KVR Audio

yellowmix · Post by **yellowmix** » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:06 pm

This is relieving to hear. For us customers and you as a developer, business, and person, as well as the industry as a whole. The intimacy KVR and other social platforms like Facebook and Twitter affords is new but professionalism has never changed. So thank you for recommitting it.

gentleclockdivider · Post by **gentleclockdivider** » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:40 pm

Tj Shredder wrote: ↑Sat Aug 31, 2019 5:04 am
FathomSynth wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:02 pmThe feedback loop in your diagram is obviously being used to signify something other than actually routing oscillator output to it's own modulator input. Until I know what that is I can not implement it.
It is just routing the output back to the modulator input. It does not need to know the output in advance, it takes recent values, its delayed and as IOC pointed out
the mean of the two previous samples
its also filtered. And there is an envelope on the amount of feedback, which is crucial... The DX feedback oscillator is a complex beast...
A classical biquad filter also has feedback btw. thats why they can blow up...; - )
Feedback in modular environments is the most interesting aspect of them. Their tendency to chaotic outcome brings life into sounds which are not possible else-wise...
Don’t bother to recreate a DX feedback oscillator, if someone wants to load DX7 sounds, there is Dexed for free. But think about allowing feedback in general...
Of course its dangerous and you could blow up your house with it when the speakers explode, but no risk no fun...

THe envelope that controls the feedback amount on a dx7 is from the same operator envelope .
Logical since the gain / amp envelope also determines how much is routed back to the input .
If you have a single operator which is feedback enabled (direct to output) , with a decaying envelope ( sustain zero ) ,not only will the output gradually decrease but also the amount of gain that is send back to the input (feedback ) , so it will gradually fade from a saw to a sine
I use the term post envelope feedback

, there are some vst's that got it all wrong , like oxe fm ...where the operator envelope does NOT affect the feedback loop

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:12 am

I was sure Everett would come back. It was impossible to leave that way such a kind community around his baby but also to throw that way a baby who was growing with love for already several years.

How good it is to see you back, Everett !

Life is as this. Sometimes we stumble because a stone (and the worse is when that stone has been thrown by harmful people we don't even know), but the right behavior is to pick up in order to resume and keep on the way, to keep on progressing all the life long. It is by picking oneself up each time that we get always better.

And those who are "over-critical" and jump on any occasion to criticize should wonder (no mirror needed for that, only honesty) if they are themselves so perfect that they are allowed to reproach to someone to have cracked under a sudden strain. Strain which may even have come in personal conditions that we always ignore. Is there in the world anyone totally free of all sin at the point of being allowed to cast a stone on the one who falls? We ALL are prone to ourselves fall in a same or similar situation be it public as well as private!... and way faster than expected.

The wisdom is not innate. It comes progressively all along our life, by the choice to pick up each time we fall down and the will to draw each time a new lesson of that new fall. Who may reproach to someone to have fallen when oneself remains prone to fall at one's turn at the first occasion? Noone!

Glad to see you back among us, Everett!

glokraw · Post by **glokraw** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:49 am

Also, Fathom is a labor of love, (as are many of the
excellent products we enjoy) it's not produced during
a leisurly 8-hour day, with regular lunch, coffee breaks,
and reliable quitting times. The power bill, grocery store,
insurance company, mortgage, and gas tank, all have a say,
and don't often whisper like a friendly muse

Biscotto · Post by **Biscotto** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:24 am

Thank you Everett!
I never doubted your comeback and so your customers and friends.

dandezebra · Post by **dandezebra** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:26 am

Fathom - Back From The Depths!

Woohoo!

RPH · Post by **RPH** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:16 am

You've had my support from the start, cheers!

Kalamata Kid · Post by **Kalamata Kid** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 6:34 am

Everett,

Great to see that you have returned!
You are one of my top five developers.
For the most part admire your honesty, creativity, work ethic and openly discuss all aspects of your products and for being a good listener.
So welcome back.

Tj Shredder · Post by **Tj Shredder** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:33 am

carrieres wrote: ↑Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:26 pm Another thing, don't waste to much time in your copy protection, it will be broken sooner or later
Urs from U-he did not come with his copy protection right since the beginning of his company, it worked out along the years ...

Any protection will be broken, but later - a simple closing the door instead of keeping it wide open is required. Whenever its broken, you know to which serial its connected. Urs said, those had been bought with stolen credit cards. That means no valid customer did it, it needs real criminals to do that... It creates a hurdle and a clear stop sign...
At the moment its too easy, imagine a copy is passed from a friend to a friend, the stick which is holding the app is lost, someone who does use warez sites finds it and thinks he is a hero if he uploads it... That certainly is too easy. If you know the app is watermarked with your name, you rather don‘t give it away... My Kaivo is personalized which makes me proud of having supported the developer. I would never give it away, even not to my best friend... (questionable if a friend would ask for a copy would keep him in the category of best friends...)

Saukar30 · Post by **Saukar30** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:58 am

On with the sampler!

AmbieticA · Post by **AmbieticA** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:52 pm

Saukar30 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:58 am On with the sampler!

Speaking of which...

FathomSynth · Post by **FathomSynth** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:20 pm

Thanks everyone for understanding.

