The Wagtunes Corner (Featuring My Best Yet)

[wagtunes]

Peace Of Mind

Brilliant lyrics, catchy melody ok mix... and i know you know....bass is lacking.

trust me on this, if you want everyone to stfu about the bass, try to get the freq balance as close to the yellow line in this analysis pic.

then again i respect your desire to give it the 1920s record player sound if thats how you
like it to sound. after all pleasing yourself comes before pleasing everyone else is what really matters.

Wouldn't that much bass be overpowering? As it is, the way it is now is just about as much as I can stand. Yes, I grew up in the 60s listening to AM radio and when I walk past cars playing hip hop with those bass lines to the point where that's all you hear, it makes me want to shut my ears. I hate it. If that's what I have to do to get people to stfu about my bass then no thanks. I'll just continue to make music that I can tolerate listening to.

Getting back to your SPAN graphic, the bass is ABOVE everything else in volume? Really? How do people listen to music like that? Sorry, no can do. Not at the expense of my hating everything I make.

Thanks for the feedback though.

[wagtunes]

Peace Of Mind

Brilliant lyrics, catchy melody ok mix... and i know you know....bass is lacking.

trust me on this, if you want everyone to stfu about the bass, try to get the freq balance as close to the yellow line in this analysis pic.

then again i respect your desire to give it the 1920s record player sound if thats how you
like it to sound. after all pleasing yourself comes before pleasing everyone else is what really matters.

Okay, I went over your SPAN in detail. Here's what I don't understand. You've got your bass peaking and booming at around 50 and -5 db. This will completely stomp all over your kick drum. If you'll notice, my kick peaks around 60 and my bass around 100. Won't a kick below 60 just sound like thumping mud?

Sorry, can't get into this modern "let's blow out our subs" mentality of the guys making music today. If that makes me a dinosaur. oh well, whatever.

[layzer]

if you roll off sharply at 50hz no, it wont sound like thumping mud, it will sound full and balanced with the highs.
i don't like over bearing bass either. but i do like balance and from all the spec analysis i've done on many many pro
tracks i always see the roll off at around 50hz for most genres of music. people expect the overall tone of
music to sound balanced, when its not, you will hear it from multiple people. its like cooking. if it needs salt,
somone will say "hey, this needs salt"

[ghettosynth]

I was just kidding about the bass, but then, I was listening on my laptop. Just out of curiosity though Wags, have you played around with maxxbass or renbass from Waves? They can add perception of low fundamental bass without actually adding any fundamental bass. Instead, it adds bass harmonics and the listener's brain inserts the missing fundamental. It can be a way to add the perception of bass without adding mud to the low end.

I liked the song though, nice 80s throwback without copping completely to 80s stylisms.

[wagtunes]

I was just kidding about the bass, but then, I was listening on my laptop. Just out of curiosity though Wags, have you played around with maxxbass or renbass from Waves? They can add perception of low fundamental bass without actually adding any fundamental bass. Instead, it adds bass harmonics and the listener's brain inserts the missing fundamental. It can be a way to add the perception of bass without adding mud to the low end.

I liked the song though, nice 80s throwback without copping completely to 80s stylisms.

Don't have Maxxbass but have heard it mentioned often. Perhaps I'll get it. Most Waves stuff is pretty cheap if you wait long enough.

[wagtunes]

if you roll off sharply at 50hz no, it wont sound like thumping mud, it will sound full and balanced with the highs.
i don't like over bearing bass either. but i do like balance and from all the spec analysis i've done on many many pro
tracks i always see the roll off at around 50hz for most genres of music. people expect the overall tone of
music to sound balanced, when its not, you will hear it from multiple people. its like cooking. if it needs salt,
somone will say "hey, this needs salt"

Yeah but then where is the kick supposed to go? It can't be at 50 and I don't know any kicks below that that don't sound like total crap.

Also, I notice in your SPAN that you show a dip around 3k or so but if you look at my SPAN there is no dip there. So I have to wonder how you're even coming up with these graphs. Is Voxengo SPAN not accurate? I find that hard to believe as so many people use it.

