Unfiltered Audio Lion

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
WasteLand
KVRist
343 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:07 am

graspee wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:36 am
No-one can tell me if the $99 voucher was personal use or sharable?
personal. a kvr member shared it with me, but didn't work for me. try to buy a $75 pa voucher via kvr?

EDIT: or personal, it is a heavy hitter discount. if you aren't one... me thinks.
win 10 pro; cubase 10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

inforlk
KVRer
4 posts since 18 Sep, 2019

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:14 am

dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
Worst sounding synth i heard in a long time.
I do not understand when these assessments are made freely. This synth is the best in terms of possibilities of modulation, FX and oscillators. Sounds great. Nor do I understand people who complain about the price, if you are a loyal user, you can get it for 99 $ + 50 $ coupon of the month. I could buy it for 49 $ !!!

One suggestion is that LION as TRIAD has the resolution scale percentage on its menu. To save settings
To be able to open the plugin without having to scale resolution.

PieBerger
KVRist
478 posts since 23 May, 2012 from London

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:49 am

inforlk wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:14 am
dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
if you are a loyal user, you can get it for 99 $ + 50 $ coupon of the month. I could buy it for 49 $ !!!
For heavy hitters, not necessarily loyal UA customers though. It's weird that buying all of the Elyisa and Brainworx plugins, for example, might grant you heavy hitter status, qualifying you for a discount, but owning most of the UA plugs, especially BYOME and or TRIAD doesn't. PA pricing is a bit backwards sometimes. As an owner of Black Box, I'm eligible for a discount on Phil's Cascade, two plugins from two separate devs, with no crossover in code/shared libaries etc. However, as an owner of every UA plugin except Zip, I/we get no discount on LION, despite the huge amount of crossover with BYOME/TRIAD. It doesn't make sense and is just one of the many ways PA makes such a hash of things in the commercial department.

Edit: quote formatting
Last edited by PieBerger on Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
Always Read the Manual!

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exmatproton
KVRAF
2523 posts since 25 Apr, 2011

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:49 am

inforlk wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:14 am
dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
Worst sounding synth i heard in a long time.
I do not understand when these assessments are made freely. This synth is the best in terms of possibilities of modulation, FX and oscillators. Sounds great. Nor do I understand people who complain about the price, if you are a loyal user, you can get it for 99 $ + 50 $ coupon of the month. I could buy it for 49 $ !!!

One suggestion is that LION as TRIAD has the resolution scale percentage on its menu. To save settings
To be able to open the plugin without having to scale resolution.
I love the synth, but it isn't the best in terms of sound quality, to be honest. For instance; try modulate the PW in the stack with the square osc's. It is nasty and offsetting, resulting in distorted modulation.
Also, the synth is clipping way too fast.
Furthermore, i can't think of a reason why they didn't add high pass filters to the reverbs. They (renoun and deep) always sound dull.

And then there are the smaller niggles, like: why can't i read the values of the modulation depth sliders? Why did they add smudges to the white (light grey) themes background? Why do i need macro's to enable automation for lots of parameters? Why can i only add 13 modulators? Why isn't there an always glide function?

They call it "the apex of synths", but really, that is snake oil. I love it though. It is fun to play with and it sounds good enough, especially for glitchy stuff and great atmospheres, but there are options (especially considering the price) that are better suited for that title APEX OF SYNTHS.

worldfever
KVRist
114 posts since 13 Oct, 2015

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:02 am

I can see why people say that this might not be the best/cleanest sounding synth, but to be honest, I've been having a f**king blast with it.
I didn't have any expectations nor did I read about it beforehand, just downloaded it because I got the unfiltered audio bundle recently after I got wind of it. Its just a joy to make experimental, crazy sounds with it really easily using the excellent UA modulation system and those crazy oscillator mix algorithms (Compare, Terrain, Bitter, Ash..). And since im using Unfiltered audio plugins already, the UI feels right at home.
Maybe its not the best for your bread and butter sounds, but I found it to be very inspiring and I actually feel like making my own sounds with it as opposed to when I'm using synths like massive x or something. Also its nice to have all the byome effects in it as well.

