Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Discussion about: tracktion.com
globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:55 am

I have just purchased an Akai MidiMix and am trying to get it setup in Waveform 9. Are there any default templates floating around or does one have to Mackie setup? The knobs and faders should be fairly easy, but I am worried that getting the buttons to work is another matter. The MidiMix has 8 x mute, 8 x rec / arm, as well as "send all", "bank left", "bank right" and "solo buttons. The Akai website has no information at all about Waveform 9 configuration, unlike Nektartech...

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:20 am

Why not Mackie?
The 'Send all' is the only thing I don't recognize from there...
Edit: looking at the low price control surface, seems there will be extra knobs though (too! :party: )
The send all not likely supported outside live - sends all settings at once...

(How's it feel? Might buy one... :dog: )

globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:36 am

NTO wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:20 am
Why not Mackie?
The 'Send all' is the only thing I don't recognize from there...
Well, I don't know anything about getting into or setting up the MidiMix in Mackie, and then there is the question of how the MidiMix is configured for Ableton and FL Studio as I sometimes switch between DAWs, to try to learn more about how to do things.

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:40 am

Haven't looked at the user guide yet. MCU is no brainer for FLS, and the MCU scripts are there in live too, though I didn't use them, and looks like there's new for this device (live 10+ only?)
EDIT: It's been around longer than I knew...

EDIT later:
Yeah, they're not saying:
Most of MIDImix’s controls may be automatically mapped to control various trackspecific
parameters in your DAW.

Likely to be MCU (HUI less often)
They do provide an editor download.

EDIT even later:
Dunno. Only post i've seen so far on their forum. From 3 years ago!
The MIDIMix was always designed to utilize the MIDI learn capabilities of your DAW, but you're right, Mackie or HUI integration could go a very long way. I think that's an important consideration for any device with control surface parameters.

I will be happy to submit a feature request for you here!

http://community.akaipro.com/akai_profe ... idimix-hui


Since you have it, would be trivial to try in FLS. If you find it detected. Select MCU for its type. Go into the mixer. Solo/mute are pretty unique. Faders/balance should be there right off.
Master does the title bar level control.
:pray:

globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:04 am

OK, here is what I have found. The MidiMix editor allows changing cc, nt or ch values. In Waveform 9, I have set the MidiMix as both a MIDI device input and output (under "midi devices" in settings). Under "settings - > control surfaces", I have added the MidiMix under "Mackie Control Universal" for both input and output.

In Midi Learn, I have tried to get the mute button of my first (top) track in a project associated with the mute button of the first column on the MidiMix. This button doesn't make any discernible changes. Neither does the mute buttons in column 2 or 3. However, the "rec arm" button in column three will solo the second track. The mute button in column 4 will solo the 3rd track, and the "rec arm" button in column 4 will solo track #5. The mute button in column 5 will solo the 6th track, and the "rec arm" button in column 5 will solo track #8. And the weirdness continues with muting tracks, when I press other mute and "rec arm" buttons.

I am experiencing the same weirdness with knobs and faders some knobs or faders will change the pan values for a track, but I have so far been unable to change volume levels at all. Some things (like the mute button on column 6) could be moved in the MidiMix editor to column 1, but that doesn't solve the problems with values that refuse to change with any of the current values...

edit ---
OK,I got the knobs and faders to work with pan and volume controls without having to use Mackie (MCU), however the buttons continue to elude me.

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:15 am

Sorry to hear it's such a struggle. :o Guess I won't buy one! :lol:
Too bad Akai didn't/won't do the 'standard'. :dog:

My Korg Taktile 49 which does MCU emulation, gives me faders, solo/mute/rec/ and balance by default in WF9 mixer using the MCU selection :party:

EDIT: That makes me remember something. The Korg does that emulation under its 'Cubase' setting. Akai has a Cubase template you can load into the MidiMix.
:idea: :!: You could load that template and try IT as MCU in WF9...

globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:57 am

I followed the instructions for opening and loading to hardware the Cubase script, set MCU on in Waveform 9 for the MidiMix, but didn't see any difference in behavior. I also tried with a Novation Launch Control XL that I have and again the same thing: knobs and faders work - pads do not. I am not even sure how Midi Learn works with the mute / solo plugin, as pressing the "m" or "s" in Midi Learn simply mutes or solos the track... Not to mention trying to set the master volume, where the prompt for master pan or master volume prevents actually moving the master volume meter in Midi Learn, so that it can be set to a fader.

It seems at this stage that it is more important what controllers of the Akai MidiMix / Novation Launch Control XL type actually work! The Korg nanoKONTROL 2 isn't totally uninteresting, but it has too few knobs and faders for my taste...

globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:29 am

Anyone? Hmm. OK, I have some more information... I have figured out how to set mute and solo correctly in Midi Learn mode. The track needs to be highlighted and then a track values section appears in the control panel. Mute and solo can be set from there and should be registered in Midi Learn. Unfortunately, there still isn't any progress with the MidiMix buttons, even after I set all of the buttons in the MidiMix editor to CC rather than Note values. Waveform 9 just sits there and gives a "Listening..." message. However, with the buttons set to CC values and the MidiMix set to MCU, the following does occur:

Muting the first track in Waveform 9 turns on the mute button light in column 6. No light enabled when soloing the track.

Muting track two - nothing happens. Soloing track two lights the "rec arm" button in column three.

Muting track three lights the "rec arm" button in column six. Soloing track three lights the mute button in column four.

