Soundtheory GULLFOSS computional auditory perception EQ

[sleepcircle]

.. - / .-- .- ... -. .----. - / .-..-. --. --- -.. .-.. .. -.- . / .-. . ...- . .-. . -. -.-. . --..-- .-..-. / .. - / .-- .- ... / - .... . / --- .--. .--. --- ... .. - . .-.-.- / .. / .--- ..- ... - / .-- .- -. - . -.. / -.-- --- ..- / - --- / ... . . / - .... . -- / .- ... / .--. . --- .--. .-.. . / .- -. -.. / -. --- - / .- ... / .- / .-..-. ..-. .- -.-. . .-.. . ... ... / -.-. --- .-. .--. --- .-. .- - .. --- -. .-..-. / --- ..- - / - --- / --. . - / -.-- --- ..- .-.-.-

[plexuss]

Yeah... that's the thing, I have little tolerance for that kind of thing these days. We are being ripped off left right and centre. I am pushing back. Sorry to those it may annoy, that's not my intent. I am usually pretty clear about who I direct my posts too.

It works like this for me: if the idea is to do things in a way that we would want, vs the abuse we usually get, then a company wouldn't take your money and not give you anything for it for an undefined amount of time and not give those that paid a definite delivery date - they wouldn't take your money until there was a product to be sold. I dunno... that's just what makes sense to me in terms of changing things around from the status quo. onward and upward...

[sleepcircle]

Well you got your money back in 30 minutes so, if nothing else, I was right that they're not being "nefarious."

[plexuss]

Well you got your money back in 30 minutes so, if nothing else, I was right that they're not being "nefarious."

That's where we disagree. I feel, at the very least, it's nefarious to set expectations that sound like a firm date but are strategically designed to be squishy. And then when called on it, use the loophole as an out. To someone I paid a good amount of money and got nothing in return, that approach is intolerable. There's already another license in the forsale for $85. I'll wait until its real before considering buying back in.

[sleepcircle]

idk how you can rationalize all this. it wasn't a loophole, it was almost everywhere: they said "a few months," which is between 2 and 4 months, it is now only a couple weeks longer than the original 3 month mac early-access period. it hasn't been like a year or anything.

you took advantage of a deal for windows-only beta-testers when you had no intention of beta-testing for windows, you weren't happy that you had to wait so long for the beta to be over before you got to use it for mac, demanded your money back with promises that you would escalate with paypal before even giving them a chance to say yes or no, got your money back in half an hour, then—not content with this—went around being subtly insulting about them on another forum.

[Ploki]

<morsecode on>

<morsecode off>

can you just do morsecode off altogether next time ?

[plexuss]

<morsecode on>

<morsecode off>

can you just do morsecode off altogether next time ?

Ha! I'll try. I just went with the flow on that one. I thought, "I wonder if I should post in morse code. What would it look like and how would people respond. It was an experiment on a thread on a topic that was not that important so I decided to try it. Just for my own amusement. Sorry if it annoyed you. I'll leave <morsecode off>... for now..

[plexuss]

idk how you can rationalize all this. it wasn't a loophole, it was almost everywhere: they said "a few months," which is between 2 and 4 months, it is now only a couple weeks longer than the original 3 month mac early-access period. it hasn't been like a year or anything.

you took advantage of a deal for windows-only beta-testers when you had no intention of beta-testing for windows, you weren't happy that you had to wait so long for the beta to be over before you got to use it for mac, demanded your money back with promises that you would escalate with paypal before even giving them a chance to say yes or no, got your money back in half an hour, then—not content with this—went around being subtly insulting about them on another forum.

We have different opinions on this. My position in general is that with software companies I make purchases from, its a business relationship. There is an exchange of money for the license to a product. In this case it was more complicated: for $99 you get a windows beta license and after the beta it converts to a full license and a mac license. So for me, who is on a mac, this is a way to get the mac license cheaper. There was no "scheme" on my part. Critical to my purchase decision was their timeline - I would never buy vapourware without knowing a release date. Here is their guidelines from their site posted in Feb 2019, edited for brevity:

When we release the Windows version of Gullfoss there will be an Early Access phase that will last for a few months. ... Any user can purchase a license for $99, but the half-price licenses will not be able to be used on Mac until we are out of Early Access. (This could be as late as Easter 2019.)

Two points: Sound Theory advocate the purchase of the windows beta for mac users as long as the customers understands the constraints (I did), and the release "could be as late as Easter 2019").

Initially I extend a certain amount of trust in order to build the relationship so I was willing to over-look the words "could" and "might" and take this to mean they have set the expecation to release by Easter (April), give or take a month or so I think it reasonable. When questioned, they engaged their loophole "might" and let everyone know they did not actually set a firm date. They then repeated the same strategy, giving quantitative dates again but always backing out when they missed them with the use of their loophole. This errods my trust.

And, it's now July. I gave them 3 months past their first self imposed deadline to get it together and they haven't and now they will not commit to anything other than it coming out at some unknown point in the future.

That's where I'm out. There are risks with software as you are probably aware - companies going out business, changing terms of service, servers go down, people dissapear with your money and leave you with little or nothing. It happens all the time with audio software so the risks are real and common, unfortunately. I also take into account track record - Sound Theory have little to no track record - their track record is pretty much how they are handling this beta release (poor). Yesterday a user on gearslutz asked them if it would be released within "3-4 months" or "3-4 weeks" - now they have smartened up and wont answer that question. So to me the release date is nebulous, the risks are higher. If anyone else wants to stick through it, great, I wish you well. But I am not, for all these reasons.

[jbraner]

Hey sleepcircle,

we live in a bizarre time, and there are some people here who have some pretty bizarre ideas about what is "right" and what is "not right" or "not fair" or whatever.