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dionenoid
KVRist
401 posts since 3 Jan, 2019 from Holland

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:43 am

Local Man wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:16 pm
dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
Worst sounding synth i heard in a long time.
I find it funny when people talk about synths sounding bad without any specifics.
Its like saying "my car sucks because it always drives to the worst neighborhoods."
Forgive me, it was getting late. Let me explain :
- The envelopes have no punch or snappyness.
- The filters are cold and lifeless.
- There is this weird stuff going on in the high frequencies most of the time.
- Most of the fx are mediocre (i'm not a fan of the other UA stuff either).

I guess that if you want to make chip-tune-like sounds and weird soundscapes you can have fun with this synth, but there are plenty of alternatives that can do more, sound better and are even cheaper.

Overall the sound is as flat as a pancake. You can build all the possibilities you want into a synth, but if the fundamentals are wrong, it will never sound good.

That's what my conclusions were after demoing the thing.
More BPM please

raiderpdog
KVRer
13 posts since 26 Jul, 2018

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:00 am

inforlk wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:14 am
dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
Worst sounding synth i heard in a long time.
I do not understand when these assessments are made freely. This synth is the best in terms of possibilities of modulation, FX and oscillators. Sounds great. Nor do I understand people who complain about the price, if you are a loyal user, you can get it for 99 $ + 50 $ coupon of the month. I could buy it for 49 $ !!!

One suggestion is that LION as TRIAD has the resolution scale percentage on its menu. To save settings
To be able to open the plugin without having to scale resolution.

Yep, that $49 price is how I used my vouchers and what I paid. An easy decision at that price.

Phil B
KVRist
42 posts since 1 Jul, 2008

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:09 am

dionenoid wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:43 am
That's what my conclusions were after demoing the thing.
Not disrespecting your opinion at all, just curious ... what soft synths do you place at the other end of the spectrum (ie great and full of life)?

graspee
KVRist
91 posts since 1 Jan, 2018

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:28 am

If I were a PA "heavy hitter" and could get it for $99 and use a $50 voucher I would buy it without hesitation. As it is I own all but dent 2 of UA's plugins and it would cost me $129 and I could use a $25 voucher and 20% tax would be added on.

@wasteland thanks for the info earlier.

yehboy1
KVRian
532 posts since 13 Mar, 2017

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:46 am

dionenoid wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:43 am
Local Man wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:16 pm
dionenoid wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:40 pm
Worst sounding synth i heard in a long time.
I find it funny when people talk about synths sounding bad without any specifics.
Its like saying "my car sucks because it always drives to the worst neighborhoods."
Forgive me, it was getting late. Let me explain :
- The envelopes have no punch or snappyness.
- The filters are cold and lifeless.
- There is this weird stuff going on in the high frequencies most of the time.
- Most of the fx are mediocre (i'm not a fan of the other UA stuff either).

I guess that if you want to make chip-tune-like sounds and weird soundscapes you can have fun with this synth, but there are plenty of alternatives that can do more, sound better and are even cheaper.

Overall the sound is as flat as a pancake. You can build all the possibilities you want into a synth, but if the fundamentals are wrong, it will never sound good.

That's what my conclusions were after demoing the thing.
Agreed. Also the UI gives me a headache, especially the side scrolling even in wide mode.

WasteLand
KVRist
343 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:59 am

i am no expert, i use the "beta" version, but it seems like that the oversampling setting (online) influences the character of the main filter, they get more drive. i analyze it, not in an expert way, there is no aliasing or not that "visible".
the sound when the filter is on gets "highs", harmonics likely. when you change oversampling. i use very simple presets, my own...
in my experience oversampling does not drastically changes the sound of the filter, i mean the difference is: at 1x: dull sound: at 2x: screams... it seems like there is more aliasing.......... but i am no expert... i program my soft-synths always from scratch, i use oversampling when necessary, but this. it makes a complete different sound.
it also gives you the feeling that you do not know what is the "correct" sound.
win 10 pro; cubase 10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

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evilantal
KVRian
898 posts since 13 Mar, 2008 from Arnhem, Netherlands

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:11 am

WasteLand wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:07 am
graspee wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:36 am
No-one can tell me if the $99 voucher was personal use or sharable?
personal. a kvr member shared it with me, but didn't work for me. try to buy a $75 pa voucher via kvr?

EDIT: or personal, it is a heavy hitter discount. if you aren't one... me thinks.
Indeed, I tried applying my voucher when not logged in and nothing happened. When I apply it after logging into my account, the discount is applied...

Pity. As I wasn't planning on getting it, I was willing to part with my code + $50 voucher...

