What is it about Sylenth1 ?

[layzer]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

[Examigan]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

A good sound designer can work with nearly any synth and make it sound great.

I do wish they would add a few things to Sylenth1, like PWM, throw in a couple more LFOs (and add a "Delay" control to them), more modulation slots, and to improve or at least enhance the reverb.

[layzer]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

A good sound designer can work with nearly any synth and make it sound great.

I do wish they would add a few things to Sylenth1, like PWM, throw in a couple more LFOs (and add a "Delay" control to them), more modulation slots, and to improve or at least enhance the reverb.

more features means more code, means more cpu usage, more knobs, more complexity. that is why i dont like "do it all" fat hog synths. i find a few simple synths that make sounds i like, with all their limitations.... Charlatan and synth1 for example. but hey use what works for you.

[Examigan]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

A good sound designer can work with nearly any synth and make it sound great.

I do wish they would add a few things to Sylenth1, like PWM, throw in a couple more LFOs (and add a "Delay" control to them), more modulation slots, and to improve or at least enhance the reverb.

more features means more code, means more cpu usage, more knobs, more complexity. that is why i dont like "do it all" fat hog synths. i find a few simple synths that make sounds i like, with all their limitations.... Charlatan and synth1 for example. but hey use what works for you.

Ok, then maybe just PWM.

[fluffy_little_something]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

Of course some paint is better than other paint. Like with every other category of products, there is a certain quality spectrum, even if the functions and features are the same.

[vurt]

purple is the best paint.

[layzer]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

Of course some paint is better than other paint. Like with every other category of products, there is a certain quality spectrum, even if the functions and features are the same.

still doesnt matter if you suck at painting

[jancivil]

It's more like saying 'this paint looks better than that paint', or once we're actually painting *something* 'this color paint looks better than that color paint'.
In the abstract there is nothing there: again you can talk about 'this filter is zero delay' or 'this paint does better hiding and is more durable' but we were talking about 'this synth sounds better than' which has no application thus no context; you could use 'the better paint' and it looks like shit for some reason.

This distinction is pretty basic reasoning. But no, stick to your guns.

[fluffy_little_something]

It's more like saying 'this paint looks better than that paint', or once we're actually painting *something* 'this color paint looks better than that color paint'.
In the abstract there is nothing there: again you can talk about 'this filter is zero delay' or 'this paint does better hiding and is more durable' but we were talking about 'this synth sounds better than' which has no application thus no context; you could use 'the better paint' and it looks like shit for some reason.

This distinction is pretty basic reasoning. But no, stick to your guns.

Do you really think developers program 0df filters for fun or boredom, or because they work hand in hand with Intel, trying to force customers to get the latest and greatest processors?
I don't think so, they do it because those filters sound better.

[fluffy_little_something]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

Of course some paint is better than other paint. Like with every other category of products, there is a certain quality spectrum, even if the functions and features are the same.

still doesnt matter if you suck at painting

But if you are good at painting, better paint might render your paintings even better. Painters have been working on perfecting paints for hundreds of years.

[fluffy_little_something]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

A good sound designer can work with nearly any synth and make it sound great.

I do wish they would add a few things to Sylenth1, like PWM, throw in a couple more LFOs (and add a "Delay" control to them), more modulation slots, and to improve or at least enhance the reverb.

If you use only one layer, you could use the other layer's amp envelope to modulate the LFO's gain. I know, it is anything but elegant

[Examigan]

You know what? Let's do that. Let's ask Urs and Richard which sounds better.

Zebra 2 or Dune 2

They'll either

1. Diplomatically skirt the issue

2. Say THEIR synth sounds better

3. Not say anything

You brought them up so come on, let's do it. Let's ask them to pick between Dune 2 and Zebra 2.

This should be interesting.

actually, no synth sounds better than another... they just sound different. its up to your musical skills to really make any synth
sound good.

its like saying this paint is better than that paint, but really no paint is good if you suck at painting.

A good sound designer can work with nearly any synth and make it sound great.

I do wish they would add a few things to Sylenth1, like PWM, throw in a couple more LFOs (and add a "Delay" control to them), more modulation slots, and to improve or at least enhance the reverb.

If you use only one layer, you could use the other layer's amp envelope to modulate the LFO's gain. I know, it is anything but elegant

Hey that's a good idea, but it's still a workaround. One more knob can't be added? It seems most LFOs have a delay control. Anyway, I still like Sylenth1.

[fluffy_little_something]

As far as I'm concerned he might simply replace the Offset control with a Delay control. But I suppose that's not possible because of patch compatibility...

