T7 crashes a lot! Yesterday for instance I tried to insert an intro into an existing chamber music piece by moving all the recorded clips (MIDI only so far) two bars to the left. Crash.
On reopening, the clarinet track (VST-plugin VSCO2 sketch clarinet) was corrupt. All notes of the first bar would warble in a strange sound. The rest played fine. Well, the phrase was repeated later on and I took those notes and copied them into first bar. Same effect. I opened a new clip in a new track, recorded just the first notes and copied all the working ones into the track. Same effect. I exchanged the instrument for another plugin sound. Same effect.
Finally I re-recorded the track from the scratch and then it worked. But now suddenly the piano track is corrupt and would not play in the right volume (way too soft), although all volume and output settings (mixer, note volumes) are okay. I am still testing this software and it's drivin me NUTS!
... there is NO repair tool.
... How can I expect Waveform to work more stable and reliable?
... if you have to count on a total loss of hours of work at any moment, at least T7 is crap. For DAW work first thing you need is reliability, isn't it?
Has anyone any solution for me?
T7 - how to work with such an unstable DAW????
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- KVRAF
- 1790 posts since 30 Dec, 2012
Waveform Free is coming very soon, it's years ahead in terms of stability and performance improvements, will include plugin sandboxing and our auto-save/backup/instant recovery features.
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- KVRAF
- 2772 posts since 28 Mar, 2007
Will "sandboxing" allow plugins that are currently rejected to run ?dRowAudio wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:04 am Waveform Free is coming very soon, it's years ahead in terms of stability and performance improvements, will include plugin sandboxing and our auto-save/backup/instant recovery features.
Or has it been implemented to stop Waveform 11 crashing when it encounters difficult plugins ?
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- KVRian
- 524 posts since 16 Mar, 2017
Sandboxing in and of itself is designed to prevent the DAW from crashing when a plugin misbehaves. If a plugin has bugs, the sandbox won't magically fix those bugs. Isolating the plugin from other plugins may have some minor effect on improving the stability for a few of them, but it is unlikely to significantly improve most of them in this area.
The auto-save/backup/recovery features help to reduce the impact in the event the DAW would happen to crash, and get you back up and running without losing as much work.
There have been other improvements since T7 which should help with overall plugin compatibility but as to any specific plugin you would need to test it and find out. Bear in mind that T7 is three major versions behind already (four with the release of W11) so you are already missing out on the improvements which have been incorporated in the past 3 or so years. W11 (free or otherwise) will represent roughly four years of improvements over T7.
Many plugin vendors appear to test their plugins by trying them in a few of the "major" (more heavily marketed) DAWs and if they seem to work in those they are happy, even though the plugins might not actually fully comply with the specifications they are supposed to, then when you move them to some other DAW that is obviously different from the ones it was tested on, they do something which is correct according to the specifications, but which exposes a flaw in the plugin, then the plugin vendors don't bother to fix it because they only "support" the DAWs they tested against... this is ultimately the fault the plugin vendors for not making their plugins match the specifications, not of the DAW for expecting the plugins to meet those specifications.
Also, before you start calling the DAW unstable, do an experiment: try mixing a song with only the bundled plugins (the ones built-in or included with T7) and see how stable that is. Any time you incorporate 3rd-party plugins you are introducing an uncertainty about compatibility and the like which can result in stability issues... think of this as a way to exercise your mixing skills while at the same time evaluating the stability of the DAW itself as opposed to the plugins running underneath it.
"The enemy of art is the absence of limitations." - Orson Welles
The auto-save/backup/recovery features help to reduce the impact in the event the DAW would happen to crash, and get you back up and running without losing as much work.
There have been other improvements since T7 which should help with overall plugin compatibility but as to any specific plugin you would need to test it and find out. Bear in mind that T7 is three major versions behind already (four with the release of W11) so you are already missing out on the improvements which have been incorporated in the past 3 or so years. W11 (free or otherwise) will represent roughly four years of improvements over T7.
Many plugin vendors appear to test their plugins by trying them in a few of the "major" (more heavily marketed) DAWs and if they seem to work in those they are happy, even though the plugins might not actually fully comply with the specifications they are supposed to, then when you move them to some other DAW that is obviously different from the ones it was tested on, they do something which is correct according to the specifications, but which exposes a flaw in the plugin, then the plugin vendors don't bother to fix it because they only "support" the DAWs they tested against... this is ultimately the fault the plugin vendors for not making their plugins match the specifications, not of the DAW for expecting the plugins to meet those specifications.
Also, before you start calling the DAW unstable, do an experiment: try mixing a song with only the bundled plugins (the ones built-in or included with T7) and see how stable that is. Any time you incorporate 3rd-party plugins you are introducing an uncertainty about compatibility and the like which can result in stability issues... think of this as a way to exercise your mixing skills while at the same time evaluating the stability of the DAW itself as opposed to the plugins running underneath it.
"The enemy of art is the absence of limitations." - Orson Welles
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- KVRist
- 320 posts since 9 Sep, 2017
Switching from Win7, 4G RAM to Win10, 16G RAM, 12 virtual kernels, reduced the crashes that I had with several track copy and insert functions in my T7. I use it for certain 32bit plugins like Variety of Sound.
I know what I can do without crashing, and I found out which plugins are safe.
So for me, I'm quite lucky.
A hundred tracks with many plugins, including brainworx/PA, seems no problem here!
Anyone who wants to upgrade - things to check out when switching to a recent version:
Does the plugin latency compensation work the same way, or better?
Do automation curves hit the right places in tracks, where plugins with latency are in use?
Can we migrate and use old and complex racks? Does it save rack configuration correctly within the project edit file? Some plugins seem to disturb the saving routines (when they collect current plugin parameter data).
Does the solo and mute functionality work the same or better? (Cubase to me seems has a great algorithm about complex bus structures and soloing).
Do folder tracks and sub-edits work? I rarely use these. I use a folder track only to hide 10 backing vocals or something like that. But it is not the bus, I create a distinct output bus always.
I know what I can do without crashing, and I found out which plugins are safe.
So for me, I'm quite lucky.
A hundred tracks with many plugins, including brainworx/PA, seems no problem here!
Anyone who wants to upgrade - things to check out when switching to a recent version:
Does the plugin latency compensation work the same way, or better?
Do automation curves hit the right places in tracks, where plugins with latency are in use?
Can we migrate and use old and complex racks? Does it save rack configuration correctly within the project edit file? Some plugins seem to disturb the saving routines (when they collect current plugin parameter data).
Does the solo and mute functionality work the same or better? (Cubase to me seems has a great algorithm about complex bus structures and soloing).
Do folder tracks and sub-edits work? I rarely use these. I use a folder track only to hide 10 backing vocals or something like that. But it is not the bus, I create a distinct output bus always.
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 18 posts since 23 Feb, 2020
I installed W11 now and started the song, T7 would not let me work on without crashing. Everything was there and working fine. I just needed to adjust a few settings from the scratch (esp. FX-Plugin settings) and I could go on directly without having to record anew. After a few recording sessions the song was ready. W11 is obviously a huge progress! THANKS A LOT FOR THAT!!!!