Apple to recent purchasers of Logic 6: f**k off

[munchkin]

In my case, I finally upgraded to logic pro about 10 days ago. I have owned Logic/Logic Audio since version 1.2 and spent an awful lot of $ over the years on it. The upgrades ($699 for the first one and $299 for the second) will have cost me as much as they are charging for the full version of version 7.

People who argue that well, it's great software, and worth $1000 are totally missing the point. I have essentially been given NO credit at all for owning the software at all, and I've had to buy it new, essentially. That totally sucks.

The salesperson that I spoke to at Apple obviously thought it sucked too, but really couldn't say anything...

Before I begin I have to declare I'm a long term PC user of Sonar and recent purchaser of Ableton Live. I'm shocked reading this thread! Not just at Apple's behaviour in this matter but at some of the replies that excuse this behaviour.

I've just bought Stylus. There's a free upgrade to Stylus RMX to everyone who bought Stylus in 2004. Now if a smallish company like Spectrasonics can offer its customers this then how can a large company like Apple not do the same for customers who bought Logic 10 days before the release of a new version? It beggers belief!

Remember Peter Finch's character in Network? "We're mad and we're not going to take it anymore!"

[bugs]

The thing that kills me about Mac users is that the worse they are treated by their beloved Apple, the greater their product loyalty. They're like Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

[Quakemazer]

... Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[AD80]

I think its terrible that Apple did that to you recent Logic 6 guys. I'm not a Logic user but if I was I would be pissed. Good luck gettin it sorted. Hopefully a more fair upgrade path will come up. Anybody who thinks this is fair is a brainwashed psyco.

[VicDiesel]

It's a whole bunch of stuff for $300.

The $300 is good value for money, but you're kinda forced to buy the new synths even if you only record guitar and vocals, and the pitch correction even if you only use softsynths, because you want to keep up with the improvements and bug fixes to the basic host.

So there may be $100 worth of real upgrades and $200 of new instruments, but you're forced to buy both.

In my case, I don't need the instruments of the new features, so I'll be happy to wait a while.

Need to save my money for a bass viol.

V.
(edit for spelling)

[droolmaster0]

The thing that kills me about Mac users is that the worse they are treated by their beloved Apple, the greater their product loyalty. They're like Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

[droolmaster0]

The thing that kills me about Mac users is that the worse they are treated by their beloved Apple, the greater their product loyalty. They're like Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

oops -sorry about that - hit send without meaning to...

I think that's a bit unfair...what is loyalty in my case? I have used Logic for years, since well before Emagic was bought out by Apple. I have always thought that it was the best sequencer - at least the one that I worked most efficiently with. And, I thought that Emagic used to be pretty fair, as a company.

So, should I punish myself now by never upgrading? Buying another product I believe to be inferior? I'm not sure exactly what form of 'non-loyalty' I should manifest...

[shamann]

See, I don't think it's fair or unfair of Apple. I just think it's to be expected.

The question was asked why a small company like Spectrasonics can offer customer benefits but a large company like Apple doesn't. But the question answers itself. Spectrasonics likely has to offer something to keep its foot in the door, and if not a splashy deal, at least solid evidence of its loyalty to its customers. Apple's business model doesn't rest on software, Spectrasonics' does.

If Apple were a software company, OSX would be sold for the x86 platform, and Logic wouldn't have disappeared from the PC world. But that just isn't the way it is. More to that, consider what software Apple makes that does run on PCs. The only one I can think of is iTunes, and why's that? Because it sells iPods - lo, more hardware.

At small companies they talk about staying alive, at big companies they talk about market growth and wallet share. How can we keep sales going and how can we get our customer base to need us whole hog. Sometimes it's package deals, or better rates, or all-in-one billing, like they do at banks, insurers and phone companies. Or sometimes it's what Apple did with Logic - buy an existing customer base and turn them into an exclusive market. If you want to use Logic, you have to use a Mac, pure and simple.

The thing that kills me about Mac users is that the worse they are treated by their beloved Apple, the greater their product loyalty. They're like Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

I don't think I'd go that far. I would say that they've bought into what they thought was a lifestyle, but really were just dealing with a business. You only matter to Apple as much as you bring in to the coffers. Once the transaction is done, both parties have been satisfied. You don't like the way they treat you as a paying customer? Yeah, but what have you done for them lately?

I have used Logic for years, since well before Emagic was bought out by Apple. I have always thought that it was the best sequencer - at least the one that I worked most efficiently with.

The thing is, you paid Apple and Emagic for the software you've used. If it has served you well, all the better. But you didn't pay them for exclusive dominion over your loyalty. Loyal customers aren't happy customers to them, they are paying customers. The sooner I realize that I, the great individualist, do not matter beyond the transaction, the happier I'll be at the end of the day.

