Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Effects discussion
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Saw
KVRist
104 posts since 20 Sep, 2006

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:46 am

https://www.liquidsonics.com/software/illusion/

I can not understand what is the root difference from Seventh Heaven :?

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VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8737 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:05 am

Seventh Heaven is IRs from a Bricasti M7

Theres seems to be no indication on the site what hardware they sampled for Illusion.

woggle
KVRAF
2364 posts since 24 Nov, 2012

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:24 am

VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:05 am
Seventh Heaven is IRs from a Bricasti M7

Theres seems to be no indication on the site what hardware they sampled for Illusion.
reads like they have modelled the process based on Fusion-IRs
"A suite of highly advanced reverberation technologies synthesise Fusion-IRs to your precise specifications without the use of an external library of sampled impulse responses."

don't have the money for this one but Reverberate is pretty good so I wold try this out if I were a bit richer

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VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8737 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:44 am

Right, so they have another technology theyre coining 'Fusion-IR | Synthesis'

Not to be confused with 'Fusion-IR'

woggle
KVRAF
2364 posts since 24 Nov, 2012

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:47 am

VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:44 am
Right, so they have another technology theyre coining 'Fusion-IR | Synthesis'

Not to be confused with 'Fusion-IR'
one could be cynical about it :) but I am going to think they have learned from experience and this reverb is probably the best so far

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VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8737 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:49 am

woggle wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:47 am
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:44 am
Right, so they have another technology theyre coining 'Fusion-IR | Synthesis'

Not to be confused with 'Fusion-IR'
one could be cynical about it :) but I am going to think they have learned from experience and this reverb is probably the best so far
Then I must haz it !

(I need another verb like I need another delay or compressor)

woggle
KVRAF
2364 posts since 24 Nov, 2012

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:52 am

VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:49 am
woggle wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:47 am
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:44 am
Right, so they have another technology theyre coining 'Fusion-IR | Synthesis'

Not to be confused with 'Fusion-IR'
one could be cynical about it :) but I am going to think they have learned from experience and this reverb is probably the best so far
Then I must haz it !

(I need another verb like I need another delay or compressor)
me too! as a safety precaution I have no intention of even trying it

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XComposer
KVRist
268 posts since 18 Aug, 2006 from Italy

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:54 am

Yes, first it seems that Illusion is not limited to the simulation of a specific hardware of the past, so it should be regarded as the successor to Reverberate 2 (and not to Seventh Heaven).

Second, the IR samples are not really present in a library, but they are recreated artificially on the fly (synthesized).

I really wonder if it is really worth the money in my case, since I have already (or will probably have soon) both Reverberate 2 (with real IR) and algorithmic reverbs known for creating realistic simulation of real spaces well, like 2CAudio Aether and Acon Digital Verberate. I'm curious to see how will it perform if compared to these two. Let's see.
www.GKweb.it
Mac, OS X 10.11, Logic Pro X

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VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8737 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:18 am

If you own Reverberate 2 and Seventh Heaven Professional you can get Illusion for under $95 before 1 December!
Look like I may have to eat my own words :hihi:

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VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8737 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:30 am

Well is sounds lovely.

Comparing it with 7th Heaven, Reverberate and HD Cart (which has a much louder output than the others incidentally) it sounds completely different.

Cant be tweaked realtime though as need to update its 'calculations' which takes a few seconds.

Setting the Spectrum Analyser to default to off doesnt seem to work (win10 64bit).
Just want to see if it lowers CPU a little as closing the GUI shaves off 1%.

liquidsonics
KVRist
496 posts since 30 Jan, 2009 from UK

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:57 am

VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:30 am
Well is sounds lovely.
Thank you
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:30 am
Cant be tweaked realtime though as need to update its 'calculations' which takes a few seconds.
Some stuff can be done live such as the filters, but certainly some of the more structural changes need that time to update.
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:30 am
Setting the Spectrum Analyser to default to off doesnt seem to work (win10 64bit).
Just want to see if it lowers CPU a little as closing the GUI shaves off 1%.
The 'show spectrum analyser' setting in the settings menu just changes the default view not to be the spectrum analyser. So it doesn't turn it off as such, it changes the view you'd see when the plugin is loaded up.
Matt
www.liquidsonics.com
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
11433 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:05 am

This seems like it is similar to H-Reverb, no? Reading in between the marketing, which is thick with this tone for sure, they seem to be synthesizing Fusion-IRs and then using those IRs in the reverb, no?

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aMUSEd
KVRAF
30649 posts since 14 Sep, 2002 from In teh net

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:18 am

Would have rather seen these developments go into Reverberate 3

liquidsonics
KVRist
496 posts since 30 Jan, 2009 from UK

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:32 am

ghettosynth wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:05 am
This seems like it is similar to H-Reverb, no? Reading in between the marketing, which is thick with this tone for sure, they seem to be synthesizing Fusion-IRs and then using those IRs in the reverb, no?
Waves' tech in H-Reverb is not to be confused with Fusion-IR Synthesis which is fundamentally different in a number of key ways to do with the reverb generation and modulation, though I don't want to offer a blow-by-blow comparison of a competitor product of course as it'll just come across as me saying x y and z is better when it's best for people to decide if they prefer it or not themselves.
aMUSEd wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:18 am
Would have rather seen these developments go into Reverberate 3
The majority of features in Illusion can't be applied to sampled impulse responses, so Illusion and Reverberate 2 cannot be combined in this way into a Reverberate 3. It would seriously over-complicate an already complex beast which for most people would really detract from the new capabilities on offer which is why I did not consider going down that path.
Matt
www.liquidsonics.com
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
11433 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Re: Illusion - new reverb from LiquidSonics

Post Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:42 am

liquidsonics wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:32 am
ghettosynth wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:05 am
This seems like it is similar to H-Reverb, no? Reading in between the marketing, which is thick with this tone for sure, they seem to be synthesizing Fusion-IRs and then using those IRs in the reverb, no?
Waves' tech in H-Reverb is not to be confused with Fusion-IR Synthesis which is fundamentally different in a number of key ways to do with the reverb generation and modulation, though I don't want to offer a blow-by-blow comparison of a competitor product of course as it'll just come across as me saying x y and z is better when it's best for people to decide if they prefer it or not themselves.
I'm sure, but, the differences were not my point so much as the similarity is. You are generating IRs on the fly and then using those IRs in a convolution reverb, no?

I'm making no judgement to sound quality here, only commenting on the similarity because it does impact usability. Moreover, the ability, of this reverb to be of sonic interest like H-verb, comes down to how well you can generate/simulate those spaces. My comment about H-Verb was just a first shot at categorizing this reverb in terms of where it fits in the reverb spectrum. Of course there are going to be differences, but, to be clear, one of the reasons that I like Reverberate 2 is that it loads Waves IRs and I use it much more as just an IR verb that is super flexible as I do a Fusion-IR verb.

I understand that any firm has a need to capitalize on their technologies as best as they can with respect to what kinds of products the market has shown a willingness to buy, but, these kinds of generative IR products are less interesting to me than either pure algorithmic reverbs or more traditional IR reverbs. I too would have preferred to see Reverberate 3 as opposed to this approach.

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