u-he

Sound Author · Post by **Sound Author** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:42 pm

I've found that, as my skillset improves, I reach for a specific tool for a specific task, instead of piling modules on top of each other, hoping complexity will produce desirable results. Some patches are complex, some are simple, but a good patch is made with care and attention to detail, regardless of how complex it may or may not be.

jme-audio · Post by **jme-audio** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:52 pm

Well, to me FM with 4 envelopes means simple patches. Maybe that is subjective but in comparision to the DX7 it is just simpler.

I really dig the cross paradigm approach of Zebra, but when I make a FM patch with physical modelling and a low pass filter I run out of envelopes (or have to use MSEG). For me this is not bloat but the joy of experimentation. If I just wanted to do a Moog Lead I wouldn't need Zebra.

And Howard, I don't know why YOU are attacking this, when you are using 8 MSEG yourself when working together with Hans Zimmer!

david.beholder · Post by **david.beholder** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:38 pm

Howard wrote: I never felt that Zebra2 restricted creativity by forcing us to make "just simple patches"

When you need 8 MSEGs or better filters Urs is adding them for you.
When we're asking for more envelopes we're just "bloating creative restrictions".

(With respect and I'm having fun)

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:22 pm

I for one would be happy to see 8 of each modulator type in Zebra...

Funkybot's Evil Twin · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:42 pm

EvilDragon wrote:I for one would be happy to see 8 of each modulator type in Zebra...

If everyone gets 8, then Urs is going to have to make a special version for Hans with 16. It's an arms race!

david.beholder · Post by **david.beholder** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:01 pm

Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote:
If everyone gets 8, then Urs is going to have to make a special version for Hans with 16. It's an arms race!

Ahahahahahah

Still there would be patches for movie where Howard use all of them.

aumordia · Post by **aumordia** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 4:35 am

You guys are going to kill Zebra if you get your way.

Not everything has to be Emacs, you know.

david.beholder · Post by **david.beholder** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 4:39 am

aumordia wrote:Not everything has to be Emacs, you know.

Z is bread and butter synth, unlike Diva or Ace.

aumordia · Post by **aumordia** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:28 am

That doesn’t justify inflicting anti-sprezzatura upon it’s design.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:21 am

Hehe, keep calm guys

There will obviously be more envelope-ish options. There'll also be more FM-ish options.

I *might* feel that 8 MSEGs might be okay if we let go of user waveforms in the LFOs. Which might allow us to do some funky stuff that LFOs normally don't do. Which depends on the outcome of the new waveform editor.

david.beholder · Post by **david.beholder** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:58 am

aumordia wrote:That doesn’t justify inflicting anti-sprezzatura upon it’s design.

Simple don't use all options if you don't want. Satisfying different needs is essential for bread and butter synts especially in case of synths with such a diverse userbase like Zebra.

Urs wrote: I *might* feel that 8 MSEGs might be okay if we let go of user waveforms in the LFOs. Which might allow us to do some funky stuff that LFOs normally don't do. Which depends on the outcome of the new waveform editor.

Do you mean mseg would officially replace user waveforms in lfo?

jme-audio · Post by **jme-audio** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 12:27 pm

david.beholder wrote:Do you mean mseg would officially replace user waveforms in lfo?

This makes sense, because this feature is often just used to create sequences.
But there should be a hotkey in the MSEG to just move a dot without affecting the positions of the other dots then, else the cycle length would be modified everytime when moving a dot.
And the MSEG needs more timing options to easily dial in f.e. 8T.

Improving the LFO should also reduce the need to draw basic user waveforms like unipolar triangles.

karrikuh · Post by **karrikuh** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 3:26 pm

Urs wrote:<...> I *might* feel that 8 MSEGs might be okay if we let go of user waveforms in the LFOs. <...>

I don't like that idea. I want to have global LFOs with user-definable shape (multi-segment like MSEGs) that run in sync with the song position, not retriggered by note on events. This could of course also be achieved by introducing a "global" option for MSEGs, but then, I feel the distinction between LFOs and EGs would be blurred to much.

Also, just to add another personal opinion: the number of available modulators in Z2 is just fine, I would keep it that way.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 3:33 pm

karrikuh wrote:
Urs wrote:<...> I *might* feel that 8 MSEGs might be okay if we let go of user waveforms in the LFOs. <...>
I don't like that idea. I want to have global LFOs with user-definable shape (multi-segment like MSEGs) that run in sync with the song position, not retriggered by note on events. This could of course also be achieved by introducing a "global" option for MSEGs, but then, I feel the distinction between LFOs and EGs would be blurred to much.

I would like to drop global LFOs and add a global option to existing LFOs anyway. It's always been a cause for a lot of confusion. If you're using them for sequencing reasons, there'll be a lot more capable and comfortable means to do sequencing on per-oscillator basis.

Also, just to add another personal opinion: the number of available modulators in Z2 is just fine, I would keep it that way.

padillac · Post by **padillac** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 4:23 pm

More modulators never hurt anybody

u-he

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