Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Effects discussion
perfumer
KVRist
493 posts since 4 Oct, 2018

Post Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:09 am

egbert wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:12 am
I was just curious as to your knowledge or guesswork wrt the lack of oversampling.
I'd expect their newer plugins have some kind of internal optimisations for this. E.g., Primal Tap, the reverb....

jens
KVRAF
19640 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:25 am

egbert wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:12 am

Seems like Decapitator has pretty bad aliasing at 44.1 kHz (at the time of publication of this article, at least)
No, it has the least aliasing out of these four plugins.

10k is pretty darn high btw. - not something you'd get normally much of with recorded program material...

egbert
KVRAF
4018 posts since 21 Oct, 2001 from my bolthole in the south pacific

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:33 pm

jens wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:25 am
egbert wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:12 am

Seems like Decapitator has pretty bad aliasing at 44.1 kHz (at the time of publication of this article, at least)
No, it has the least aliasing out of these four plugins.

10k is pretty darn high btw. - not something you'd get normally much of with recorded program material...
The foldover peaks just demonstrate the aliasing - of course a single 10 kHz sine wave is not program material anyone is going to use in real life. The extra peaks on the decapitator test would not be there if internal OS were used - the graph for the 44.1 kHz would look like the 96 kHz one if 2x OS were used.

Voxengo has optional oversampling settings on quite a few of his plugins like Elephant and some of the comps and other processors. You can pick from a drop down menu 2x, 4x,8x etc. PSP has HQ modes that are switchable. The idea being to eliminate the foldover artifacts in the audio band. Kinda suprised that here we are in 2019 - 25 years or so after VST plugins tipped up - and this is not standard practice.

elnn
KVRist
304 posts since 4 Nov, 2011 from Tleat

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:52 am

Delay time automation
Brzzzzzzt.

MikeCallon
KVRist
336 posts since 2 Jan, 2004

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:51 am

An excellent upgrade price for version 5 bundle owners :D

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Home Studio 87
KVRist
54 posts since 17 Jul, 2003

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 3:57 am

MikeCallon wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:51 am
An excellent upgrade price for version 5 bundle owners :D
:hihi: :hihi: :tu:
Gigabyte GA-X99P-SLI / Intel Corei7 6800k / 32 Go DDR4 / 3x SSD / Win 10 Pro x64 / UAD Apollo Twin USB / UAD2 Satellite Octo USB / UAD2 Octo PCIe / Cubase Pro 10 / VEP6 / D-Touch / 24 ch X-Touch / Console 1 / CMC Controllers / Komplete Kontrol S61 MK2 /

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c_voltage
KVRian
1389 posts since 16 May, 2004 from Soviet Union

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:42 pm

elnn wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:52 am
Delay time automation
Time is automatable in delays (both), or what was meant.

AllMac
KVRer
6 posts since 23 Aug, 2019

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:55 pm

Sound toys needs to grow more in sound quality, i think it offer great experimental approaches, but it doesn't sounds PRO at all.

v1o
KVRAF
1821 posts since 2 Oct, 2004

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 2:39 pm

I don't know how they stay in business. They haven't made a new product in years. If they actually made new stuff or even updated the bundle I'd buy in an instant.
Orion Platinum, Muzys 2

v1o
KVRAF
1821 posts since 2 Oct, 2004

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 2:53 pm

AllMac wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:55 pm
Sound toys needs to grow more in sound quality, i think it offer great experimental approaches, but it doesn't sounds PRO at all.
Well the Soundtoys plugins have been used on countless now classic records. That sound has become immortalised and is now highly sought after.

The Soundtoys guys know what their doing they used to make hardware rack gear and FX pedals at Eventide in the 80s.
Orion Platinum, Muzys 2

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cryophonik
KVRAF
5296 posts since 7 Sep, 2006 from Elk Grove, CA

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 4:20 pm

I can’t see them doing (and personally don’t want from them) something as vanilla as another boring ass compressor, since they’re generally more into creative effects (hence their name). I do like their recent trend of modernizing some niche vintage effects, but also wouldn’t mind seeing their take on a transient designer.

Also, as cool as the rack is, I’ve always sorta wished for a single streamlined multi-effect that features the key parameters from FilterFreak, EchoBoy, Decapitator, and maybe PhaseMistress, with the usual modulation and sequencing. Maybe that’s just me, though? :shrug:

egbert
KVRAF
4018 posts since 21 Oct, 2001 from my bolthole in the south pacific

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Fri Aug 23, 2019 9:35 pm

Have a look in their site, they are hiring. I can't see them folding their tent anytime soon.

jens
KVRAF
19640 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Sat Aug 24, 2019 1:56 am

egbert wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:33 pm
jens wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:25 am
egbert wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:12 am

Seems like Decapitator has pretty bad aliasing at 44.1 kHz (at the time of publication of this article, at least)
No, it has the least aliasing out of these four plugins.

10k is pretty darn high btw. - not something you'd get normally much of with recorded program material...
The foldover peaks just demonstrate the aliasing - of course a single 10 kHz sine wave is not program material anyone is going to use in real life. The extra peaks on the decapitator test would not be there if internal OS were used - the graph for the 44.1 kHz would look like the 96 kHz one if 2x OS were used.

Voxengo has optional oversampling settings on quite a few of his plugins like Elephant and some of the comps and other processors. You can pick from a drop down menu 2x, 4x,8x etc. PSP has HQ modes that are switchable. The idea being to eliminate the foldover artifacts in the audio band. Kinda suprised that here we are in 2019 - 25 years or so after VST plugins tipped up - and this is not standard practice.
You weren't actually replying at all to what I said, so I am a bit unsure why you were quoting me.


But let me reiterate what I meant in case it was unclear somehow:

1) 10k is really very high a signal.

http://pages.mtu.edu/~suits/notefreqs.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Range_(mu ... cal_ranges

2)

Of the four plugins tested, Decapitator clearly has got the least aliasing. (BX Saturator has got the most).

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whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
27519 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Sat Aug 24, 2019 2:20 am

AllMac wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:55 pm
Sound toys needs to grow more in sound quality, i think it offer great experimental approaches, but it doesn't sounds PRO at all.
Ah, yes, that makes sense; a company with one of the longest pedigrees in digital sound effects processing, which includes the designers of the Eventide H3000, don't know how to sound 'PRO'.

Sounds legit.

Please remind us all again what the metric for 'PRO' is?
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

perfumer
KVRist
493 posts since 4 Oct, 2018

Re: Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

Post Sat Aug 24, 2019 2:28 am

whyterabbyt wrote:
Sat Aug 24, 2019 2:20 am
AllMac wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:55 pm
Sound toys needs to grow more in sound quality, i think it offer great experimental approaches, but it doesn't sounds PRO at all.
Ah, yes, that makes sense; a company with one of the longest pedigrees in digital sound effects processing, which includes the designers of the Eventide H3000, don't know how to sound 'PRO'.

Sounds legit.

Please remind us all again what the metric for 'PRO' is?
That was the early nineties. And most of their effects are from mid-00'ies. I suppose that A LOT could be improved. Exhibit one: aliasing. Exhibit two: Phase Mistress. Not the most convincing phaser ever. Exhibit three: Echoboy. For all its pretences to sound 'analog', it's nothing of the kind. Read: fake.
Et cetera.

I'm not him, but I suppose he would argue something along those lines.

EDIT: Oh, and what is the metric? Current state of the art, of course. Please don't tell me that science is subjective.
Last edited by perfumer on Sat Aug 24, 2019 2:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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