KVR Audio

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:59 pm

c_voltage wrote:So, tried install v2 trial, really it's replace v1 after install to the same place, since has the same dll name (and i guess has the same plugin ID). That not very well.

Since it's perfectly backwards compatible, that is just fine as far as I'm concerned.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:16 pm

zzz00m wrote:
I would like to see:

1. re-order of modules capability
2. re-scalable UI
3. a few more voices, 16 would be plenty for this synth - I will still worry about long releases with 8 voices
4. enhanced patch browser with search and tagging

Yes, those are really nice to have

I might be biased, but what I like in version 2 mostly are the new presets (I love many of them) and that it has more detailed and better sound than in version 1 (which it replaced it in my case).

If I compare Loom II polyphony with NI Razor, then it is almost the same (Razor has 6 voice polyphony, right?). But, compared with IL Harmor, it lacks in this aspect. But I agree that it should have 16 polyphony at least (although cannot be CPU friendly with that polyphony for my i5 processor! However, the choice should be there for better processors).
All in my opinion of course

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:35 pm

ThomasHelzle wrote:
shonky wrote:Weren't they doing the same thing with some of Che's patches for Hybrid 3 the other month?
"Free expansion packs now also free with purchase"
Yeah, found that rather strange as well...

Pretty rude IMO, especially as these asked for a donation if the user found them useful.

I'm guessing as they're using these to add extra value to their sales bundle that AIR are finding these quite useful and should probably donate, no?

Might need to be a bit more careful with user agreements in future I guess.

DJErmac · Post by **DJErmac** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:01 am

I really love Loom 1 (and actually most of the Air synths), but I've just tried Loom 2 and could not find a single reason to upgrade. This is what I would call Loom 1.5 or something, not Loom 2, as I see no real big upgrade (yes, that's what it's about) in the sound you get from it. It's still a very nice synth in the end.

ATN69 · Post by **ATN69** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:06 am

IMHO Air instruments have great potential and as a whole collection Air actually have it all. Drums, piano. synths, etc. I just wish Air would decide to take what they have to the next level. Overhaul and modernize.

machinesworking · Post by **machinesworking** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:59 am

IMO Loom is a widely overlooked synth. It's not the only non retina 4K monitor ready plug in I have, and I thought even before reading the thread after seeing that they did nothing to the GUI, that the KVR crowd would be up in arms about it.

Seriously though, Air sell all their stuff cheaply, Loom is gold, it's a great sounding synth. I'll probably just get the collection if that works to upgrade Loom to II, and see no real issue. I think everyone made their point about the GUI, but the rest is pretty minor BS IMO. Sorry, but UI improvements to me take a back seat to new features, and have any of you ever realized you can zoom in OSX and Windows? It's a solution for now if you have a 4K monitor until everyone is on board with resizable plug in GUIs.

skyscape · Post by **skyscape** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:15 am

I saw this post and excitedly clicked it, my credit card in hand - ready to purchase. Loom is one of the most interesting synths I own, but it is let down by its woeful polyphony, weird modulation options, lack of reroutable modules and intrusive copy protection. Surely they have listened and fixed most, or at least some of these issues I thought to myself... Nope.

Sorry Air, I realise you need a consistent revenue stream, but many of your competitors offer changes like this in version updates. That's the reality of it. Nothing in this update has piqued my interest enough. I think many of the posts in this thread make it very clear what users want from LOOM - so if you want some feedback on how to do a successful version 2 that would be it.

DJ Warmonger · Post by **DJ Warmonger** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:14 am

I can read just about any user interface. I just don't feel the need to have to put "effort" into reading any user interface[/quot]
This. AiR plugins do not exist in void. There are simply better ones on the market, and better ones already in my VST folder. If I have to choose between something I can see and click and something that I cannot, I pick the first one.

Yo make things clear: Loom already had too little and cumbersome interface before I got high-DPI monitor.
Given that this isn't exactly an intuitive synth to program, it's helpful to have the ability to move modules around, rather than having to re-enter all of the information to a later slot, and remove the information and modulation from the previous slot.

