Diva Ladder 12db and 24db filters reversed?

[Echoes in the Attic]

I was just playing with the Diva demo again (haven't owned it in a while) and noticed that the filters seem to be the opposite of what is labeled in the moog filter. At least it sounds to me like the 12db switch is actually the 24 db and vice versa. Am I wrong?

[muki]

no, not here (v7422 AU)
all three that have 12/24 versions (ladder, cascade, multimode) seem to behave as i would expect them

[Echoes in the Attic]

But when the switch flips up the display says 12 db on the panel but the text display says 24db. When the switch flips down, on the panel it says 24 db but the readout says 12db.

It sounds like what the display reads but the switch seems backwards, no?

[Urs]

I just installed it on a new machine. It's working correctly. The display shows "12dB" when the white dot on the switch is visible next to the 12dB label. This screenshot shows the "12dB" setting:

Screenshot 2019-10-27 at 11.29.24.png

[muki]

exactly

it might be, that the visuals (with the ladder) could be irritating...but...actually imho they're not...
if there's the white dot near the 12db it's the 12db
if not, it's the 24db

[david.beholder]

But actually it's cosmetic issue that would be nice to fix.
Got me some time to get used to as well.

[Urs]

Well, it looks like what it's supposed to be inspired by...

[david.beholder]

Well, it looks like what it's supposed to be inspired by...

Urs, problem exists regardless. Moving real-world ui/ux (3d, tactile) to screen (2d, visual only) is always bringing issues like this. It's written in design books.

This issue could be solved in many different ways while still keeping MG-like rockers.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Well, it looks like what it's supposed to be inspired by...

Urs, problem exists regardless. Moving real-world ui/ux (3d, tactile) to screen (2d, visual only) is always bringing issues like this. It's written in design books.

This issue could be solved in many different still keeping MG-like rockers.

You could always edit the png's and make them look however you'd like if they really bother you that much.

[david.beholder]

You could always edit the png's and make them look however you'd like if they really bother you that much.

Thanks god you're not official U-he customer support.

[Urs]

Well, it looks like what it's supposed to be inspired by...

Urs, problem exists regardless. Moving real-world ui/ux (3d, tactile) to screen (2d, visual only) is always bringing issues like this. It's written in design books.

Name a "design book" that's not utter bollocks. Unless of course it's just a collection of tasteful things without trying to postulate predictable rules-that-must-be-followed.

This issue could be solved in many different ways while still keeping MG-like rockers.

Example please! I promise: I'll only tear it apart if I must

[Urs]

(That said, the rocker switches on the Minimoog did confuse me at first. The dot is an extra element that had to be introduced to make them work, coz the design is... I won't say)

[Urs]

(Furthermore: Should there ever be a D2, we'll probably drop that visual reminiscence thing)

[david.beholder]

Name a "design book" that's not utter bollocks. Unless of course it's just a collection of tasteful things without trying to postulate predictable rules-that-must-be-followed.

Starting from classics like Jef Ruskin The Humane Interface and ending up with Steve Krug Don't Make Me Think.

Example please! I promise: I'll only tear it apart if I must

I didn't like how our last conversation has ended but let's try one more time:
1. change color of 12db or 24db based on rocker position
2. put only one label above switch and change it according to position
3. put 12db or 24db in square based on position
4. put marks 12 and 24 on rocker itself, so the one that is in use would be in full color and one out darkened (exactly like rocker sides now)

(That said, the rocker switches on the Minimoog did confuse me at first. The dot is an extra element that had to be introduced to make them work, coz the design is... I won't say)

I've noticed, but that's not enough.
> on only active side may work better

[Urs]

Thanks for the book recommendations. Hope there's a German summary somewhere.

Example please! I promise: I'll only tear it apart if I must

I didn't like how our last conversation has ended but let's try one more time:
1. change color of 12db or 24db based on rocker position
2. put only one label above switch and change it according to position
3. put 12db or 24db in square based on position
4. put marks 12 and 24 on rocker itself, so the one that is in use would be in full color and one out darkened (exactly like rocker sides now)

These are not examples of design, these are examples of talking-about-design, wouldn't you say?

Anyhow, I'll try:

In Diva, we use vintage Dymo-stickers to show changes in printed labelling (of vintage looking faceplates, that is). It would be inconsistent to now start changing colours of labels instead, as if they were some kind of upgraded tech on a. vintage machine. That rules 1 and 2 out. It probably also rules 3 out, which I don't quite understand. It sounds like you're proposing a secondary active element, such as a combo box with a drop down. That would introduce redundancy which we'd try to avoid.

Marks on the rocker itself won't work as the rocker is too small for that. Also, none of the other rockers in the UI have any such marks. No 4 for me please, unless a concept for all switches is found.

A good example would include references to the other rocker switches on the UI (or any element, really), so that clashes are avoided. If we change one, we need to change all of them, and the solution needs to still work. It needs to still be reminiscent to good old hardware, as that is the concept here.

(as I said, talking about design is usually shit when there's no visual reference)