[Examigan]

One tidbit of info I am not sure if some people know about: Back when I first had Sylenth1... at a certain point Lennard asked what some people might like as presets for it. I requested a few, and they ended up in the 4th bank (and maybe other banks ...not sure) that you can load into it. It shows off some of the different types of sounds you might not otherwise think of making for the synth.

[BONES]

There is no right or wrong when it comes to opinion.

Of course there is. e.g. If I told you the sky in Sydney today was the same shade of green as a football field, would that opinion seem valid to you in any measure? No, you would instantly dismiss it. Similarly, anyone who tries to tell you that DUNE's filters "sound cold and digital" should instantly lose all credibility with anyone who has actually worked with DUNE's filters. And that's the thing, one ludicrous statement like that must call into question every other opinion that person has given. i.e. If they are so wrong on that point, what's the chance they are right about anything else? Opinions are easily graded, from credible to worthless and that is what people need to realise.

A more accurate one would be that some men find Marilyn Monroe to be the most beautiful while others prefer Gina Lolobrigida. Which one would be "right"?

That's more a case of a poorly worded opinion because what those two people would actually be talking about is which woman they find more attractive. Their bias is exposed with someone like Siouxsie Sioux, who is not a beautiful woman by any stretch of the imagination but, at the same time, is as sexy as hell and does it for me big time. If someone who finds her as attractive as I do can't admit that she's not actually that good looking, then that person is operating under a massive delusion, which is that "because I find myself attracted to her, she must, by default, be beautiful". But that's not how attraction works.

That's what we get here, a bunch of people who really like Sylenth 1 so, because of that, they believe that it has to be a really good synth. They can't even admit to themselves that it has some serious flaws or that there are clearly superior alternatives. Honestly, how hard is that? I can do it - I can hear what an amazing synth DIVA is, it's perfectly plain for anyone to hear, but that doesn't mean I have to have it or even have to like it. Ditto for DUNE - I actually hate it overall because I hate working with it but you simply can't deny that it sounds amazing, possibly better than anything else ever. That said, I have never put it into anything, because I hate working with it. It's only in so many of our songs because my bandmate sticks it in there and I can't find anything that sounds better to replace it (which makes me hate it even more!). But in these other people's minds, if they like something it HAS to be good or their whole self-centred world view might be shattered and reality might come flooding in.

Actually, I find my analogy better because you have picked and narrowed it down to what many people consider two very good-looking women. It's like asking what is better, a Ferrari or a Lamborghini?

Actually, that is a very easy one, depending on the model. If you are comparing say a Ferrari 488 to a Lamborghini Hurracan, two models in the same lofty price range, the Ferrari is definitely the better car but I'd still take the Lambo, because I prefer what Lambo does to what Ferrari does, and even if I was getting lapped by a 488 at a track day, I'd still be happy with my Huracan because I know I'd be having more fun.

That's what you and others need to be able to do - separate what you like from what is actually good. But you can't, you have to believe that you can't like it unless it's actually really good. It is a very common human trait that I find frustrating as hell. I like plenty of things that I know are krap, e.g. I have an irrational attachment to my four year old 8" windows tablet and probably to my near decade old Zune HD. Both are actually near to useless these days but I just love them and I'll possibly never get rid of either. So what? I know they're krap by current standards, I don't need to think that they are somehow better than an iPad or iPod or anything else. It's a krap little tablet and an ancient mp3 player that both make me smile every time I pick them up and that's more than enough.

But you can't even admit that something as clearly superior in almost every way is better than your beloved Sylenth 1 and that just makes you look like a fool who has no clue. When you get to the stage where you can say "Sylenth 1 can't hold a candle to DUNE or Diva but I still like the way it sounds and it's always been easy for me to work with", then people might nod their heads and say "I get that" but while you desperately cling to this notion that Sylenth 1 is actually up there with those other synths, it's almost impossible to respect your opinions at all.

If you had seen how many amazing presets I had to pass on when I was looking for presets for you to emulate last night, because they used more than two of DUNE's layers or were using the MSEGs, you might start to get an inkling of how big the yawning chasm is between the two. Even with Thorn, I had to bypass a lot of great sounding presets because they used non-standard waveforms or the Glitch Seq or something.

Please quantify better. I'm still waiting for somebody in this world to objectively quantify one synth sound as "better" than another synth sound.

It's too broad a question because, just as with cars, there are too many use-cases to take into account. That's why most car magazines and websites categorise their "best of" rankings. But sometimes you get a car with talents that cross categories. e.g. Lamborghini's Urus is nominally an SUV but it is so bonkers that it would give a lot of pure-bred sports cars a run for their money, which makes it easy to say it's better than other SUVs that can't match it's performance. So if you want the best SUV but don't buy a Urus, it's only because you can't afford one (or can't justify the price), not because it isn't quantifiably the best SUV.