I think the pattern seems to be that more bizarre your ideas are - the longer your posts are
(so I better keep this short )

Anyway, it's not worth pushing your point, but I bet there are many more among us who agree with you, but can't be bothered arguing with alternate "facts".

EDIT: Maybe the weirdness was more on the Gearslutz thread...

JB
windows user
no mac
no problems with Soundtheory

[v1o]

idk how you can rationalize all this. it wasn't a loophole, it was almost everywhere: they said "a few months," which is between 2 and 4 months, it is now only a couple weeks longer than the original 3 month mac early-access period. it hasn't been like a year or anything.

you took advantage of a deal for windows-only beta-testers when you had no intention of beta-testing for windows, you weren't happy that you had to wait so long for the beta to be over before you got to use it for mac, demanded your money back with promises that you would escalate with paypal before even giving them a chance to say yes or no, got your money back in half an hour, then—not content with this—went around being subtly insulting about them on another forum.

We have different opinions on this. My position in general is that with software companies I make purchases from, its a business relationship. There is an exchange of money for the license to a product. In this case it was more complicated: for $99 you get a windows beta license and after the beta it converts to a full license and a mac license. So for me, who is on a mac, this is a way to get the mac license cheaper. There was no "scheme" on my part. Critical to my purchase decision was their timeline - I would never buy vapourware without knowing a release date. Here is their guidelines from their site posted in Feb 2019, edited for brevity:

When we release the Windows version of Gullfoss there will be an Early Access phase that will last for a few months. ... Any user can purchase a license for $99, but the half-price licenses will not be able to be used on Mac until we are out of Early Access. (This could be as late as Easter 2019.)

Two points: Sound Theory advocate the purchase of the windows beta for mac users as long as the customers understands the constraints (I did), and the release "could be as late as Easter 2019").

Initially I extend a certain amount of trust in order to build the relationship so I was willing to over-look the words "could" and "might" and take this to mean they have set the expecation to release by Easter (April), give or take a month or so I think it reasonable. When questioned, they engaged their loophole "might" and let everyone know they did not actually set a firm date. They then repeated the same strategy, giving quantitative dates again but always backing out when they missed them with the use of their loophole. This errods my trust.

And, it's now July. I gave them 3 months past their first self imposed deadline to get it together and they haven't and now they will not commit to anything other than it coming out at some unknown point in the future.

That's where I'm out. There are risks with software as you are probably aware - companies going out business, changing terms of service, servers go down, people dissapear with your money and leave you with little or nothing. It happens all the time with audio software so the risks are real and common, unfortunately. I also take into account track record - Sound Theory have little to no track record - their track record is pretty much how they are handling this beta release (poor). Yesterday a user on gearslutz asked them if it would be released within "3-4 months" or "3-4 weeks" - now they have smartened up and wont answer that question. So to me the release date is nebulous, the risks are higher. If anyone else wants to stick through it, great, I wish you well. But I am not, for all these reasons.

I think we are all mature enough to know that with software development things don’t always go smoothly. Sometimes beta software can end up in lengthy delays. I don’t think Soundtheory ever did anything wrong, in that they never gave an exact date, they only provided a rough estimate for what was a complete unknown. No one can predict the future with complete accuracy. Even in business relationships, where let’s say a software publisher is working with external developers, it is not entirely unusual or even unprofessional for there to be delays sometimes in delivering the finished code for unforeseen reasons. In hindsight if your requirements were time critical it perhaps would have been best to have gotten the Mac version instead.

[v1o]

So, soundtheory copy protection was never cracked, windows iLok verison comes out and is already cracked.

I'm really really failing to see the point of implementing Pace garbage into it, and I'll keep using the original CP till the end, and after, if its cracked, i'm going to use the cracked version (while buying the upgrades) just so i can avoid Pace...

No it isn’t.

[Ploki]

So, soundtheory copy protection was never cracked, windows iLok verison comes out and is already cracked.

I'm really really failing to see the point of implementing Pace garbage into it, and I'll keep using the original CP till the end, and after, if its cracked, i'm going to use the cracked version (while buying the upgrades) just so i can avoid Pace...

No it isn’t.

yeah, no.
I found it on a tracker in March cracked for windows, no Mac version, according to users there, it works.

By the way, I have had absolutely 0 issues with the original licensing method since i bought it in December.

[Mathematics]

I've just started messing around with Gullfoss. How do you guys use it most effectively? It seems like it works the absolute best on busy and well-mixed EDM tracks.

[Mathematics]

White noise is harsh on the ears...so I've created this test. I ran pink noise and white noise through this thing. When I run White noise, and Recover. It tries to level what it can in the lows by INCREASING the lows to try to match the Pink Reference Curve whilst leaving frequencies above 400Hz somewhat unaffected with a -2db attenuation and a bump around 16k. When I use Tame, it ATTENUATES the upper band so that the sound is nearly pink noise.

Here is White Noise through Gullfoss with maxed Recover and Tame: (look familiar?)
 

White.JPG

 
 
Here is Pink Noise through Gullfoss with maxed Recover and Tame: (almost no change)
 

Pink.JPG

 
 
Here is Span analyzing Gullfoss with White Noise running through it. Tame and Recover maxed:
 

White SPAN.JPG

 
 
Here is just pink noise through SPAN, nothing else:
 

Pink Reference.JPG

[Mathematics]

So, Gullfoss is dynamically trying to make the signal reference pink noise. It has a limit though...it will only do a 9db gain and an 8db attenuation at most. Hmm...they have to fix the issue where the mouse pointer covers the frequency when you click in the spectrum window above the 0db line and to the left of 640Hz.