Muting track four lights the mute button in column seven. Soloing does nothing.

Muting track five doesn't do anything. Soloing lights "rec arm" in column four.

Muting track six lights "rec arm" in column seven. Soloing lights the mute button in column five.

Muting track seven lights the mute button in column eight. Soloing does nothing.

Muting track eight does nothing. Soloing track eight lights the "rec arm" button in column five

I don't know what all of this means, but hopefully someone will...

BTW, should anyone wonder, I am spending so much time on this as it was my intention to use the MidiMix with my laptop, when I need to be mobile. A MIDI keyboard controller is too big - if it has just an approximation of the knobs and faders that the Akai MidiMix has.

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:17 am

I hate trying to type a reply from my phone, so this'll be brief.
Have you been using the MMix editor to see what the controls are set to? Make changes?
Also you can use something like midiox to see what is sent.
The midi sequences will have discernable structure. You must align your objectives with your observations.
In addition, unsure of the impact of setting MCU, then using midi learn upon it. You must insure a known WF9 state for each trial run.

globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:51 am

NTO wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:17 am
Have you been using the MMix editor to see what the controls are set to? Make changes?
Yes. It appears that it is only possible to change the buttons between "note" and "cc" values.
NTO wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:17 am
Also you can use something like midiox to see what is sent.
Here are the values (the first 16 are for the mute buttons and the second set are for the "rec arm" buttons underneath:

TIMESTAMP IN PORT STATUS DATA1 DATA2 CHAN NOTE EVENT
(mute buttons)
00002E90 2 3 B0 01 7F 1 --- CC: Modulation
00002F9A 2 3 B0 01 00 1 --- CC: Modulation
00006DBF 2 3 B0 04 7F 1 --- CC: Foot Controller
00006E8A 2 3 B0 04 00 1 --- CC: Foot Controller
0000B176 2 3 B0 07 7F 1 --- CC: Volume
0000B240 2 3 B0 07 00 1 --- CC: Volume
0000D35B 2 3 B0 0A 7F 1 --- CC: PAN
0000D407 2 3 B0 0A 00 1 --- CC: PAN
0000E530 2 3 B0 0D 7F 1 --- Control Change
0000E5CC 2 3 B0 0D 00 1 --- Control Change
0000ECDE 2 3 B0 10 7F 1 --- Control Change
0000ED7A 2 3 B0 10 00 1 --- Control Change
0000F759 2 3 B0 13 7F 1 --- Control Change
0000F7E6 2 3 B0 13 00 1 --- Control Change
000105FA 2 3 B0 16 7F 1 --- CC: 22 (E-MU)
00010696 2 3 B0 16 00 1 --- CC: 22 (E-MU)

("rec arm" buttons)
0001699F 2 3 B0 03 7F 1 --- Control Change
00016A79 2 3 B0 03 00 1 --- Control Change
000172B3 2 3 B0 06 7F 1 --- CC: Data Entry MSB
0001738D 2 3 B0 06 00 1 --- CC: Data Entry MSB
00017AEF 2 3 B0 09 7F 1 --- Control Change
00017BC9 2 3 B0 09 00 1 --- Control Change
0001808A 2 3 B0 0C 7F 1 --- Control Change
00018155 2 3 B0 0C 00 1 --- Control Change
000185D7 2 3 B0 0F 7F 1 --- Control Change
00018693 2 3 B0 0F 00 1 --- Control Change
00018CE9 2 3 B0 12 7F 1 --- Control Change
00018D95 2 3 B0 12 00 1 --- Control Change
00019468 2 3 B0 15 7F 1 --- CC: 21 (E-MU)
00019504 2 3 B0 15 00 1 --- CC: 21 (E-MU)
00019C73 2 3 B0 18 7F 1 --- CC: 24 (E-MU)
00019D0F 2 3 B0 18 00 1 --- CC: 24 (E-MU)
NTO wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:17 am
The midi sequences will have discernable structure. You must align your objectives with your observations.
Ummm, say what? You lost me here.
NTO wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:17 am
In addition, unsure of the impact of setting MCU, then using midi learn upon it. You must insure a known WF9 state for each trial run.
What would that known WF9 state be? I am completely new to DAWs and only have one project :)

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 5:07 am

Still phone
I'm sure it's possible to change the cc values there too. (For knobs and faders, switches likely momentary or latch only)

Setting a known initial state is for the manual (?).

Discernable structure:
00019C73 2 3 B0 18 7F 1 --- CC: 24 (E-MU)
00019D0F 2 3 B0 18 00 1 --- CC: 24 (E-MU)
This is cc24 on channel one, on then off.

If you wish to diagnose midi, you'll have to learn midi.
Not trivial - not impossible.

NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 6:26 am

In example, dump for a knob (CC16) moving
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NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 6:34 am

Clarification maybe
Above was in MCU protocol.
Here's an ordinary channel 1 CC16. Note Data 2 changing for control moving...
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globetrotterdk
KVRist
32 posts since 22 Nov, 2018

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:28 am

Here is a screenshot of the MidiMix editor with current hardware settings:
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NTO
KVRist
133 posts since 8 Feb, 2011

Re: Akai MidiMix setup for Tracktion Waveform 9.

Post Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:59 am

That's an actual upload from the controller to the editor, not a view of the default template?
Yeah, there's a pattern to it. Knobs and faders contiguous in one group, switches in another. All on channel 1.
Certainly NOT MCU! :lol:

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