2.1.2 cpu spikes, crashes

[SLiC]

I must admit things are going a bit weird....radio silence for quite a while and bug fixes pushed out without a splash screen and apparent new bugs (not personally suffering other than no splash screen) - Bitwig- you guys have a beta team/forum...why not use it for all release~?

As for no new content for a while....depends what happens in the next few months...if they suddenly come out with a big new release with all; the stuff people have been asking for and maybe a killer feature we weren't expecting....all will be instantly forgiven But given the (unnecessary) controversy of going subscription, they really need to deliver regularly or simply let people know what's happening...

Ironically if they had just made V2 a paid update for 160E we would have all bought it and NOT expected a years free updates, making any free update a nice bonus...we would of all happily paid a gain in 18 months for a V3 update with the big new stuff....

FYI- Bitwig are presenting at IMSTA FESTA Chicago tomorrow- maybe there will be an announcement....

[Hez]

Agreed that the increasing opaqueness of updates/new bugs being introduced is a little concerning. The optimistic side of me hopes that they are doing some very low level overhauling of VST handling etc. which is why we are seeing a few things going backwards in recent releases.

My instinct is that most of the recent crashes/slowdowns etc. are related to VST handling. I've developed a new workflow of sorts recently to try to minimise the number of VSTs present in a project at any point (deactivating them doesn't help - still causes lots of crashes at project load & seems to increase the risk of something tanking out halfway through playback):

1. Create synth/FX chain etc., get it as good as possible
2. Render down to audio as soon as I'm happy
3. Save one clip from the track into the browser, with the naming convention of "ProjectName - TrackName" (e.g. "NewAmbientIdea - Background Atmos 2"). Make sure to tick save devices, audio files etc.
4. If there are complex midi parts, drag them onto an empty track and keep it in a collapsed group folder somewhere
5. Delete all devices on the track so it's just clean audio.

Working this way has exponentially reduced the number of crashes I'm seeing and also really helped my workflow. If I want to go back and change something it's easy to find the original track in the clip browser and drag it back in to edit/rebounce. There are a few drawbacks, mainly:
1. Complex automation across a lot of clips is not easy to save, unless you consolidate the track into one entire clip before saving (which still causes pretty major GUI slowdown for me and makes it hard to keep track of what you're doing)
2. If you work with very large multisamples etc., keeping track of sample locations/space usage etc. might be an issue
3. The project is no longer entirely contained in a single folder - you need to make sure your clip library is thoroughly backed up/organised as well if you want to revisit the projects later

However, on balance it has been a large improvement in my workflow. I'd actually like to see this fleshed out into a proper workflow approach, i.e. an ability to save entire tracks or groups in the project folder, but remove them from the actual live arrangement. This would keep processor/system resource usage low while arranging, but allow easy recall of device settings/midi/automation if required. Maybe a new browser section/data type that actually stores full tracks/groups (including devices, midi, an option for audio, automation etc.), rather than just clips + devices or device presets.

Out of interest, does anybody else work with predominantly audio & just Bitwig devices? If so, are you also seeing increased frequency of crashes recently? Just to test my vst hypothesis...

[incubus]

I just had my very first spike in bitwig. 2.1.3, the vst3 version of "groove agent 4" demo. The vst2 is fine.

[pschuegr]

Haven't had much luck tracking this down, the only thing that I can say for sure is that it seems to be really tightly correlated with Period Jitter in the DSP Performance Graph, which makes sense.

What's ultra confusing about this is I tried it on a friends MacBook Pro, which is basically identical to mine except the previous model, and... it seems pretty smooth So I'm not sure it's really a bitwig problem, but damn, these things are hard to debug.

[malgre]

Quick update - I've been able to get Bitwig pretty stable, avoiding the plug-ins that set off the CPU spikes. Unfortunately, I have found another one: Antares Auto Tune EFX sets it off, which is a real bummer.

EDIT - I downloaded and re-installed Auto-Tune EFX (which is a VST3) and now, no problems with that plug-in! I'm guessing the download was an updated version, so maybe this was entirely an Antares thing.


@Hez - I agree with what you've found with your workflow, the approach of bouncing to audio frequently is one I've seen recommended from a number of producers. One (kind of extreme) method has you create 2 projects - one for sound design and one for the actual song. First, you create the sounds you might use in your song in the sound design project, bouncing those to audio as much as possible. Then, you compose the song by importing sounds (audio, MIDI instruments) into your song project (methods vary depending on DAW). So, one project is your 'palette' and the other is the 'painting'.
And yes, I think that many (most?) of the CPU spike problems are related to VSTs. I have experienced the behavior with only Bitwig plugins, on a track with a bunch of modulators going, but the problem went away and I don't remember exactly the circumstances.