EDIT: Hmmmmm....strange. Now it does seem to work... Might be my browser cache, though (?)
EDIT2: Tried in another browser from where I've never visited the PA site before and it worked again...
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exmatproton
KVRAF
2523 posts since 25 Apr, 2011

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:32 am

WasteLand wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:59 am
i am no expert, i use the "beta" version, but it seems like that the oversampling setting (online) influences the character of the main filter, they get more drive. i analyze it, not in an expert way, there is no aliasing or not that "visible".
the sound when the filter is on gets "highs", harmonics likely. when you change oversampling. i use very simple presets, my own...
in my experience oversampling does not drastically changes the sound of the filter, i mean the difference is: at 1x: dull sound: at 2x: screams... it seems like there is more aliasing.......... but i am no expert... i program my soft-synths always from scratch, i use oversampling when necessary, but this. it makes a complete different sound.
it also gives you the feeling that you do not know what is the "correct" sound.
Yeah.
I disabled the main filter and set the Simple Sine OSC to 50% with no second OSC and the Linear XFade mixing setting. The master GAIN is at -10dB and the SINE still isn't clean. @ 8x oversampling there is still aliasing present. My soundcard is set to 48000Hz.

Tried the Forms as well, but similar results
clean sine no.JPG
This should be a clean sine, but there is something else going on...

This is Rapid with a SINE and no filters:
clean sine yes.JPG
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WasteLand
KVRist
343 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:46 am

exmatproton wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:32 am
WasteLand wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:59 am
i am no expert, i use the "beta" version, but it seems like that the oversampling setting (online) influences the character of the main filter, they get more drive. i analyze it, not in an expert way, there is no aliasing or not that "visible".
the sound when the filter is on gets "highs", harmonics likely. when you change oversampling. i use very simple presets, my own...
in my experience oversampling does not drastically changes the sound of the filter, i mean the difference is: at 1x: dull sound: at 2x: screams... it seems like there is more aliasing.......... but i am no expert... i program my soft-synths always from scratch, i use oversampling when necessary, but this. it makes a complete different sound.
it also gives you the feeling that you do not know what is the "correct" sound.
Yeah.
I disabled the main filter and set the Simple Sine OSC to 50% with no second OSC and the Linear XFade mixing setting. The master GAIN is at -10dB and the SINE still isn't clean. @ 8x oversampling there is still aliasing present. My soundcard is set to 48000Hz.
i didn't test it this way. i used mmultianalyzer, there is a better tool for this, but don't where i left it..

when i disable the main filter, the sound is more lively. i am talking about the filter it's behavior.

but it can be, i dabble around first in a synth, of course learn the basics of new stuff, but go with my ears.. the presets i have made... that it is the combination... later on i go in depth, and listen to all stuff indepentely, or built it up more detailed...

i shall try to the same. soundcard also on 48000Hz/24 bits. using now cubase 10 pro.

this is the preset i am using now, already playing with it, to top it of with a SP2016 reverb, a strange philip glass like preset, how it plays. play it in high octave, C4 and above (with root note C3, or 'middle' note, why are there 2...)

EDIT: it is on 2x oversampling, set to 1x (which is none... i guess... :hihi: )

EDIT 2: tried your example: the filter, doesn't affect the sound as much in my preset... and i am no expert in detecting aliasing, i thought how to see it, but no... didn't check with msoundfactory, which produces a clean sine. o well, me thinks, i must learn more, technique...

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1T9cLW ... 3pWbHae0Zn
Last edited by WasteLand on Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
win 10 pro; cubase 10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

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dionenoid
KVRist
401 posts since 3 Jan, 2019 from Holland

Re: Unfiltered Audio Lion

Post Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:56 am

Phil B wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:09 am
Not disrespecting your opinion at all, just curious ... what soft synths do you place at the other end of the spectrum (ie great and full of life)?
Spire, Serum, Avenger, Diva, Falcon, Massive X and don't forget Sylenth1 and Synthmaster.

For capabilities and flexibility of routing, fx and osc's i would say Melda SoundFactory and Falcon but also Synthmaster and Avenger are miles ahead of Lion. I have yet to demo Phaseplant but on paper that one looks to be a better choice also.

But hey, it's just an opinion. Everyone has to decide for themselves ofcourse, so just demo and judge for yourself. If you're into this kind of sound and/or programming than you'll probably love it.
More BPM please

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