user videos or Demos.

That's what i tried to do with the MuLab 7 Basic Intro video. I agree there should be more such videos. Time...

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Dec 17, 2016 4:20 pm

jo ill just ask this. what do you do this for? warm fuzzy group hugs where everybody is happy for you or for profit? simple question. i think profit will dictate that you move into uncomfortable territory for a while at least. you need to think in a different way to turn your empire into a profit making machine.

Nychthemeron · Post by **Nychthemeron** » Sat Dec 17, 2016 5:28 pm

You could also just reply to the thread, make a suggestion and respect everyone's replies in stead of trying to insult people

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Dec 17, 2016 8:17 pm

are you talking to me?

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 12:26 am

I think so yeah, need another hug

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:54 am

solipsvs wrote:jo ill just ask this. what do you do this for? warm fuzzy group hugs where everybody is happy for you or for profit? simple question.

Simple question, but quite limited multiple-choice, imho. I'm not asking for warm fuzzy hugs. Did you see any post of me asking for that? Which post, which sentence? Maximizing profit is not my goal either. At the contrary, i have a natural aversion of cold-hearted marketing and business. Maybe that's a disadvantage in my case as indie app dev but i can't reprogram my dna / cultural timestamp. It took me a lot of lifetime to understand that respectful win-win deals are very ok, and that's the kind of business i go for.

i think profit will dictate that you move into uncomfortable territory for a while at least. you need to think in a different way to turn your empire into a profit making machine.

My work is a combination of my passion for sound, music and technology, creative pleasure, being independent, ...
Of course i must make enough income to be able to survive, continue R&D and grow MuTools' products.
I hope/believe that creative progress and business progress can go hand in hand.
Doing my best to optimize that combination.

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:10 am

well be careful that you dont have a knee jerk reaction to me personally because im a baaaaad man who only cares about money and not about feelings... ok man i dont think what i say has any value here even tho its laced with the truth. dont worry im only making it sound terrible. its actually a really nice world out there where everybody tries to get along for the most part and nobody needs to strategize to make a fair profit. profit grows on trees dont you know! it just asks you if it can jump in your wallet. no need for any of this im on about

Nychthemeron · Post by **Nychthemeron** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:30 am

Yes. You're that guy from Taxi Driver, right?

Nychthemeron · Post by **Nychthemeron** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:33 am

sl23 wrote:I think so yeah, need another hug

Oh and of course this

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:23 pm

no im ok, dont need hugs. less hugs, more strategy. jo needs profit. schoolgirls arent helping.

jo, you are obviously an agreeable guy with interesting visions for music technology. you offer what 99% cant or wont. NOBODY will have a problem with you making more money from the same product, or conforming to market norms in order to profit. YOU DESERVE profit, no matter what the schoolgirls say. are you aware that a lot of the buying public will equate higher price with quality. and then when they test your help desk and find good service they will be sure of it. and your reputation will grow. and you will have the budget to hire pros or at least more of a budget to make it all work the way you see it working (of course a lot of your current customers might be less than happy? you could grandfather them in? they built your company right?)

there are such a thing as profit haters in this world. profit is not an evil thing. and if you put the effort in, then you deserve a comfortable budget. if you feel like helping your fellow man, you can do it easier from a vantage point and with a budget. would it make you feel good to make a bunch of money and then donate to something that speaks to you personally? how will you do that with no profit strategy?

or maybe you would like to donate your time to all the low budget musicians out there? hmm seems like that can be done. this by the way is probably the nature of the market... low budget musicians looking for a cheap platform who become defensive when someone attempts to address the issue of profit.

schoolgirls need to be told what to do. if you dont hoot your own horn then they wont be sure of your market position. are you a leader? im afraid thats what they are looking for. good thing you have professionals who can help you. if you wish. or you can simply strategize yourself (filling up yet more time that you... dont have? dunno)

a path seems to reveal its self as obvious upon inspection of the circumstances and your assets and your wishes.