It's a big relief to get back to development full time.

Obviously the next release with Intel AVX will need to be be license protected.

I don't want to open a huge discussion on the new license system since we already did that a while back. But I'm happy to say it will not be a machine lock license but a license locked to the user's email which was used to purchase the product. I will be re-reading the uhe thread on their license system since the overwhelming consensus is that uhe has the best license system. I may even just buy one of their products again and go through the process so I have a complete handle on it as a user as well.

I'm not planning on going with iLock, it will be an adjusted version of my system that is more user friendly than it was when we discussed it last.

This will be a mandatory license on the Fathom Vector release and only optional on the Fathom Pro release so users who don't want to change systems and are only using Fathom Pro will not be forced to upgrade the license.

The new system only communicates with the server during installation when the license is created, it does not communicate with the server at any time during normal operation.

Also, please don't be afraid of the new system since the installer is literally a one button press and everything required to create the local license is done automatically.

Also, the license system will have a fail safe plan for all users consisting of an unprotected release in the possession of my sound designers, and if something were ever to happen to my development system or server then they would be able to send direct copies to all users so no one would ever be caught with a locked door.

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:08 pm

FathomSynth wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:20 pm The new system only communicates with the server during installation when the license is created, it does not communicate with the server at any time during normal operation.

Hmm... beware: if you use this method you risk to find on the warez sites from now not the installer files... but now simply zip files which contain all the product already installed and to simply unzip. Therefore it would not change anything compared to the current situation.

I'm pretty sure that Urs uses a method much more clever. Really you should contact him, Everett.

bftucker · Post by **bftucker** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:27 pm

From KVR's Avenger thread:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=467127&start=9405

Ryan99 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:06 pm A post from Manuel on Facebook:

« some important news:

Unfortunately the appearance of recent warez really hurt us hard. Using NOT the elicenser protection for VPS Avenger was a bold decision we made, listening to all those customers, who want to travel with their laptops, or dont want to plug a dongle permanently in general - but finally it turned out it was the wrong decision. Now we basically have to start from zero again. Its sad, that nowadays you are forced to do such protection measures, but unfortunately thats the world. I had a long talk with Rene and different solutions were on the table and I want to be completely honest here with you guys: One of them was, that version 1.5. becomes dongle protected and therefore NOT a free update. But since we already told you, that it will be free for our customers, we will stick to this promise - although the circumstances have changed. Version 1.5.X (+following bugfixes) will be the last bigger free update for Avenger with new content. It will contain the guitar module, a free XP, new analog filters, new skin, new factory library stuff and much much more. After this, I am sad to say, that it will be impossible for us to continue the way we did so far. We were happy, that we could spend the last 2 years mainly working on fun stuff, such as bringing you new features and sounds - but as the situation is now, much time is needed to maintain the copy protection. It will start with Avenger 2.0, which has to be a paid update (no price set yet) and will introduce (beside new features) the eLicenser dongle again, which was the only 100% secure mechanism for us yet: Our Dongle protected plugins were never cracked in any way. It will take quite a long time and effort to switch to the new protection system, so dont expect this update anytime soon. Furthermore each license key for the elicenser will cost money, so the update can't obviously be free. Updates after 2.0 will be free of charge again of course.

I know that some of you may not want to do the change to version 2.0 then, because they want no dongle, but unfortunately we have no other choice at the moment. They can of course still stick to their 1.5.x which will get bugfixes if necessary. There already have been more free updates and features for Avenger, than other products get in their entire lifetime. So no need to complain about sticking to 1.5.x. since its a fully fledged Avenger.

There was a similar situation with Nexus 1 > 2 if someone remembers.

Thanks to all loyal and nice people here in this group, who accompanied us so far!

Once it is 100% sure again (with v2.0), that only our customers who paid have acces to it, we will continue to make gifts in form of free sounds or new features. Looking forward to it!

I would strongly advise not to use any illegal XPs, especially not with your legit versions...

As some may have read, we planned to move our older plugins to a non-dongle protected system, but atm this plan is no longer valid obviously.

ps: only thing which could make us move away from the dongle plan would be, that 1.5.0 (which will get some copy protection fixes) will be secure and uncracked during the year of development for 2.0. »

The debate started on page 628 and raged on and on, everyone bringing out their tried and true arguments pro or con.

Tedious reading but, if you can stand it, maybe worth looking through.

Tj Shredder · Post by **Tj Shredder** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:32 pm

BlackWinny wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:08 pm
FathomSynth wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:20 pm The new system only communicates with the server during installation when the license is created, it does not communicate with the server at any time during normal operation.
Hmm... beware: if you use this method you risk to find on the warez sites from now not the installer files... but now simply zip files which contain all the product already installed and to simply unzip. Therefore it would not change anything compared to the current situation.

I'm pretty sure that Urs uses a method much more clever. Really you should contact him, Everett.

If the authorization changes the final application, with the (encrypted) info about the user and the machine, its still locked to the machine. Each time you change the machine, and only copy the program, it would need again a connection to the server. A machine without license would simply be in demo mode. Seems reasonable for me...
But it needs one info more than the email, for example a password for an account. The email is not a secret in this case...

Fathom Synth Development Thread