[amadeusp]

Hey everyone.

I was able to isolate the issue completely in the meantime. I have a rock solid Bitwig Studio again!

For me it is only Softube's VST3 plugins which cause spikes, particularly Tonelux Tilt.
I reported the issue to both, the Bitwig team and Softube. The other day the Bitwig team contacted me and told me that the two developer teams are in contact over the issue now.

What I did for the moment:
- I went through all current projects and switched the VST3 plugins with their VST2 counter parts.
- Further more I configured Bitwig's browser to only show the VST2 plugins as a temporary measure to avoid putting VST3 plugins in my projects. This especially makes sense for me as I have another issue with Plugin Alliance's VST3 plugin versions. They do not cause spikes, but their knobs are not functioning properly (I reported this issue to PA and Bitwig already – PA seems to be working on the issue already).

Best

Amadeus

[malgre]

Amadeus - great news! I've reached the same place, and I'm mostly happy with Bitwig now. I'm still nervous that it'll blow up on me again, but, yeah, it's been solid the last week or so.

[incubus]

God, I hate vst3

[amadeusp]

[quote="incubus"]God, I hate vst3 [/quote]

hahahahaha

[incubus]

But on a serious note, it's mostly a joke. FINALLY after years of people being able to deal with the 2.4 vst and making it really stable, the vst just continues to be a thorn in many peoples side.

In bitwig, unless I'm mistaken, you get presets with vst2 for PA, not vst3. So the only thing good about vst3 is the side chain stuff and I don't personally use that.

Cubase it works "ok" , I guess.

[Pprimo]

My Roland System 1 does not work with the plugins in BitWig VST 3. I have all the Plugins for it. They all work in Logic, Q Base, flawless so its not System 1. VST3 is not working properly in BITWIG. When I use bluecat patchworks it works as an audio unit in BitWig. All the parameters move...... buy its a bit buggy. I don't know what to tell u. There are other various vst3 of mine not working also. Im just using vst2 and system 1 can't be used.

[hihu]

Hello,

I have upgrade my Bitwig yesterday to the newest Bitwig 2 version before I was using 1.3.16.

I have created a project in 1.3 with 2 tracks containing the bazille synth but now it's not working fluently anymore. There are some other effects too. In 1.3 everything works fine but now sometime the sound stutters and stops for a few seconds. Before everything was fine. I have also enabled multicore in bazille. The DSP show 1/3 load.

I didn't do any changes to the operating system which is Debian 9. So don't know where this comes from. Any idea?

BTW the plugin ist vst version 2.4.

thx

[anttimaatteri]

Seems like BWS is messing their subs plan already.. "We can bring new features immediately instead of waiting a major release". Been almost a year, no new features (except amp device) and everything they've released have come with pile of issues and bugs. Maybe that "major release" thing would've been better to them.

except that its not "almost a year" and there is no "their sub"SCRIPTion.

and btw
things happen on a happentosh system, things like spikes. lags, stutters, crashes, freezes and users.
and even a vst gui can cause all this while its visible and nothing happens while its invisible.

[malgre]

Well, I'm feeling pretty done with Bitwig at this point. Just when I think everything is running smoothly, it starts in again with the spikes and glitches - it definitely seems like there are problems in the core code of the DSP engine.
A project that had been working ok for me yesterday gave me nothing but glitches when I started working on it today. I had shut down my computer, so this was after starting Bitwig and playing a Scene (from the clip launcher) that had been working fine. See the attached pic of the DSP usage.

Screen Shot 2017-08-28 at 12.12.07 PM.png

I stopped tracks playing until I had only 3 audio tracks running, still the glitches. Then, I started the project playing again, this time gradually playing tracks from the clip launcher until I had *all the same tracks playing from the original Scene* and *no glitches*. Seriously, WTF?

Screen Shot 2017-08-28 at 12.22.42 PM.png

At this point, I am again spending more time trying to get Bitwig to run smoothly than actually making music. I can only hope there is a significant update soon, I certainly can't rely on the software right now.

[ejgallego]

That's weird, maybe some CPU / power save mode? Indeed it seems quite some people are having such problems, I am still running fine, keeping my fingers crossed.