Tone2 I2 vs Trueno Analog

[fallacy]

To me this seems the worst of both worlds. An analog synth with no knobs and sliders, and a mediocre looking UI, destined to be abandoned in a few years when the Twoeno is released.

I tried to refrain from being negative but that’s my 2c. But I really sincerely hope those interested in it make something great with it.

[AnX]

So just osc and filter are 'analog' not lfos and envs etc...looks very limited too.

Digital envelopes and LFOs were quite common since the 80s. In the last 30 years only quite a few analog synths also seemed to have analog envelopes and LFOs. AFAIK Trueno has up to 6 envelopes and 4 LFOs (both digital).

Really? I never knew that!

Yes, they were one of the first serious cost cutting measures used in analogue polys. The prophet 600, the first poly analogue with midi, came out in 1982 and used digital envelopes and lfos to save money. The use of digital modulators predates the use of external programmers such as the PG300/PG800.

I would say that the vast majority of analogue polys from the 80s used digital modulators.

Sarcasm

[Highvoltage]

Oh my god this thread. I'm amazed by the number of people with backward thinking.

Firstly if this is a product that you think is not designed for your needs, then why you get angry about it?? This makes so little sense to me.

I think it's very clear that it's whole purpose is a very portable synth with true analogue oscillators and filters, which acts as a vst plugin. With recallability etc..
I've had dozens of analog synths in my life, but at the end i have found that in the heat of composing i tend to reach for the fastest and easiest synths to work with, and that was always a VSTi. So i started selling them, especially because synths like The Legend, which was the turning point for me in software quality. So this is something that is very much up in my alley. And i'm not a laptop EDM producer, and yes it's important for me to be able to play them live, as much as i like sequencing.

Now, a polivoks filter has never been emulated. It's very close sounding to to the MS-20, and no one could even emulate that up to this point. The Drop is not even close when you really drive it. Diva's Ms-20 filter is a joke. (They both are excellent plugins, i'm just talking about nailing the ms-20 filter)
So if you have a plugin that sounds like a polivoks character, it's already a win.

About the digital control path:
If any of you guys think that an analog LFO or envelope 'sounds' better, you really should do some homework.
I'm absolutely with Dave Smith on this topic. Control signals are so EXTREMELY slow compared to audio rate, that emulating them in digital is a piece of cake.
I have and ES-3 from expert sleepers for my modular synth, and with that i can control any parameter on my modular from the computer. I'm telling you it doesn't sound anything less analog because the computer draws that friggin' LFO

The soul of a synth is the Filter, the Amplifier(transistor mixer in the case of moog) and the Oscillator, and i even dare to say it's in this exact order
So if this one delivers in that aspect, i'm sold.
My only concern is the real latency. It's not totally cear what the company means under 'added latency of 17ms)
I'm totally ok with 17ms, but anything bigger migh be an issue.

[wagtunes]

Caring about making "music" has nothing to do with what equipment you own.

I'm sure many pianists, guitarists, violinists and countless other musicians will tell you the same thing.

The snobbery in this place makes me wonder how some of the people breathe all that thin air while perched so high up on their thrones.

[ghettosynth]

Oh my god this thread. I'm amazed by the number of people with backward thinking.

Firstly if this is a product that you think is not designed for your needs, then why you get angry about it?? This makes so little sense to me.

Right!?! Or to think that there's not a market for it because it doesn't meet your needs, LOL! It's not for me, but I need another analog synth like I need a hole in the head.

The soul of a synth is the Filter, the Amplifier(transistor mixer in the case of moog) and the Oscillator, and i even dare to say it's in this exact order

Absolutely, some people even put the VCA and any associated non-linearities in front of the oscillator in importance, YMMV and all that.

I'm totally ok with 17ms, but anything bigger migh be an issue.

It does seem a bit high, but not all that high. One thing to consider is that this doesn't also add the input latency of your sound card because it isn't being used. So you would add that 17ms to the output latency of your soundcard.

I think that's workable for a lot of things. I regularly play with 20ms. I can't play guitar with 20ms, but keyboards are ok.

[Cinebient]

O.k......the filter sweep is also what got me a bit. It really sounds like nothing i could do with my software synths yet.....i tried it.
Before i judge it up or down i will wait for some reviews. Can´t be too long and i might even take one for the team and test it myself.
Life is too short. Have fun or let it be folks.

