Next Propellerhead Reason upgrade (9.5) to include VST support

[KarmaShaman]

Do you read sometimes what you are wrighting???

No I don't.

Do you ever consider spell-checking?

[keel]

Anosou, please fix that space bar stealing when VST gui is open for next beta or at least in final 9.5. That is real deal breaker, just like that automatically returning playing cursor thing. Two very small things, but real workflow killers. Really. Annoying stuff. These are important. Thanks for listening

[KarmaShaman]

Anosou, please fix that space bar stealing when VST gui is open for next beta or at least in final 9.5. That is real deal breaker, just like that automatically returning playing cursor thing. Two very small things, but real workflow killers. Really. Annoying stuff. These are important. Thanks for listening

Propellerhead staff have never listened to customers requests before, what makes you think that's going to change with the existing employees?

[chk071]

One question: What do you consider "listening to customers"? Reading every post here, and implementing every little thing they read? What kind of DAW do you expect as a result? A Frankenstein DAW, with a feature list as long as the chinese wall, everything put together, without a plan or a concept, because you just listened to what every single user requested? And when should this DAW you're asking for be finished? Never? Seriously, get a grip. It won't be that way, and it won't work that way. And you, as a single user, are not the most important thing in the world for them, or for other companies either. Who buys a DAW for things you request anyway. I buy a DAW for the things it has to offer. Now. Not next month, or next year.

[aMUSEd]

Any MIDI processing VSTs aren't supported at this point.

Oh my, my suspicion has become reality.
It is kind of obvious doesn't it? If they support midi plugins, there are plenty of VST which will nock Reason players out. So, now the business will shift and every Rack Extension developer you know will start bringing MIDI plugins. It will be the same thing all over again. You will see Reason users start asking Propellerhead for Midi plugins support for 16 to 20 years. Let the Midi player Re sellers take place that will be the game now. It is kind of funny at this point with this company. Always half baked.

Don't be silly, that is just daft. I mean no offence, but I do have higher expectations of you.

What, in your opinion, is the reason then why they don't support VST midi plugins? It's the first time i hear of a host which doesn't do so.

Logic - hasn't for a long time - slightly improved in latest version in that it has a specific MFX format now but still not ideal as even plugins like Reaktor don't come in MFX versions

[KarmaShaman]

One question: What do you consider "listening to customers"? Reading every post here, and implementing every little thing they read? What kind of DAW do you expect as a result? A Frankenstein DAW, with a feature list as long as the chinese wall, everything put together, without a plan or a concept, because you just listened to what every single user requested? And when should this DAW you're asking for be finished? Never? Seriously, get a grip. It won't be that way, and it won't work that way. And you, as a single user, are not the most important thing in the world for them, or for other companies either. Who buys a DAW for things you request anyway. I buy a DAW for the things it has to offer. Now. Not next month, or next year.

Uh... VST? And how many years has that taken ?

And let's not forget, this is a company that shut down their user forum, the very place where customers could provide valuable insights into what consumers are wanting.

[chk071]

One question: What do you consider "listening to customers"? Reading every post here, and implementing every little thing they read? What kind of DAW do you expect as a result? A Frankenstein DAW, with a feature list as long as the chinese wall, everything put together, without a plan or a concept, because you just listened to what every single user requested? And when should this DAW you're asking for be finished? Never? Seriously, get a grip. It won't be that way, and it won't work that way. And you, as a single user, are not the most important thing in the world for them, or for other companies either. Who buys a DAW for things you request anyway. I buy a DAW for the things it has to offer. Now. Not next month, or next year.

Uh... VST? And how many years has that taken ?

As far as i'm concerned, "people" were pretty split in terms of requesting VST. Personally, i still think that it is generally a bad idea, because Propellerhead push Reason on a market which is pretty crowded, and lightyears ahead in terms of implementation, and features. And, especially when they leave features like Midi out out now, and there are issues with keyboard focus, and god knows what, it will be very tough for them. Not to talk about the redundancy of RE's now (i'm 99% sure it will be that way), or the incompatibility of VST with their CV and routing options. See, we pretty much have the situation now, and see what happens if you "listen to the users" (at least to the ones who don't seem to have an idea). I don't see much of a concept behind this.

[KarmaShaman]

Oh don't get me wrong, chk071 - I'm not planning on using VST either. And I think Reason is a brilliant DAW (I use Cubase & Reaper for work, but never for my music). I also think the implementation of RE licences is great too. But I will not stay silent when users heap baseless praise on the company. Progress is incredibly slow, their offerings upon new releases becomes less as each full version comes out, until now, none of the major request features are implemented in any manner that suggests they consider the needs of their users, and quite frankly they are lying sacks of shit in everything they say and do, right from the customer service schmucks up to the marketing brainwashers. Sadly, a vast majority of the platforms users are gulliable fanboys who suck up every word as if it's Bolivina coke to their ears.

Propellerhead SUCK. But I will heap praise on Reason itself, it's awesome.

[keel]

Guys, chill out. Same was in Image-Line. Gol added and then removed stuff what he liked, not what users wanted. Now Gol is gone, IL have change their habbits. They keep asking new features and keep adding them all the time. Expect my request, which I have request for years, and send Scott emails two times. Nothing. No answer. They ignore it all the time. And all I wanted, was to bring back something what was there already, but Gol just decided to remove it and kill my workflow. And no, its not the blocks. But anyway, FL users seems to be much, much happier now. Maybe Prop's will take a change on their habbits too and start finally to listen the users, users who actually use their program. Fixes / option for this automatically returning cursor and space bar stealing would be nice way to show it. Two small thing to fix. Come on, you can do it, right, Anosou..?

