Should I upgrade to MSoundFactory?

[GRUMP]

To make a long Story short: you have just started so you need to make Experiences to see what you want to do. MSF is sonically very rich, offers various different Synthesis Methods + Sampling and its modular Structure makes it very flexible. No Matter what you want to do you can make your Experiences with it.

On the other Hand: The Factory Bank does - i. m. O. - not even come close to the Possibilities and is quiet small until now. For Beginners more Presets to learn from would be really advantageous. Solution: 3rd Party Presets.

If you ask me I´d say "yes" regarding probably raising Rates in the next Years. Good Investion. Lifetime Updates (wish him all the best).

Definitely no "bad" descision to upgrade if you don´t stop making Sound tomorrow.

[GRUMP]

double. sry!

[Oniononorion]

Yikes I never listened to zebra until just now...it sounds REALLY good. What’s the chances that MSF could be upgraded to sound better than it currently does? Hasn’t there been some talk of the filters being upgraded?

[Faiky]

Welcome GRUMP ! Onionorion:
The more the debate goes on, the more it's possible that Vojtech go into it. But he must be convinced of it himself. That's why jmg8 has suggested this comparative test, unfortunately not enough attention is paid to it yet.
You can achieve very quality sounds, it depends on some twerking (oversampling, antialiasing, quality settings, analog function, don't exaggerate every knob value...)

It's importent that we work together

[operator]

It's importent that we work together

[allende]

Synthesis > Synth. Zebra sounds amazing because it's got amazing presets done by industry leading professionals. There's nothing Zebra can do that couldn't be done in MSF, but there's plenty that MSF can do that Zebra can't do. If MSF would have presets done by BigTone, Arksun, Bluffmunkey, Aiyn Zahev, Adam Szabo etc, it would sell like hotcakes and be praised all the way to the moon and back.

Filters do make a difference, but it's not nearly as big as most people think. In the end filters are just an eq and it's the patch designer who decides how that eq curve, peaks and colorization works. There's already plenty of options with the default Filter module and the new TurboFilter module, and it's only going to get better.

[KenjiDeVries]

If MSF would have presets done by BigTone, Arksun, Bluffmunkey, Aiyn Zahev, Adam Szabo etc, it would sell like hotcakes and be praised all the way to the moon and back.

No. Try to make the same sound in both synths, count how many pop ups open, how often you have to redo easy things or search for options, then you know why MSF would not be praised.

[operator]

There's nothing Zebra can do that couldn't be done in MSF

aahmmm wrong...

But I agree there is plenty that MSF can do that Zebra don´t... MSF has a much broader sound range than Zebra (FM, Sampler, Unison Module, OSC Shaper, Modal...). It is just a much more versatile / more modern tool. You only need to compare the per-voice waveshaper.

But when it comes to Filters, Zebra still sounds better to me...



There is a reason that Hans Zimmer wanted the Diva Filters inside of Zebra. The existing ones (XMF, Filter) are exelenct Filters but didn´t do the trick for him. And his capability to judge the quality of a sound probably outweighs that of ours.
There seems to be an importancy of a very good Filter in his synthesis-chain to create the sounds he wants.

[allende]

aahmmm wrong...

Please by all means give me examples, instead of just going fullon Trump on me.

There is a reason that Hans Zimmer wanted the Diva Filters inside of Zebra. The existing ones (XMF, Filter) are exelenct Filters but didn´t do the trick for him.

Would love to read this story if you have a source. Didn’t Howard Scarr design the presets for Hans?

My point was that people pay too much attention to things that matter little in the big picture. Zebra filters are not what made the Dark Knight score great. I personally try to avoid calling any synth, filter or whatever feature bad, but rather just a different character. If MSF’s filters prevent you of programming great sounds, then maybe you weren’t a great patch programmer to begin with. In my 20+ years of experience on internet music forums, the people who shit on synthesizers/daws/equipment the most, are usually the ones who never get anything worthwhile done themselves.

[Oniononorion]

Honestly, the sounds are so much better in MPS...I don’t understand that. I will download MSF and test for myself for a week, but none of the videos for MSF I have watched sound as good as MPS, even it’s presets, sound.