[SLiC]

Classic KVR- 18 pages of opinions on something no one has actually used

Personally I remain open minded and look forward to a real review.

[fisherKing]

Classic KVR- 18 pages of opinions on something no one has actually used

Personally I remain open minded and look forward to a real review.

+1

[ENV1]

I dont really get the product and who it is aimed for.... Im thinking gimmick..

It seems to be a direct competitor to the analog emulation VST market. By offering real analog over emulation, for around the same price. It all depends on whether people will buy it, at the end of the day, and my guess, people will.

Was going to say just that, so thanks for saving me the typing.

(Would only add the small physical footprint because its a significant factor too.)


That out of the way; right now people really shouldnt be too concerned with the views and opinions of other people. Some are just eager to find a cloud in every silver lining, and usually they do. For now i think the best attitude is 'wait and see', after all nobody here has even had any first hand experience with it, let alone time to put it through its paces and draw conclusions from that. This will all come in due time.



PS: No, i dont think this miniaturization concept will be the end of normal size synths, effects, stomps, rack modules, etcetera. These things will probably stay around forever in some form or other, although the electronics inside them will probably continue to get smaller over time as well. (As has always been the case.) What i do think possible however is that it might well be a first step towards a larger-scale replacement of 'software-analog' with real analog. Whether it will actually come to that will of course depend on how good this ultimately gets, i.e. whether there will be well-equipped polysynths with enough voices and a variety of monosynths that really 'cut it', etcetera. But if this is going to be the case, and there will be no problems from an operational point of view, (latency too high, other unacceptable restrictions), and the prices will be equal or virtually-equal to software offerings, a lot of people will probably start going for the real analog simply because it is really the real thing rather than a mathematically calculated approximation which gets them 'in the ballpark' as long as they are willing to sell a kidney for that last-gen hi-end CPU that just came out.

If these things were a lot bigger, say the size of a standard harddrive, the whole thing would probably fail. But since they are that tiny they will find a place in any setup, (even if you have lots of them), and IMO it will be this very aspect that will make the decision real thing vs approximation a nobrainer decision for many people in the future. (That and the price.)

[subterfuge]

Thanks ghettosynth for explaining so clearly and concisely in your reply at page 12 not only what this thing is/is not, but also for whom this may appeal. That was exactly what I was wondering about since I had personally no idea of such a potential user base with that kind of needs. Pretty much everybody I know who go hybrid want the full hands on control and also often independency from the computer.

[chk071]

Thanks ghettosynth for explaining so clearly and concisely in your reply at page 12 not only what this thing is/is not, but also for whom this may appeal. That was exactly what I was wondering about since I had personally no idea of such a potential user base with that kind of needs. Pretty much everybody I know who go hybrid want the full hands on control and also often independency from the computer.

Yeah. That's also why i'm not considering this, but, rather something like the Behringer D, if then. This thing doesn't give me any advantage over, say, something like NI Monark. "Fully analog", yeah, but, what's the difference in perceived sound quality? Maybe 5% at best.

[Highvoltage]

We need much more audio demos that is for sure.

[Matt-vank]

If i connect this to an Akai Mpc Renaissance(this Unit has to hubs). Did i get a stand alone Analog Synth?

[foosnark]

Firstly if this is a product that you think is not designed for your needs, then why you get angry about it?? This makes so little sense to me.

I wouldn't say I'm angry about it, but I'd say the concept is about 3 steps away from being something I might have found interesting up until I got into modular. It's missing the mark in important ways even so, though.

Now, a polivoks filter has never been emulated. It's very close sounding to to the MS-20...

In software, nope. In hardware, there are dozens of clones out there. You can get a Eurorack Polivoks clone built from the original schematic, with old-stock Russian parts, for $65.

I don't think they sound anything at all like an MS-20. I'm really not fond of the MS-20 sound myself.

[Highvoltage]

If i connect this to an Akai Mpc Renaissance(this Unit has to hubs). Did i get a stand alone Analog Synth?

Nope, it needs a specific driver and it's interface.

Dont know if you guys know it, but you can download the VST and it works. Ofcourse without sound, but you can try out the GUI