[layzer]

if you are talking about "dragon slayer" the bass synth and kick both peak at around 50hz. but they both roll off sharply beyond that, and the sum of their energy stays within the ideal freq spectrum slant. the 3-5khz cut is sometimes done to reduce the nails on the chalkboard frequencies.

[wagtunes]

if you are talking about "dragon slayer" the bass synth and kick both peak at around 50hz. but they both roll off sharply beyond that, and the sum of their energy stays within the ideal freq spectrum slant. the 3-5khz cut is sometimes done to reduce the nails on the chalkboard frequencies.

No, I'm talking about the SPAN you posted that supposedly shows the SPAN of the track that I made showing where I'm deficient. It shows a dip in the 3-5k area for MY track, but as you can see by looking at my SPAN there is no dip there. So is this NOT a SPAN of my track? I'm confused.

Also, if the bass and kick both peak at 50, how is the kick even heard? I was taught that you do not have the kick and bass frequencies overlap on top of each other. So if the kick peaks at 50, the bass should be above that, say at 60, so you can hear both. Is this wrong? Was I taught incorrectly?

This whole thing is starting to become very frustrating because it seems everybody has their own idea of what an "acceptable" SPAN is for a track.

Anyway, please look at the SPAN I posted for MY track. Does this match your own readout for MY track? If not, what is wrong with my Voxengo SPAN. Am I using it incorrectly? How can you use a SPAN incorrectly?

ARRRRGGGGG!!!!!

[layzer]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

i was going for a less prominent, low kick tone for Dragon Slayer.
but like i said, the sum energy of the bass and kick remained within the ideal slant.
both can be heard as they are both mixed with equal energy.

[wagtunes]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

Well then if my Voxengo SPAN isn't accurate what am I supposed to do? What program do YOU use and can I get it in 64 bit because I know you use 32 bit OS?

[layzer]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

Well then if my Voxengo SPAN isn't accurate what am I supposed to do? What program do YOU use and can I get it in 64 bit because I know you use 32 bit OS?

seven phases spec analyzer,

yeah, its 64bit too, give it a spin...
https://sevenphases.wordpress.com/spectrum-analyzer/

[The Noodlist]

Delete.

[wagtunes]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

Well then if my Voxengo SPAN isn't accurate what am I supposed to do? What program do YOU use and can I get it in 64 bit because I know you use 32 bit OS?

seven phases spec analyzer,

yeah, its 64bit too, give it a spin...
https://sevenphases.wordpress.com/spectrum-analyzer/

Okay, I downloaded and installed it and ran it on the track.

What you're showing is just one snapshot in time. I changed the settings to show peaks and set it to infinite time so that when the song ends you can see the peaks at each level. There is no dip between 3 and 5k if you show peaks. Sure, you can show a snapshot at any second in time that can show all sorts of things but it's meaningless.

My Voxengo is fine. Spectrum Analyzer shows the same thing.

Yes, my bass starts at 100. There is nothing at 50. Hell, there's nothing at 80. But there is no dip between 3 and 5k.

[wagtunes]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

Well then if my Voxengo SPAN isn't accurate what am I supposed to do? What program do YOU use and can I get it in 64 bit because I know you use 32 bit OS?

seven phases spec analyzer,

yeah, its 64bit too, give it a spin...
https://sevenphases.wordpress.com/spectrum-analyzer/

But you still didn't answer my question. If the kick and bass both roll off sharply at 50, how do you hear the kick over the bass if they're both taking up the same frequency range?

[layzer]

oh, ok you are talking about my spec graph of YOUR song,
well still, Etienne1973's spec graph also shows the 3khz dip so maybe voxengo span is lying to you...lol
that however isnt as noticeable as the bass.

Well then if my Voxengo SPAN isn't accurate what am I supposed to do? What program do YOU use and can I get it in 64 bit because I know you use 32 bit OS?

seven phases spec analyzer,

yeah, its 64bit too, give it a spin...
https://sevenphases.wordpress.com/spectrum-analyzer/

But you still didn't answer my question. If the kick and bass both roll off sharply at 50, how do you hear the kick over the bass if they're both taking up the same frequency range?

come on wags... think... the kick has a sharp attack and different harmonics in the higher freq's. and has a narrower stereo image. if i want it more prominent, i can tune the kick higher into the 100hz+