MUnison

[goldglob]

I was just comparing MUnison with Waves Doubler. I know, no comparison really, MUnison does much more, but just looking at the detuned voices...I noticed that with Waves Doubler I can raise or lower the 'detune' (above or below the direct signal pitch) whereas with MUnison it's just lowering it. Is there a way to raise the 'detune' in MUnison....is 'detune' in these sort of plugs usually down rather than up? Would it be worth making it possible to go up or down in MUnison?

[DarkStar]

Turn the 'Gain' up. Or turn the Dry/Wet down. Or both.

[goldglob]

Turn the 'Gain' up. Or turn the Dry/Wet down. Or both.

I'm sorry, I guess I wasn't very clear. I'm talking about raising the pitch of the 'detune', not the gain or vol of it....like say 5 cents above.

[DarkStar]

Nope, you were clear - I didn't read properly.

I can change the voices up/down by 12 semitones here; but I guess that is not what you mean. Can you post a screenshot indicating the controls you mean?

[jmg8]

I guess they are referring to the per voice pitches not the global pitch. I will take a look onto it and get you an answer.

[jmg8]

OK so I just read the manual. It says that the voices are pitched above and bellow the base pitch.
So what made you think it only went lower?

[Svama]

Here is Waves Doubler. He means the gain of the voices, which have different volumes!

[goldglob]

Svama, no not the gain, I mean the pitch, up or down in cents, see the detune column in your Doubler pic, the -7 is cents but it can be set +.
Just to clarify, I'm talking about just the detune function (or indeed the 'unison' function) in MUnison, not the harmonizer.
Turn the harmonizer off.
In the pitch panel the depth parameter lowers the pitch of the voices (no need for screenshot I hope..I'm a bit slow with all that).
jmg8, yes the info says re depth..."100% makes them be detuned by a semitone up and down" but I'm just hearing them down.
I have indeed always thought most doubler/detuners work like this but then noticed in Waves Doubler you can set the 'detune' up or down (like say +6 cents or -7 cents etc). I'm not saying I desperately want that, in fact it makes sense to me that the detuning is under pitch (sorta keeping the reference on top) but then seeing it in Waves Doubler I just wondered what Vojtech (or anyone) thought about this.

[jmg8]

I have just ran a single sine wave through MUnison and I can clearly hear detuning both higher and lower then the base pitch. Could you please copy and paste your settings here and ill take a look for you.

[goldglob]

Thanks jmg8 but I've just been looking at a lot of different settings. It seems that if the depth is below about 0.20 (20 cents) the detune I hear is just lower pitch (and my initial tests had depth around 6 cents, which is where I'd normally be setting it). Above 20 cents I can start to hear a higher pitch creeping in, but then it settles down to lower again. Good way to test is to turn the delay time up to 1000ms...gives you time to hear it all. And the more voices I add the more the up/down thing rocks back and forth but this still only happens when depth is above 20 cents or so. Mucking about with other parameters like Delay Shape and Speed etc changes the sound (as you'd expect) but doesn't seem to change this up/down ratio.

[jmg8]

What signal are you testing it on? I'll take another look for you. Also how many voices are you using? It quicker to just copy and paste the settings here in future, do you know how to do that?

[goldglob]

Testing with a few long guitar notes (single notes). Started off with just one voice then added voices (in MUnison)..like I said adding voices just increases the up/down to up/down/up/ down etc, but only when depth above about 20cents. I do know how to copy and paste settings (would have to dig out my note about it) but no point here really because I'm not just testing one setting. I appreciate your interest and if you want to look at it along the guidelines I have outlined I'd love to hear your conclusions. It seems to me that Vojtech has designed it such that detune only happens downwards for the usual low depth settings but has allowed a bit of up/down weirdness at more 'creative' settings.

[jmg8]

Well to save you digging though your notes just simply use the copy button (bottom left of the plugin) and then paste it here.
Anyway you may be right. Maybe with low voice/depth values the plugin prioritizes lower detune and then as you increase, it introduces higher detuning. Not sure.
I'll take another look at it.

[jmg8]

OK so I just tested it and I can hear what you are describing. With delay set to 100% I can clearly hear the different pitches. I set the voices to 2 and slowly increased the depth parameter. I can only here lower pitches added until the depth gets to around .13 then I can here also higher pitches too.
Maybe this is just part of the design, maybe Vojtech will confirm for us?
But out of interest, why? is this a problem?
It is only really happening at very low values.
Not sure I'm correct with this statement but, maybe.....pitching lower has less artefacts than pitching higher? so ergo there is a preference to pitching lower first.

[goldglob]

Good one, yep you're hearing what I'm hearing. No, not really a problem. The thing is, the way I like to use this doubling/detune thing is at low depths, really subtle, so that's how I was making the comparison. I've just been playing around some more comparing the two plugins like that (low depth), wondering if Doubler's positive cent values gives it any advantage. All I can conclude is not really, because MUnison's extra parameters (variate, shape, speed) in all four panels (Depth, Stereo, Formants and Delay) can really give the sound a lot of subtle movement, clarity and interest....and then there's the modulators! Of course the high (necessary) latency of MUnison makes Doubler better for just plugging in and playing live, but yeah, MUnison is amazing (no surprise there!)