Taifunk · Post by **Taifunk** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:02 am

solipsvs wrote:no im ok, dont need hugs. less hugs, more strategy. jo needs profit. schoolgirls arent helping.

Ok,I'm a sound designer, not a marketing expert,anyway I do not need a master's degree in marketing to tell you that you have a really bad strategy IMO.
Sorry but as mutools user and kvr member I'm a little tired of seeing every subject hijacked here.
I think no one here needs or ask for hugs and I do not see any schoolgirls.
There are many professionals here, maybe you do not see them,are you familiar with the privacy?
A serious pro. do not go around with a megaphone to tell all "I'm a professionals"
Professionals or not-professionals,I see only serious people here who express their opinion with a better tone and clear words,
this is a bad thing for you? It is so hard to do the same for you? you know the assertiveness?
In each thread you talk about what Mulab needs,what Jo need,strategy and other strange things,everything and the opposite of everything,ok,but I do not see the point.
How do you know what Jo need?how do you know what the other people need?
Jo told you in several posts what to do to help mutools,but I see that you are doing just the opposite,why?
Do you really think that using an arrogant and offensive attitude helps?
Forgive me,but since you're talking about serious things,I would understand the point of your posts.

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:14 am

Didn't take you long to go back to your old ways John, did it? Shame, what you say makes sense, but you seem bitter that Jo won't agree with you?

I know exactly how you feel, I've been in your position couple times where no one will listen, but then I realise I'm wasting my time trying to explain my pov to people who simply don't get it. I even got the abuse, which, at first made me a little bitter. Now, he seems to be ignoring my posts? Then I realise its not worth it, I'll just keep my opinions to myself from now, it's the only way.

Mulab is a great app, Jo has his own vision which is given influence by us users, but really he seems to have his own goals because he has his own ideals.

Let it go... You'll just end up getting yourself wound up again and you'll appear the bad guy, just as I am!

You're either doing this on purpose to waste people's time, especially Jo''s for some kind of revenge for banning you, or you just need to let it go buddy, you won't make a dent, that much is clear. At least not with that tone.

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:39 am

Yeah, I'm new to mulab, so I'm not really privy to it's forum social history. From an outsider's point of view, however, even though these arguments may have merit from a "product success" perspective, to think that it's the right point of view necessarily strikes me as somewhat narrow minded.

There is always effort in dealing with a different market segment and you cannot necessarily map a linear function from the felt annoyance to that effort. Maybe it's only 10% more effort to go down such a path, I don't think so, but that's just an arbitrary number, it may feel like 200% more effort just for having to deal with the market.

I've encountered the kinds of attitudes presented above in this thread quite frequently among entrepreneurs. They often seem downright confused that someone may want to cultivate a "lifestyle business" where they are able to continue to do the things that they like to do, rather than spend their time growing a business where they have to do the things that they never wanted to do in the first place, e.g., hiring and managing people.

I'm not on the "schoolgirl" side of the fence and I can appreciate that sometimes developers don't want to jump on that side of the fence. Yes, it's going to be a tradeoff, but perhaps what's wanted is more discussion from those of us on this side about what will compel us to continue to support mulab, e.g., pay for version 8 upgrades. Perhaps the biggest concern is attrition with respect to the existing market rather than tapping new markets. Maybe the goal is having enough sales to make a living without having to give up the day to day tasks that are pleasurable?

My, decidedly non-professional, advice, ask more questions and give less "professional advice."

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 2:05 am

if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice as the lyric goes.

LOL at those who dont get what im saying or find it offensive before anything has been accomplished... its like a dog thats afraid of a bath

thanks sl23 for your perception and caring

cmon everybody! time for a BIIIIIG group hug and a photo so we can all remember this moment in time... HEY! lets all meet back here in 10 years! what do ya say fellas?

MuTools

KVR Audio

What genres of music you do with MuLab?