Fair enough, after all people don't have to do the scripting. It's just a surprising approach for a synth which was supposed to be less complicated, that's all.Urs wrote: Hehehe, calling Hive "nerdy" because it loads wavetables is a bit of a stretch.
Sure, we added this scripting thing. It may strengthen Hive's appeal to a geekier crowd, but for the user who isn't interested in editing wavetables, Hive is only getting what was asked for most: More Waveforms. A lot more.
Your opinion about Zebra 2
-
- KVRAF
- 35436 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
- u-he
- 28065 posts since 8 Aug, 2002 from Berlin
Hehehe, you are right! However...chk071 wrote:Fair enough, after all people don't have to do the scripting. It's just a surprising approach for a synth which was supposed to be less complicated, that's all.Urs wrote: Hehehe, calling Hive "nerdy" because it loads wavetables is a bit of a stretch.
Sure, we added this scripting thing. It may strengthen Hive's appeal to a geekier crowd, but for the user who isn't interested in editing wavetables, Hive is only getting what was asked for most: More Waveforms. A lot more.
... the idea is that the burden of geekiness is shifted towards sound designers who are ambitious enough to get into this. The geekiness is basically invisible to people who don't wish to dive in. That's why we're avoiding any means that makes weird things more prominent. No built-in waveform editor, no built-in script file editor. Just a browser for wavetables. And of course we'll pack the final version of this with a lot of content. I assume there'll be 200 ready-to-go wavetables, if not more. We'll see!
But another point: I wish I could with a happy smile in my face say "go folks, there are gazillions of wavetables freely available on the net". And yes there are. Only, after wading through hundreds, if not thousands, I was quite underwhelmed by a lot of it. Obviously, it's mostly the "turn a sample into a wavetable" issue discussed elsewhere. We needed something that lets us do great wavetables without sampling from a synth or another source. We started using Serum a bit, but the we wished for our own editor. So we made Zebra export wavetables. But those are pretty much Zebra, and already in Zebra. The scripting thing allows us to expand Hive in ways no visual editor can, and no sample conversion tool.
So it's not "hey, let's make Hive geeky". It's "hey, what gives us the best options for Hive?"
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
-
- Banned
- 29 posts since 31 Jul, 2018
That would be assuming that all developers are immune to self promoting and marketing. I've yet to see a developer talk negative about purchasing and using their products. They aren't even willing to point out their weaknesses, they would rather distract or redirect the questions.Urs wrote:chk071 wrote:I guess, the common place of users to confuse individual preference for product quality has driven many developers from public forums.
Public forums are meant for people to discuss products openly and freely without being attacked by a developer with a mission, to sell more products. If an idea doesn't fit into their road map, it's quickly brushed off with an excuse or sometimes attitude.
I would suggest that they use their own sub-forum or company forum, as it would be the best place to discuss these one sided discussions. It's probably better for developers to stay away from open discussions only to try and shut down an opposing opinion. That's not their job, back to coding works best.
I'm not saying that all developers don't know how to handle themselves in public forums, but to blame the users opinions as the common problem for quality control is plain pompous. The collection of users opinions are what makes the products better and ultimately satisfy their customer base. Without customers you wouldn't have a company and without their opinions you would only have a product that satisfies the company's needs.
-
- KVRAF
- 35436 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
I'd disagree, and say that it very well lends itself to wavetables. I don't think it's so different to VA. Both is usually packed into a subtractive synthesis engine, and you only need few more paramaters, e.g. to scan through the wavetables, and can use the existing modulation system for those. I think it's great that Hive has more waveforms, and even wavetables now, i'm just not sure how many really will fiddle with the scripting. I mean, it really sounds great on paper, but, for example, there's no visual display of the waveforms or wavetables, which is already a negative point for me.fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
Anyway, as it's only for the creation of wavetables (as far as i understood it), and it's not a feature you necessarily have to use, or deal with, it should be fine for most users, i guess, and those who want to delve into it don't have to use an external editor.
Last edited by chk071 on Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- KVRAF
- 23102 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia
Hive is by design a wavetable synth (just like Synlenth).fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
Scripting allows you to create wavetables algorithmically, instead of via samples.fluffy_little_something wrote:And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
-
- addled muppet weed
- 105872 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
there was an audible "woosh!" as that just flew over my headEvilDragon wrote: Scripting allows you to create wavetables algorithmically, instead of via samples.
ill leave that up to the "nerds" and continue to stand on the shoulders of giants
- KVRAF
- 25446 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
It is a subtractive synth. Not an analog emulation.fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
Scripting allows one to generate complex wavetables via formula.
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
So, it produces waveforms from formulae so to speak, maybe with a bit of random when putting them in tables?EvilDragon wrote:Hive is by design a wavetable synth (just like Synlenth).fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
Scripting allows you to create wavetables algorithmically, instead of via samples.fluffy_little_something wrote:And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
- KVRAF
- 25446 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
Not just waveforms... wavetables from formula... so for example, you can generate a sine that then is 'FM'ed' or a sawtooth with a filter sweep or a triangle that morphs into a square and then a saw... and so on.fluffy_little_something wrote:
So, it produces waveforms from formulae so to speak, maybe with a bit of random when putting them in tables?
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
What's complex, the waveforms or the way they are arranged or scanned in the table?pdxindy wrote:It is a subtractive synth. Not an analog emulation.fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
Scripting allows one to generate complex wavetables via formula.
Yes, analog as in subtractive, old-skool
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
So, you are automating synth features and modulations into the oscillator?pdxindy wrote:Not just waveforms... wavetables from formula... so for example, you can generate a sine that then is 'FM'ed' or a sawtooth with a filter sweep or a triangle that morphs into a square and then a saw... and so on.fluffy_little_something wrote:
So, it produces waveforms from formulae so to speak, maybe with a bit of random when putting them in tables?
-
Sampleconstruct Sampleconstruct https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=191286
- KVRAF
- 16153 posts since 12 Oct, 2008 from Here and there
- KVRAF
- 6980 posts since 28 Dec, 2015 from Atlantis Island
One of the most comprehensive, most well-engineered and most universal synths on the market...
https://sonograyn.bandcamp.com/music Experimental Ambient
https://martinjuenke.bandcamp.com/music Alternative Instrumental
https://martinjuenke.bandcamp.com/music Alternative Instrumental
-
- KVRian
- 1134 posts since 22 Aug, 2004 from Edge City, the Low Country
fluffy_little_something wrote:Hive and wavetables seems a strange combination to me. I always thought of it as an analog-type synth.
And what exactly does scripting affect or allow? Just an example, as I have no idea. I see it more and more often though, Lua scripting in particular...
Urs just wrote the first of a number of tutorials about it:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=511486