MeldaProduction

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:08 am

here can see how important speaker calibration is when compare the room measurement with the free field measurement https://www.stereophile.com/content/rev ... asurements

there is also measurement of the expensive Verity Sarastro II

so my idea is to have transparency windows to be able to redraw the curve in freeformeq that you can see in a frequency sheet. with control mousewheel can zoom the web content in browser can see under freeform EQ. maybe there are programs out that can make a VST window transparent.

there are programs out as glass2k or true transparency, that are made to bring transparent windows in win xp. but they do not do what need.

to use freeformeq as speaker calibration for own speakers.
A good measure microphone cost only around 50 Eur. i use the sonarworks measure microphone (have a calibration file) the important frequency response in bass can also cheep measure microphone good. over 3 khz measuring is not precise when use not smooth above 6% i think. (depend lots on microphone position on any software). only above 10 khz the measure microphone need more than 1% correct. correct all frequencies above 3 khz with more measure smooth is ok, because there can not hear such lots diffrent as from 50 hz upto 3 khz in 1 db diffrence only. there can only hear less or more high freq in highhat or cymbal. the sonarworks software i test, work not good in my room, that is worth the high price. the best is correct it and hear that it sound good and use less correction than 100%. this way is much much better as no calibration.

using headphone is no good solution, because all sound not so good as speakers. headphones are too very diffrent in sound. you can try the vst plugin from tonebooster morphit. here can correct and simulate over 100 headphones. maybe the headphone you own is in. then you can hear how your headphone sound correct. demo is available, btw morphit have a good price, cost only 30 Eur.

I use freeformeq and it is best solution i see even in min phase. even when correct only 30% is much much better than uncorrect. when correct 100% i hear on all measure software too not nice color tint

nosucherror · Post by **nosucherror** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:20 pm

Have you got anything to correct my ears though?

MeldaProduction · Post by **MeldaProduction** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:40 pm

Well, transparent windows won't happen sorry. You'll have to fit it onto your screen somehow. I'm not exactly sure what is the idea here though. Anyways I'd recommend simply analyzing the output of a white/pink noise and match it to the analysis of the pure noise.

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:44 am

nosucherror wrote:Have you got anything to correct my ears though?

ears are much more linear as the room. I get only good sound when i remove around 6 db frequency around 250 hz. I use subwoofer with 50 hz crossover. normaly subvwoofer crossover is 120 hz or 80 hz, but thats more worse. This can see when measuring. I have 17 qm room. See the correction curve and frequency response i post. even 2 db reduce at 250 hz give much better sound. I can also avoid to use the subwoofer and can use small speakers on desktop. see 2. measure with correction without subwoofer. In compare it sound a little better without subwoofer. Of course only upto loudness of around 86 db in bass in nearfield can reach. but more than 80 db is not good for ears, so its loud enough and save the ears

Edit: the filenames are wrong, the curve with boost below 100 hz is without subwoofer. i use canton x3 plus as satelite speaker. the spec of them are 45 hz upto 30 khz. i dont know how they measure this. normaly with hifi norm should be -6 db. but at 45 hz my speaker are more than -10 db

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 10:13 am

MeldaProduction wrote:Well, transparent windows won't happen sorry. You'll have to fit it onto your screen somehow. I'm not exactly sure what is the idea here though. Anyways I'd recommend simply analyzing the output of a white/pink noise and match it to the analysis of the pure noise.

what headphones and speaker you have ?

please look at the frequency curve of the high end speakers in the link. to simulate this, you need draw the frequency curve in freeform eq and invert it(freeform EQ have a button for this), to get correction curve. this freeform eq that simulate other speaker need add after the freeform eq that correct your speakers to linear.

to draw this correction curve, it is best when see the target curve from frequency diagram below freeform eq so you can draw the curve

I get in mind, i can buy a wacom graphic tablet with pen draw ability(cost around 90 Eur).I can scale the gui of freeform eq or scale the frequency curve so it fit to GUI of freeform eq. when i print this curve. i can then put the print on the graphic tablet and draw the lines of the printet frequency response on the paper. hope i have explain and it is understand for what transparent windos are usefull

jmg8 · Post by **jmg8** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:39 pm

Why are you trying to get your speakers to sound like high end expensive speakers?
The expensive speakers are trying to be perfectly flat (but are not)
So it would be better to try to get your speakers to match pink noise.

pumafred · Post by **pumafred** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 8:54 pm

jmg8 wrote:Why are you trying to get your speakers to sound like high end expensive speakers?

I assume it’s to hear the mix as his clients will. Hopeless enterprise, IMHO. (E.g., what about the clients’ room?)