It seems MXXX can do a serious amount of manipulation beyond what merely MPS is capable of, so I will probably just not buy unless it gets major sound upgrade. *sigh*

[operator]

If MSF’s filters prevent you of programming great sounds, then maybe you weren’t a great patch programmer to begin with. In my 20+ years of experience on internet music forums, the people who shit on synthesizers/daws/equipment the most, are usually the ones who never get anything worthwhile done themselves.

Yeah, probably it´s that.

[Dirtgrain]

If MSF’s filters prevent you of programming great sounds, then maybe you weren’t a great patch programmer to begin with. In my 20+ years of experience on internet music forums, the people who shit on synthesizers/daws/equipment the most, are usually the ones who never get anything worthwhile done themselves.

So, you are on KVRForums to say that all VSTs/plugins are equal? Well, the One Synth Challenge has proved over and over that great things can be done with flawed VSTs, but when more capable VSTs are used (in the u-he OSC, for example) I noticed the quality overall is better. That's subjective, as always here (just like when you judge if what someone else has done was worthwhile).

I have no problem with people wanting the best (especially given how much money one can put into this endeavor), yet, given the subjectivity, there is some consensus her about this or that VST. I've heard so much about MSF's filters not being as good as they could be. At this point, I want Vojtech to just humor the naysayers and make the type of filter they request--just so I don't have to hear about it anymore

[ralfrobert]

At this point, I want Vojtech to just humor the naysayers and make the type of filter they request--just so I don't have to hear about it anymore

+1

I like MSF very much. As we see quite often, Vojtech improves his product line and even adds a lot to the free bundle regularly. So I hope the filters will arrive at some point in 2020.

[allende]

So, you are on KVRForums to say that all VSTs/plugins are equal?

That's not what I said. Music isn't a sport, it's an art. Everything is objective and the tools you use should be decided what's appropriate for your goal. If you're recording black metal or lofi hiphop you might want to use different microphones than when recording classical music. I love that most synthesizers sound different, I love that they have their own character. It would be really boring if every synth had the same components/algorithms.

I've heard so much about MSF's filters not being as good as they could be. At this point, I want Vojtech to just humor the naysayers and make the type of filter they request--just so I don't have to hear about it anymore

The problem is, it's usually people who have no idea what they are talking about, who just read one comment about the filters and now can't use them anymore since someone said they are supposedly bad. They can't explain why they are bad, they just are because someone said so. A lot of them don't even own MSF, or those who own haven't tried the TurboFilter module, which is pretty amazing considering you can write the whole algoritm on how it works. Like it or not but majority of the people judge how a synth sounds based on the presets, and most of them suck at programming synths. MSF is still in beta, so there's hardly any presets for it to begin with.

I just think overally the biggest problem in the whole music production industry is how people obsess on tiny technical things instead of creativity and compositions. So many people just buy more and more gear and instead of actually making music they just argue about it and post and comment on comparison videos. They obsess on having the absolute best equipment, so that it would somehow make their music worthwhile. All this time that they could have spend on learning music theory, composing and practicing mixing instead.

This whole conversation is getting out of hand, and I don't really want to argue about it anymore.I think operator had the right idea with

[operator]

Honestly, the sounds are so much better in MPS...I don’t understand that. I will download MSF and test for myself for a week, but none of the videos for MSF I have watched sound as good as MPS, even it’s presets, sound.

MSF and MPS are using the same Oscillators, Filters, Envelopes, etc.... They sound both equal. In MSF you even can open the MPS architecutre as a preset. (So I guess the factor of sound quality when deciding between the two can be ruled out)

Yes give it a try... This is what i always do aswell... after a week you will know if you need the synth in your workflow or if you based your current uncertainties only on fear of missing out...

One major difference between the two is the way you work with them... this would be the main factor I would make the desicions on. Ask yourself, if you prefer a fixed synth architecture (the typical subtractive synth architecure: OSC, Filter,...) where you can dial in some sounds very fast without thinking too much and everything behaves like one would expect ---> go with MPS.
On the other hand, if you would like to create a synth-architecture during sounddesign and building a sound by adding exactly the modules you need. Or maybe you want to try some weird routings a fixed architecture can´t deliver ---> then go with MSF.

One is an inductive method the other is a deductive method.


And MSF has much more features: dedicated Wavetable OSC, Sampler, FM, Modal, MTurboFilter... (I would go with MSF )