This. Copying all the values is a waste of time to the point nobody wants to do it. Especially since controls are small and the only way to read the value is to l-click on them, which changes that value as a result.

Seriously, I feel like GUI designer didn't ever actually try to program anything with this synth. It's only a preset machine.

Version II feels like more of the same, but doesn't fix any of the design flaws. None of the upgrades makes me want to spend more time with Loom or improves my workflow.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:23 am

shonky wrote:
ThomasHelzle wrote:
shonky wrote:Weren't they doing the same thing with some of Che's patches for Hybrid 3 the other month?
"Free expansion packs now also free with purchase"
Yeah, found that rather strange as well...
Pretty rude IMO, especially as these asked for a donation if the user found them useful.

I'm guessing as they're using these to add extra value to their sales bundle that AIR are finding these quite useful and should probably donate, no?

Might need to be a bit more careful with user agreements in future I guess.

Yes mine does too.

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:04 am

I was including your pack too - have they contacted you about using your preset pack for their promotion or did you only find out once the promotion started?

sbangs_air · Post by **sbangs_air** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:38 am

Thanks for all the feedback, we have passed it on to the relevant parties.

We will aim to address the points raised in future updates. The High DPI update will also come to Loom Classic at no additional charge in the future for those not requiring new features. While I appreciate not everyone will want to partake in this at this stage this is off to a great start. We have had significant upgrades overnight.

In regards to the preset pack, we obtained written permission in exchange for NFR's and ongoing NFR's for any future products we call full credit to the creator as requested in the download and include the donation link. If we have misunderstood we are happy to remove this asap just let me know.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:41 am

How can you get an NFR for a free-to-download soundbank that's available to everyone?

sbangs_air wrote:Thanks for all the feedback, we have passed it on to the relevant parties.

We will aim to address the points raised in future updates.

This is what has been said over and over for the past two or so years. Sorry but I don't have any confidence left - instead of saying the same thing over and over again, just do them and show them to us, ASAP. Show that you care and that you listen your users, instead of ridiculing them with "added 2 voices of polyphony by popular request". That was not the request - the request was for MORE than that.

sbangs_air · Post by **sbangs_air** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:42 am

EvilDragon wrote:
c_voltage wrote:So, tried install v2 trial, really it's replace v1 after install to the same place, since has the same dll name (and i guess has the same plugin ID). That not very well.
Since it's perfectly backwards compatible, that is just fine as far as I'm concerned.

The Logic behind this was our Beta Testers requested we do this to avoid breaking existing projects as there is no need to run Loom 1 and Loom 2 on the same system.

fluffy_little_something · Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:59 am

From the company whining about customers expecting too much at too low a price...

https://www.kvraudio.com/news/airs-xpan ... 30th-38798

Makes me feel like dumping my paid Xpand into the trash bin...

mutantdog · Post by **mutantdog** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 10:22 am

Just to chime in with my own grumblings here, Loom is one of my favourite "synths that i never use" so i would have been interested in this update. But since the main reasons for me ignoring it relate to its usability, as opposed to its feature set, i can't say i'm enticed by an update that fails to address its main weaknesses.

The upgrade price is too much, especially considering the complaints made here by other posters (which i also agree with). If AIR want to be seen as the sort of quality company that can charge $50 for an update then they shouldn't have spent the last couple of years creating an image of cheapness and bundleware. I'd also suggest that releasing a product that seems more like v1.1 and marketing it as v2.0 does more to harm your reputation. To add further insult, this upgrade price is time-limited. Given AIR's track record I expect a new AIEP to be in the works and this product, along with the bundle, to be heavily discounted within the next 12 months so why should i hurry?

Now, if the GUI becomes resizable and drag/drop functionality is added i may be interested. I assume Hybrid and Vacuum updates are also around the corner, make them right too and offer a fair upgrade path for all 3 and I'm on board. Otherwise, i'll stick with what i have.

Loom II has landed!