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:42 pm

jmg8 wrote:Why are you trying to get your speakers to sound like high end expensive speakers?
The expensive speakers are trying to be perfectly flat (but are not)
So it would be better to try to get your speakers to match pink noise.

same as a concert you hear several times in diffrent concert room sound more exiting as if it is always in same room. and it give more learning when you see, eh on this speaker my piano sound better. so you can hear and see how the EQ for piano can modify, that it sound better. maybe you try morphit. I have buy a cheap sony zx310 headphone . and this can simulate many headphones. there is lots diffrence in headphones too. see also the frequency response of this 50.000$ speaker in the link. it seem not try to be linear. it seem that people like it. same as a marshal or engl or .... maybe

MeldaProduction · Post by **MeldaProduction** » Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:55 pm

It's much more complex than that. The is room acoustics (biggest problem usually), phase distortion, the way the monitors emit sound in different directions etc. etc... One more reason why I like using headphones much more, if you need the feel of monitors, just convolve it with some HRTF IR... But I like the clean stuff, after all most people listen to music on headphones.

Anyways by fixing the spectrum levels you only fix one problem and your are likely to make other problems more prominent. I just don't like doing that and never head much luck with it.

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:00 am

I not get with headphones the really sit in a room feeling. sound with headphones is always in head. but maybe you know a good speaker emulation for headphones i can try ?. In the past i buy a AKG K1000 headphone, this was better than other. but since there are cheap small speakers i notice that with room correction it sound lots better as headphones. I have good audio memory and i am often in concerts. so i know how a good concert room sound and i know my speakers are not perfect, but much better as headphones now.

EDIT: that maybe think the uncorrect sound is better happen because ears work adaptive. if you hear a sound often then you get to like them. thats the reason wy even headphones can sell when they sound diffrent to a live concert. my ears are adaptive too, but not so much. but when i hear great sound, i get lots more feeling. but maybe more adaptive ears are better, then can be happy with 2 Dollar speakers

MeldaProduction · Post by **MeldaProduction** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:47 am

Most headphones actually suck. But if you get good ones, they should work the best. If you want "in a room" feeling, just get some IR of a HRTF or some studio reverb. Eventually I personally feel like this is not a good idea. Speakers are good for checking the mix though. But then you don't need a superflat response, after all the listeners won't have that. In any case just correcting the spectrum levels won't do the trick. You'd need superb room and superb speaker system, and that's way more expensive than superb headphones.

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:33 pm

And what is a good headphone ?. i did not know what hrtf is, so i not test with that. I read about that,

As sound strikes the listener, the size and shape of the head, ears, ear canal, density of the head, size and shape of nasal and oral cavities, all transform the sound and affect how it is perceived, boosting some frequencies and attenuating others

.problem i think is, every ears are diffrent. but who knows, before test maybe there is impulse that let headphone sound better with my ears

Do you know links for HRTF impulses for download ?

BTW: in turboreverb can choose 5x upsampling. more does my PC not do for short reverbs. I use 88 khz and hear much diffrence in high freq reverb in other reverbs too, when use 44 khz or 88 khz(88 khz sound better). linear phase diffrence or more oversampling i hear not in freeform EQ

But turboreverb high freq reverb sound only good for me, when use 5* oversampling. maybe you think i am crazy, but i test lots time, that there can really a diffrence hear between 4* and 5* upsampling.

maybe you can hear diffrence too a lot. i hear that with speakers. with headphones can hear more easy. try small spaces antovo studio mturbo preset and mdrummer small preset studio pearl elite 1 preset and play the demo song.

maybe that algo reverbs sound not good, depend because due to the many serial filters they get inprecise and need very high sampling rate.

MeldaProduction · Post by **MeldaProduction** » Mon Oct 30, 2017 11:43 am

HRTFs are IRs recorded using a dummy head (or a human head with a mike inside the ears). Just search for it, there are many of the online.

Different sampling rates will definitely sound different, but they should not be "better", only different. Perhaps you just like the 5

. 5 is a nice prime number!

magicmusic · Post by **magicmusic** » Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:08 pm

its not because i like the 5. when i use 44k khz sample rate then 10x is best. i have upload a video, here can see settings too. with 44 khz sound more high freq metalic. 1x is 88 khz in video. with 6 there is no high freq metalic but low freq smooth clicks can hear. with 5 this effects are lesser hear. maybe it is something wrong in coding. with other reverbs i hear not such big diffrence.

MeldaProduction · Post by **MeldaProduction** » Tue Oct 31, 2017 12:33 pm

Well, I actually like 1x the most

.

MeldaProduction

KVR Audio

freeformeq as speaker correction and speaker simulation.