If you like Logic enough to upgrade, then Apple will be happy to sell it to you. If the upgrade doesn't work for you, then on the upside you still have the software you've purchased and used all these years. And for Appple, you still have a Mac. Nothing is forcing you to upgrade, and your sense of missing out on something without the upgrade means nothing to a company like Apple, except maybe as a sign of a marketing job well done.

Contrary to what the adverts would have you believe, lifestyle and commerce are mutually exclusive things.

Cheers,
Steve

[AD80]

My friend just told me that some NI instruments and some other 3rd party plugs dont work with Logic 7 . Can anybody confirm this? I doubt its true, just curious.

[milko]

i sit back and read the different complaints every time a update comes out. But please think of the guys out there who:
1) Been using logic since Notator purchased every upgrade along the way
2) Purchased all the now included software plug-ins and even the controller
3) Were using a PC

i think you know where the guy who just purchased logic can stick there upgrade....

[xoxos]

i'll always love emagic for their spicy wit.. called their ca. office to complain about waiting on the phone all day for assist, and was told in a very dry voice, "the *way to think of it* is to be glad we're not charging you to wait"

what a c**t. what a line for a c**t to say.

outstanding show, emagic. at least a bit of tracing paper over a comb doesn't make your soul vomit.

[droolmaster0]

I have used Logic for years, since well before Emagic was bought out by Apple. I have always thought that it was the best sequencer - at least the one that I worked most efficiently with.

The thing is, you paid Apple and Emagic for the software you've used. If it has served you well, all the better. But you didn't pay them for exclusive dominion over your loyalty. Loyal customers aren't happy customers to them, they are paying customers. The sooner I realize that I, the great individualist, do not matter beyond the transaction, the happier I'll be at the end of the day.

If you like Logic enough to upgrade, then Apple will be happy to sell it to you. If the upgrade doesn't work for you, then on the upside you still have the software you've purchased and used all these years. And for Appple, you still have a Mac. Nothing is forcing you to upgrade, and your sense of missing out on something without the upgrade means nothing to a company like Apple, except maybe as a sign of a marketing job well done.

Contrary to what the adverts would have you believe, lifestyle and commerce are mutually exclusive things.

Cheers,
Steve

I have no illusions at all about Apple caring about me. My argument is pretty simple. I can, of course, choose not to upgrade. Ultimately, I can never upgrade my computer, or my software. I do want the features in the new version. The point isn't whether it is worth $299 or not. I never claimed that it isn't, and that is totally beside the point. I can choose to upgrade because it is better for me, and also think that Apple are being asses in the way the are handling the upgrade. I simply can't see why some people think that is contradictory. Certainly I can choose not to positively reinforce any large corporations that piss me off and not purchase any of their products. but, unfortunately, I don't see how I come out ahead that way.

[bugs]

The thing that kills me about Mac users is that the worse they are treated by their beloved Apple, the greater their product loyalty. They're like Bush supporters--cattle with madcow disease.

oops -sorry about that - hit send without meaning to...

I think that's a bit unfair...what is loyalty in my case? I have used Logic for years, since well before Emagic was bought out by Apple. I have always thought that it was the best sequencer - at least the one that I worked most efficiently with. And, I thought that Emagic used to be pretty fair, as a company.

So, should I punish myself now by never upgrading? Buying another product I believe to be inferior? I'm not sure exactly what form of 'non-loyalty' I should manifest...

No, you don't have to punish yourself. Get a Windows or a Linux machine. The Apple devotees believe there own propaganda. Macs are not the best machines, the Mac OS is not the best operating system, Logic is not the best sequencer. Much of the best software doesn't even run on the Mac--that's punishment enough--and for that you have to pay through the nose. Apple has you convinced that fewer options for more money is what you want and you believe them. Check out the L-Rock machines if you want really highend equipment, check out Linux or XP Pro for really stable operating systems and check out Nuendo if you want a really highend production system.

[Quakemazer]

They've got you by the balls, and they know it.
It's just a shame that the companies policies are those of heartless blood suckers.

Hope you get a reduced update.

[shamann]

I can choose to upgrade because it is better for me, and also think that Apple are being asses in the way the are handling the upgrade. I simply can't see why some people think that is contradictory. Certainly I can choose not to positively reinforce any large corporations that piss me off and not purchase any of their products. but, unfortunately, I don't see how I come out ahead that way.

My point was never a call to abandon large corporations, just know what they are and how they operate in advance. In fact I encourage you to spend your money in whatever way you see fit, big corporation or not.

The point is that your relationship with Apple ended with your previous transaction. That's just the nature of the beast. At what point is a previous customer in any way entitled to special treatment? How does that benefit the company? In the previous case, it benefits Spectrasonics by building and retaining a modest customer base. In Apple's case, it doesn't benefit them one bit, because they already have you all over.