Hive update plan

[zvenx]

I really don't get it.
You don't ever have to roll your own wavetable.. it will come with tons that you can use as you use almost like any other oscillator......Just those who want to roll their own. Can.

rsp

[u-u-u]

Maybe BDeep's arguments come from the fact that many software synths try to be 'mind-blowing'. They're packed with redundand UI, badly integrated 'features' and require a lot of mouse work. Main thing is that they actually are powerful but everything the user does cannot be reused very well. Then they have a overwhelming user interface which makes people buy the plugin but because everything else is implemented so badly and inconsequently they'll quickly loose interest.
I think the original concept of Hive tackles many of these problems and as Urs stated, it will remain the main focus of the plugin. And as he explained it, even the new wavetable(scripting) addition follows this concept in a certain way.

The one 'problem' some could be: With each single added wavetable, Hive could become a totally different synth. So the user's focus could be shifted from fine tuning synth parameters more towards searching for the best wavetables. What could be lost is the focus on gaining a deeper understanding of a few high-quality sound modules towards 'cheap'(-feeling) sorting of good/garbage wavetables/scripts. So that's why Urs' mention of a well-curated selection of factory wavetables is important not to overlook.

[Urs]

what I'm learning is today is you really don't HAVE to though. the functions of the physical interface allow you to mix waves and mash different wave tables together to build new waves without the scripting, and it's fun, and it sounds real nice.

This is not quite true. That is the thing we actually didn't do (like, Vector Synthesis) because *that* would add a level of complexity to "using Hive" that we found inappropriate.

Again, you can use any .wav in Serum format. Any of those evil "scripted wavetables" can be printed to .wav, opened in a wave editor of your choice and manipulated. I just don't think this is what people do. I think most people just use the wavetables available. Occasionally, in some of those synth, people draw a waveform, but those are usually the lesser interesting results. Making your own wavetables is overrated. Having a developer (or sound designer) produce a set of carefully chosen, great sounding wavetables is a lot more fruitful.

Use a wavetable called "Saw Sync" to create the sound of synced sawtooth oscillators. It's that simple.

[Howard]

Actually the scripting language is not hard at all, it's the current lack of documentation and easy to follow examples that makes it look complicated and hard to learn. It took me about two weeks of blind experimenting until it finally clicked and I started making scripts where I understand what I'm doing, for the most part And the problem wasn't in trigonometry functions (which I knew nothing about - and it turned out you don't need to understand this at all) but rather in very basic ideas behind the scripting itself. Like that the result of each formula line is just the amplitude of a single sample. And the formula is evaluated for each sample in the frame, step by step, from sample 1 to sample 2048. And that's how the waveform is drawn. After I realized that, everything else became clear. Two weeks though

Re "everything else became clear" - for me too, but only for a few days. After long breaks I found I had to relearn. The penny did not drop easily (might be an age thing, though).

[spunkmuffin]

I didn't program the Saw wave that comes in Hive either but I can use it without any semblance of guilt.......

I always feel guilty using u-he synths, it's like I'm playing with Urs' tool(s).

[hakey]

A four frame wavetable split over two multitables with Env/LFO/XY modulation of Position and Multi Position gets somewhat close to Vector Synthesis, no?

[Dasheesh]

Well, at the moment I'm having troubles getting off this "motorcity" wavetable. But, now that I said that it's going to be the center piece of the next 20 edm tracks you hear and I can see where this could be heading. A spire like purchase as you go and wind up with 20 of the same preset kind of deal. I'm going to learn how to work this script. I don't have a choice. It's not that I can't, it's a matter of want to. I really don't see how that's "easier", but the rewards might be worth it. It is fun, and it does sound good.

[Dasheesh]

I mean, I'm not new to synthesizers man. I have been around... but this is geeky shit. stuff I've never seen before. I like it, I do, but don't tell me it's easier. I can't keep on with this, I got a learning curve to get over.

[Howard]

A four frame wavetable split over two multitables with Env/LFO/XY modulation of Position and Multi Position gets somewhat close to Vector Synthesis, no?

Or a 16 frame wavetable split into 4 multitables

[Urs]

The one 'problem' some could be: With each single added wavetable, Hive could become a totally different synth. So the user's focus could be shifted from fine tuning synth parameters more towards searching for the best wavetables. What could be lost is the focus on gaining a deeper understanding of a few high-quality sound modules towards 'cheap'(-feeling) sorting of good/garbage wavetables/scripts. So that's why Urs' mention of a well-curated selection of factory wavetables is important not to overlook.

Yep. I think there is no point to add 137 PWM wavetables which differ only in very subtle nuances.

We'll probably have 100+ for Hive 1.2, and we'll fill in the blanks for Hive 2.0

No-one gets forced to use any waveform beyond that.

[Urs]

A four frame wavetable split over two multitables with Env/LFO/XY modulation of Position and Multi Position gets somewhat close to Vector Synthesis, no?

Exactly. But we don't need to add any complex joystick envelope which may be confused with XY controls.

[Urs]

The penny did not drop easily

There will be a video. A very simple animation can clear things up easily.

[drzhnn]

After long breaks I found I had to relearn. The penny did not drop easily (might be an age thing, though).

Totally normal! The trick is not minding to relearn Recently, I had to fill in some papers and it turned out I forgot how to handwrite. And my signature. Haven't been in need of these retro skills for a while

[surreal]

I think you're insane if you brush these new features off as "inaccessible". You're offended because you get the most efficient, highest quality wavetable engine on the market which doesn't oblige you to wade through any visual clutter? Two extra buttons and 3 submenus suddenly make Hive unusable for you so you won't touch the damn thing?

Please sell "the damn thing". Someone out there will be very, very happy.

Seriously, haven't read anything as awkward in a while.

I absolutely love this new addition and expansion to Hive.. I just wish I had the time to understand the scripting part and be more actively involved with Hive but Urs please dont pay attention to the Naysayers... I mean its not like the functionality of Hive is taken away by these advancements.. I am so glad that I bought Hive and that Urs is sticking to inproving a great synth!! I really hope though that the price to the v2 will be low enough for me to upgrade as I have no funds for the v2 upgrade.. I wish I could help like in terms of beta testing so that I could earn my way to version 2

[EvilDragon]

oops dblpost