why no dry/wet knob on flange mode in Satin ?

[Captain]

Sorry for resurrecting this old topic, but I just ran into the same situation myself, and couldn't find anything official or more recent on the subject. I also want to add the wonderful flange effect into the whole mix by inserting Satin to the master bus, but as it is, the effect is a little too... strong. A little less of it would be perfect for this track.

Since the effect works by fading in the virtual "tape2" until the "volumes match" (according to manual), why not let us set the maximum level of tape2 to something less than tape1's volume? Wouldn't this be the easiest and most elegant solution? I know I could use various tricks to add a global dry/wet mix to the whole plugin, but something in that idea bothers me, and simpler is always better...

[sascha]

Point taken. I'll note down that request and it might most probably find its way in on next occasion.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Point taken. I'll note down that request and it might most probably find its way in on next occasion.

Sascha, what would it take to also convince you to an add an LFO for the flange mode? I mean, I get that you were going for authenticity at the time, but nowadays you guys are putting LFOs and a mod matrix in a spring reverb plugin! Surely adding a simple sine LFO to a tape flanger is less "out there" than that.

[sascha]

I can also file that as request but it must be decided. Thing is the flanger in Satin was designed as a one-stop effect, and we always pointed out the difference between this one and an lfo-based type.

[EvilDragon]

I'm so glad that every plugin gets a dry/wet knob in Reaper.

[sleepcircle]

Aren't I glad that Reaper allows any plugin to have a dry/wet control.

I'm so glad that every plugin gets a dry/wet knob in Reaper.

[mutantdog]

Memories of TheoM and Urs arguing at length about the legitimacy of dry/wet knobs in tape plugins.

[Googly Smythe]

The Range control reduces the amount of the effect. Does change the character of the effect, though.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

I can also file that as request but it must be decided. Thing is the flanger in Satin was designed as a one-stop effect, and we always pointed out the difference between this one and an lfo-based type.

I hear ya, but 1) an LFO still makes a lot of sense in flanger mode, 2) Satin already does things a tape machine can't (multitap delays for example), and 3) would be totally in line with more recent U-he products like ColourCopy and Twangstrom. If it wouldn't be a huge effort, try it out internally and ask, "could this be musically useful?" I think the answer will be, "oh yeah!" I've found ways to fudge the result, but having it built in would be much better IMO.

[Captain]

Point taken. I'll note down that request and it might most probably find its way in on next occasion.

Great, thank you a million! As I see it, setting the maximum volume for tape2 would also be perfectly possible in real life (and probably the best way to control the strength of the effect), so adding the option wouldn’t break authenticity in any way.

The problem with a regular dry/wet control in any plugin that messes with pitch/time is that you easily get some unwanted chorusing/phasing/etc. In case of Satin, mixing dry & wet seems to work OK when you just remember to set wow & flutter to zero. But still, again, there's something in the very idea that doesn't sit well with me... I'd rather have the whole song go through the basic tape effect, and just introduce the flange when needed, at a level I can define.

[Krakatau]

In case of Satin, mixing dry & wet seems to work OK when you just remember to set wow & flutter to zero

interesting kind of random modulation of a chorus effect, though...

[Captain]

In case of Satin, mixing dry & wet seems to work OK when you just remember to set wow & flutter to zero

interesting kind of random modulation of a chorus effect, though...

Sure, it might also be a desirable effect sometimes

EDIT: I managed to do a makeshift wet/dry control in Logic with Reaktor: insert it in the master bus after Satin, take sidechain input from the same bus (it's taken before the insert FX), and create a simple ensemble to crossfade between sidechain & input signals. I just need to manually compensate Satin's latency by inserting a delay in Reaktor to align the signals... which is not very beautiful (as the latency might change due to several factors), and definitely makes this a kludge of the worst kind. But well, it works for now.

[sleepcircle]

yeah, the 50% wet + wow/flutter thing would make it very easy for inexperienced users to make a hash out of their tracks. probably for the best that the plugin doesn't come with one by default.

Flange mode is a different matter, of course, cause they're not supposed to be aligned anyway.