[KarmaShaman]

Don't ask Ansou. With any luck (for Reason customers) him and the whole team of dead wood will be out the door before version 10.

This will be the biggest Progress Propellerhead will have made for many years. Also one of the most overdue...

[noremorse]

Don't ask Ansou. With any luck (for Reason customers) him and the whole team of dead wood will be out the door before version 10.

This will be the biggest Progress Propellerhead will have made for many years. Also one of the most overdue...

What a crybaby you seem to be, and completely out of touch with reality. A bitter little troll, did they throw you out from Reasontalk?

And checking out your post history seems to confirm you have a personal vendetta against PH. In your first post back in 2013 you wrote:

"Hi all, first post from me. I'm a Reason user (love the DAW, but the company behind it are crooks, more on that soon). I play a bit of electric/acoustic/bass guitar, but mostly work in MIDI environment. Having recently upgraded the PC, I'm wondering about the future of music hardware and when we wil..."

[bungle]

Guys, chill out. Same was in Image-Line. Gol added and then removed stuff what he liked, not what users wanted. Now Gol is gone, IL have change their habbits. They keep asking new features and keep adding them all the time. Expect my request, which I have request for years, and send Scott emails two times. Nothing. No answer. They ignore it all the time. And all I wanted, was to bring back something what was there already, but Gol just decided to remove it and kill my workflow. And no, its not the blocks. But anyway, FL users seems to be much, much happier now. Maybe Prop's will take a change on their habbits too and start finally to listen the users, users who actually use their program. Fixes / option for this automatically returning cursor and space bar stealing would be nice way to show it. Two small thing to fix. Come on, you can do it, right, Anosou..?

Gol is gone ?
Where is he ?

[chimp_spanner]

It was a shame PH axed the PUF but then I do remember a *lot* of arguing and moaning. It got pretty toxic towards the end. Even on RT now you get these waves/spates of people flooding the forum like "Is this the Reason sound?" or "Why can't Thor sound like Nexus 2?" or "Why doesn't Reason do what <insert other DAW> does?". It's pretty draining, even as a casual observer. Still would've been nice to try and keep it going.

On 9.5 though; I mean, I've been a long time Cubase user (version 2 on Atari up to 9) and a long time Reason user (version 1 to 9). I've kept both DAWs up to date and I gotta say over the last year or two, I've transitioned almost entirely to Reason. Even without VST. I'm on the beta now and I gotta say I really like how it feels. It's pretty much all I was waiting for to abandon Cubase entirely, although I know its audio editing has a long way to go. Thankfully I don't do a lot of live multi-tracking, or audio editing for that matter. So it doesn't affect me, although I can see how it might affect others.

And on why it took VST so long to come; I think if you've been a long time Reason user, maybe you'll already understand. The whole rack paradigm worked very well. It was easy to share projects. Super easy to keep your plugin library up to date. And I can say, hand on heart, that since version 1 of Reason I've had something like...*a* crash. Maybe two. That's pretty good going. Also you've gotta consider that they invested a lot of time and money into the RE format which was admittedly always gonna be a gamble. But VST support invariably means cracked plugin support, which is gonna have some kind of negative impact on RE sales. Without a doubt. Why buy an RE when you can torrent a VST?

And speaking of which, it's bad enough people registering in 2017 JUST to complain that their Reason 5 isn't working properly - hmmmmmMMMMMM. Wait until everyone with a cracked Sylenth or Serum turns up complaining that Reason is unstable It's coming.

Anyway I love the update. I love Reason. I think/hope PH are learning about being a bit more receptive to feedback, and how to move with the times. Version 10 will tell all I guess!

[memyselfandus]

Agree with eXode, Reason truly is the gold standard when it comes to plugin licence management. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if, on the May 29th release date, that Propellerhead have an ace up their sleeve and host VSTs under the same shop & auth model as REs.

Think about it - why would they wilfully throw away a commission cash cow when everyone can go use VSTs sourced from other sellers? Best of both worlds, they keep VSTs in their RE shop, make commission on them, an manage the authorisation of the licences.

Which would also explain why so much screen time of the 9.5 promo video is dedicated to izotope, xfer, Kontakt. There's no reason those developers would waste their time on doing the video if there wasn't a business arrangement in there.

It may even well be that Propellerheads are vying to be the #1 international online store and licence authorisation system for every VST out there.

You heard it here first, folks.

This would be amazing!

[chimp_spanner]

Agree with eXode, Reason truly is the gold standard when it comes to plugin licence management. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if, on the May 29th release date, that Propellerhead have an ace up their sleeve and host VSTs under the same shop & auth model as REs.

Think about it - why would they wilfully throw away a commission cash cow when everyone can go use VSTs sourced from other sellers? Best of both worlds, they keep VSTs in their RE shop, make commission on them, an manage the authorisation of the licences.

Which would also explain why so much screen time of the 9.5 promo video is dedicated to izotope, xfer, Kontakt. There's no reason those developers would waste their time on doing the video if there wasn't a business arrangement in there.

It may even well be that Propellerheads are vying to be the #1 international online store and licence authorisation system for every VST out there.

You heard it here first, folks.

This would be amazing!

Maybe, although think about it logistically; someone would have to host and distribute all the Komplete library content. And presently Reason's Authorizer doesn't really give you any control over where things go. Don't get me wrong, I'd *love* to be able to do everything with one press of "Sync All"! But I don't think it's likely. Very happy to be proven wrong though!