Bitwig Octatrack workflow

[(Sinelanguage)]

Hey!

So I've been wrestling for a little while with setting up some Octatrack style workflow within Bitwig. Big Octatrack fan but had to sell it a little while back and been looking to set up Bitwig to replicate some of its functions with the added bonus of an Octatrack workflow with beautiful VST effects. I'm also using an apc 40 mk 2 as the hardware interface for this setup.

Firstly I guess it's worth mentioning that we all find a workflow with the Octatrack that works for us so don't worry I'm not trying to replicate any of the advanced sampling capabilities, what I loved about it was the fast use of trig locks and scenes for improvising and live performance.

I've just found (at least conceptually at this stage, but it may require an additional controller) that Bitwig's step mod device can replicate trig locking effect parameters (Bitwig or third party if nested correctly)

And that Bitwig's clips and crossfader can work suitably to replicate how Octatrack's crossfader can move between effect settings on various tracks at once (if all tracks on scene A in Bitwig has the same instrument and effects chain as it's counterpart on scene B, for example, then crazy effects can be added to scene B, and then clips playing on scene A can be changed, effects adjusted, before a triumphant crossfade from B to A)

As I've been setting all this up with the 8 device knobs on the right of the APC controlling Bitwig macros connected to parameters in the effects chain of the currently selected track, it's really dawned on me that so much of the Octatrack's power lies in it's immediacy.

For example while in scene A, all you need to do to affect scene B parameters for that track is hold the scene b button and then tweak away. In my current setup, changing between tracks to then adjust the parameters on that track is surprisingly disorienting.

So my question is, given the limits of Bitwig's midi learn and Api, is there a way to switch between controlling one set of parameters and another set on a different track with the click of a button? I wondered if the button modulators could allow this somehow but also aware I could be up against a limit of Bitwig.

So say I have track 1-8 on scene a, track 9-16 on scene b, track 1 identical to track 9, track 2 identical to track 10 and so on. Then the above could allow me to have a button labelled scene a, which when held down while track 1 is selected, would allow the 8 device knobs on APC to affect track 1 macros and a button labelled scene b which when held down would allow 8 device knobs on APC to affect macros of track 9.

Should have mentioned I am using the APC 40 script from Moss, but using macros to affect the device chain in a custom way. Would also be interested if this is possible only if specifically scripted (i don't have the skills but would be good to know) and if there are any workarounds anyone could think of, maybe via a more advanced controller (I.e with several separate banks per knobs)

Many apologies if this goes over everyone's heads! I've just had a few too many late nights on this and would like confirmation if it's not gonna happen. Would also be good to know if this would be possible in Ableton, despite my continued journeying into Bitwig fanboy territory.

And thanks for any attempts to make sense of what I'm trying to do!

Cheers

[brownerthanu]

Tldr summary?

Edit: okay i see the question now. I think you could do at least some this with a controller script and a well-organized project.

You could potentially crowdsource money for a script from one of the script developers. Open source bounties are a thing. Another idea might be to start a little group of people who want to learn to write/edit scripts (me included) and support one another in bootstrapping our scripting skills. I know Javascript, but I don't know the API. Let me know if this interests you.

[brownerthanu]

Tldr summary?

Edit: okay i see the question now. I think you could do at least some this with a controller script and a well-organized project.

If there are other people who are interested in adding that functionality, you could potentially crowdsource money for a script from one of the script developers. Open source bounties are a thing. Another idea might be to start a little group of people who want to learn to write/edit scripts (me included) and support one another in bootstrapping our scripting skills. I know Javascript, but I don't know the API. Let me know if this interests you.

[(Sinelanguage)]

Hi brownerthanu, thanks for the reply, a few things in there I hadn't thought of.

I'm definitely interested in learning the API (spent a couple of days watching some videos and doing some code academy a while back but nothing else so I'd consider myself a complete beginner) I guess I've always been concerned the music making would take a substantial back seat though and I wonder if it's how I best wanna use my time (amazed how long I've spent engaged in 'music' trying to set up Bitwig and APC the way I want it, to realise what I'm doing is not music!)

Also after I posted this topic I stumbled upon Midi Translator Pro, seems it converts midi messages between your controller and software and can add a lot of extra functionality to controllers, perhaps this could be a more immediate way for those of us wanting to get deeper into Bitwig controller customisation than learning the API. For example it looks like you can add shift functionality, get pads to light up under specific conditions etc.

However I don't know enough about Midi or API to see what the drawbacks would be. Any thoughts?

[brownerthanu]

Yeah the potential timesink is definitely a barrier to me, psychologically. No matter how much hype it gets, coding is not a fun activity for many people, myself included. I wish it was. Still, I have a feeling that it might be worth it to have a customized instrument.

[pdxindy]

I'm no coder and have no interest to spend my time trying to do that sort of stuff... I hope the Bitwig userbase keeps growing so more people do interesting stuff with scripts and controller gear.

Were I trying to have more hands on control like with an Elektron box (I've got 2 Elektron boxes), I'd use multiple controllers together. Don't know what Push 1 is going for used these days, but maybe 2 of them if they could both be used at once... or a used Push 1 with the apc40 since you have that.

With multiple controllers, one does not need to switch between different modes so much. So given my non-coding skills and what is available, that is the direction I would go

[brownerthanu]

Good point on the multiple controllers.

[(Sinelanguage)]

Yeah I've spent some time thinking along those lines but I'm using a vaio canvas (like a quad core surface) which only has 2 USB ports, and I've tried a powered hub but I found controllers were unpredictable and parameters would skip without input. Hence the search for a super controller so the other USB is free for my audio interface. Of course there's a touchscreen on the vaio and I can offload some duties to that but it's no substitute for physical controllers.

Cheers for the input though, I realised using my analog keys as the sound card I could still send 5 pin midi through it's port to the computer, so that could be one way to go.

Also been thinking of getting a push since I'm within the 30 days I have to send back my apc 2 for a trade but i feel that would allow less customisation than the APC, really hard to know how you're gonna gel with something until it's in front of you.

Anyway I'm gonna try out midi translator pro in the next few days so will post if I find it's a good work around incase that helps anyone else stumbling across this post.

[pdxindy]

Yeah I've spent some time thinking along those lines but I'm using a vaio canvas (like a quad core surface) which only has 2 USB ports, and I've tried a powered hub but I found controllers were unpredictable and parameters would skip without input.

Don't know if it would make a difference, but Elektron makes a USB hub specifically for their boxes. It uses "Multi TT technology" (whatever that is) and is supposed to be reliable for having multiple devices on one port. I have enough USB ports that I have not had to try it.