The new sampler in MSoundFactory (MSF) is great. Ticks all the boxes if you want to create instruments from scratch. I'm glad they chose to incorporate sound fonts as it's the defacto standard for sampler instrument patches IMO. Since v14 dropped, I have been putting together a soundfont library.
However two shortcomings I'd like to ask about
1) no support for .SF2 files, only SFZ. Thats a shame. A lot of freely downloadable content exists in .SF2 and there are no SF2-to-SFZ converters that I could fine online.
2) It doesn't support some implementations of .SFZ files where the wav file is externally referenced. Again, it would be nice if there was a tool to conform .SFZ files to store the samples internally. So again, many existing sound fonts cannot be used.
3) BONUS topic... Would be nice to have *basic* support for .NKI (Kontakt Instrument) files as there are even more collections of those things online. Again, it would be nice if there was a tool to conform usable NKI files to .SFZ.
I reckon addressing the above things would massively increase the takeup of MSF as a whole, even though SF support is a drop on the ocean of MSF functionality.
Sound Fonts
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 80 posts since 11 Dec, 2003
At the very least, it would be handy if, uppon not being able to locate the external .wav files, it came up with a dialog requesting the location of said .wav files instead of just throwing a missing-wav-files alert. That alone would suddenly unlock massive library availability.
I'm using v14.01
I'm using v14.01
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MeldaProduction MeldaProduction https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=176122 - KVRAF
- 14339 posts since 15 Mar, 2008 from Czech republic
Missing WAV solution is planned. But SF2 isn't. What do you mean by "externally referenced"? Also NKI is not really planned, because afaik the format is not public.
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- KVRist
- 370 posts since 26 Sep, 2014
tezza,
Good news for you! There is a free soundfont editor that supports SF2, SF3,and SFZ. You can create soundfonts from
scratch, or open and edit existing ones. And you can open one format, and convert it to another simply
by using SAVE AS (SF2/SFZ...)
It's called polyphone, and I think you'll love it. You can grab it here: www.polyphone-soundfonts.com/en/
Good news for you! There is a free soundfont editor that supports SF2, SF3,and SFZ. You can create soundfonts from
scratch, or open and edit existing ones. And you can open one format, and convert it to another simply
by using SAVE AS (SF2/SFZ...)
It's called polyphone, and I think you'll love it. You can grab it here: www.polyphone-soundfonts.com/en/
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 80 posts since 11 Dec, 2003
I mean that the soundfont file itself does not contain the sound samples. The samples are external but the sound font points to their location.MeldaProduction wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:53 pm Missing WAV solution is planned. But SF2 isn't. What do you mean by "externally referenced"? Also NKI is not really planned, because afaik the format is not public.
It's a shame SF2 won't be supported.
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- KVRian
- 975 posts since 10 Jan, 2007 from London
Re nomenclature,tezza wrote: Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:16 amI mean that the soundfont file itself does not contain the sound samples. The samples are external but the sound font points to their location.MeldaProduction wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:53 pm Missing WAV solution is planned. But SF2 isn't. What do you mean by "externally referenced"? Also NKI is not really planned, because afaik the format is not public.
It's a shame SF2 won't be supported.
I think when sfz was invented (later than sf2) it was indeed thought of as another sort of 'soundfont' but these days I think it is generally accepted that a 'soundfont' refers to sf2 (two) format, and recently sf3 (three) as well, but not to sfz (zed) format.
Anyway, yes,
sf2 format always has the sample files embedded within the sf2 file (monolithic).
sfz format always has the sample files external to the sfz file, but sometimes the external samples files are in the same folder as the sfz file, sometimes in a separate folder, which can cause problems with sfz players finding the files (relative vs absolute file path sort of thing).
Last edited by goldglob on Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRAF
- 10376 posts since 2 Sep, 2003 from Surrey, UK
sforzando ( https://www.plogue.com/products/sforzando.html ) will convert SF2 to SFZ.
And as the sfz file is text you can edit path names , add in other properties etc.
And as the sfz file is text you can edit path names , add in other properties etc.
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- KVRian
- 975 posts since 10 Jan, 2007 from London
Hi Darkstar, the trouble with that ^^^ is that the Sforzando sf2> sfz conversion produces a non-conventional arrangement where the samples are lined up one after the other in a single wav file and the sfz file uses sample start/end point offsets (or something) to home in on them. Other sfz players seem to get confused with this... well, the old RGC audio sfz player does, and Wusik....just tried it with MSoundFactory, nope, get a 'syntax error'.
I suspect that Plogue didn't intend Sforzando to be used like that?
I suspect that Plogue didn't intend Sforzando to be used like that?
Last edited by goldglob on Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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- KVRAF
- 10376 posts since 2 Sep, 2003 from Surrey, UK
Ah OK. Maybe that the same sort of issue (not the treble posting 
) Vojtech would run into implementing SF2 support. I have no idea how audio samples are encoded within an SF2 file.
I've had another thought - how about Extreme Sample Converter? It looks like it supports both formats. Anyone got a small .sf2 that I can try it on?
) Vojtech would run into implementing SF2 support. I have no idea how audio samples are encoded within an SF2 file.I've had another thought - how about Extreme Sample Converter? It looks like it supports both formats. Anyone got a small .sf2 that I can try it on?
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- KVRian
- 975 posts since 10 Jan, 2007 from London
Heres one (less than 5MB) but for some reason I thought you would be the sort of person who has thousands of them gathering dust in the attic!
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5r19fhzkvd3au4u/Harp.zip?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5r19fhzkvd3au4u/Harp.zip?dl=0
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- KVRAF
- 10376 posts since 2 Sep, 2003 from Surrey, UK
You do not want to know what is in my attic.Meanwhile:
The SF2 file:
>>> https://i.imgur.com/GNavFGg.pngConverted to SFZ:
>>> https://i.imgur.com/c2bzMMo.pngHarp GM in MSF:
>>> https://i.imgur.com/Qx0KJm5.pngNB: The .wav samples are replicated for each .sfz instrument, but that can be rationalised by some judicious .sfz editing.
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- KVRist
- 370 posts since 26 Sep, 2014
I don't know if everybody missed it, but there is a free program which will:
1. Load existing files in the format sf2, sf3, sfz or sfArk (all versions).
2.Save your instruments in the sf2 format and export them as sfz or in the compressed sf3 format.
www.polyphone-soundfonts.com
All you have to do is open the SF2 file with Polyphone, then use "Save As SFZ"
EDIT: Goldglob subsequently mentioned that it's "Export as SFZ", just to avoid any confusion.
Simple and fast. In my case, I needed to go from SFZ to SF2, which worked perfectly.
But it also goes the other way...SF2 to SFZ. So there is a bridge, and it's for no $$$
(unless you decide to donate at some point. )
1. Load existing files in the format sf2, sf3, sfz or sfArk (all versions).
2.Save your instruments in the sf2 format and export them as sfz or in the compressed sf3 format.
www.polyphone-soundfonts.com
All you have to do is open the SF2 file with Polyphone, then use "Save As SFZ"
EDIT: Goldglob subsequently mentioned that it's "Export as SFZ", just to avoid any confusion.
Simple and fast. In my case, I needed to go from SFZ to SF2, which worked perfectly.
But it also goes the other way...SF2 to SFZ. So there is a bridge, and it's for no $$$
(unless you decide to donate at some point. )
Last edited by sirmonkey on Sat Mar 07, 2020 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.