NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
Matt_NI
KVRist
54 posts since 11 Mar, 2020

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:08 am

PAK wrote:
Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:34 pm
People need to STOP using the word OFFLINE. The proposed solution is horrible and is nothing of the sort. I regard the usage of "offline" as misleading. Let's parse what's actually written, shall we?
we are now focusing on a new offline activation tool which would allow our support to activate all the products listed. I don't have a full overview on how this would work yet but it looks very promising. I'm hoping to have something official about this in our announcement article next week.
The usage of "offline", in this context, is disingenuous at best. What actually appears to be proposed, as written, is an ONLINE challenge response activation. Except now, instead of a server automatically providing you with your response, someone from NI's customer service must be asked to step in and manually generate the response to the software you run locally, then forward it to you.

This means, come holidays, trade shows, or the apocalypse, you'll potentially be waiting several DAYS for an activation code. Such a solution also gives NI total control over when, and even IF, it chooses to continue activating anything in future.
I'm not sure why any of that would have a direct impact. We have a live chat for registration support available 5 days a week and so you wouldn't have to wait DAYS to get this processed. You don't have to wait days for anything account related anymore. Our account support is not affected by trade-shows at all and operate from 3 different time-zone so it should be nicely covered even if a couple of agents go on Christmas holiday.

It's worth mentioning that the amount of activation was also quite small and so that is why we feel this is actually manageable. Keep in mind the tool hasn't even been built yet and we don't know how automated it would be.

Matt_NI
KVRist
54 posts since 11 Mar, 2020

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:13 am

PAK wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:25 am

Software, like Pro 5, quite happily activated with no involvement from NI. Why won't they just do the same for Pro 53? It makes no sense to keep all of this old software so heavily locked down at this stage of their life.
I think I mentioned this before but some of our own software actually have another activation mechanism available and so they might not even be impacted at all. I'm pretty sure this includes products such Pro-53 or Spektral Delay. We are trying to identify which version exactly and will confirm this when we can update our announcement.

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Vertion
KVRian
674 posts since 29 Oct, 2016

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:38 am

@Matt_NI:

Just to clarify, NI orginally intended to abandon all future activation for these products. But now due to complaint, NI will continue to activate the products through a more obscure channel. Specifically requiring the customer to contact NI support via live chat and request activation.

Will activation support for these products continue into perpetuity? Or will abandonment of activation for these products simply be deferred to a later date vaguely in the future?
SLH - Yes, I am a woman, deal with it.

Matt_NI
KVRist
54 posts since 11 Mar, 2020

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:58 am

Vertion wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:38 am
@Matt_NI:

Just to clarify, NI orginally intended to abandon all future activation for these products. But now due to complaint, NI will continue to activate the products through a more obscure channel. Specifically requiring the customer to contact NI support via live chat and requesting activation.

Will activation support for these products continue into perpetuity? Or will abandonment of activation for these products simply be deferred to a later date vaguely in the future?
I think you can find a pretty good summary of it in this thread itself even though KVR isn't the only channels we are exchanging with users.

It's really not that obscure. You would just need to contact our account support if you need to re-activate some of the products listed on our announcement. We already have users requesting manual activation now so I imagine it won't be much different. We are confident enough with the amount of activation actually required on these instruments and this wouldn't really impact our workload.

It would be hard to predict what will be the status in 15 years but as far as we stand now, this will be a permanent solution for products affected by this change.

PAK
KVRian
894 posts since 20 Feb, 2003

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:00 am

Matt_NI wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:13 am
I think I mentioned this before but some of our own software actually have another activation mechanism available and so they might not even be impacted at all. I'm pretty sure this includes products such Pro-53 or Spektral Delay. We are trying to identify which version exactly and will confirm this when we can update our announcement.
Yes you did Matt, and (amongst it all) I did say we should wait and see how NI responds ;)

As I also said, in the context of 3rd party libraries, NI must consider things which are beyond just old code - as other companies IP, which NI does not own, is involved.

But, for some of this old stuff, I honestly don't know why NI wouldn't just unlock some of it or even give it away and create some good will amongst the small(ish?) crowd of people, still interested in this sort of vintage software. And, yes, maybe someone on KVR would still find a way to complain about that ;)

For NI's part, beyond all that.. NI set an example, in terms of customer reassurance around issues of copy protection. I think it's important that they figure a way to hopefully keep customer trust and confidence to the degree they can. Their position is such that what they do, as a company, goes beyond just NI.

Matt_NI
KVRist
54 posts since 11 Mar, 2020

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:22 am

PAK wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:00 am
Matt_NI wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 2:13 am
I think I mentioned this before but some of our own software actually have another activation mechanism available and so they might not even be impacted at all. I'm pretty sure this includes products such Pro-53 or Spektral Delay. We are trying to identify which version exactly and will confirm this when we can update our announcement.
Yes you did Matt, and (amongst it all) I did say we should wait and see how NI responds ;)

As I also said, in the context of 3rd party libraries, NI must consider things which are beyond just old code - as other companies IP, which NI does not own, is involved.

But, for some of this old stuff, I honestly don't know why NI wouldn't just unlock some of it or even give it away and create some good will amongst the small(ish?) crowd of people, still interested in this sort of vintage software. And, yes, maybe someone on KVR would still find a way to complain about that ;)

For NI's part, beyond all that.. NI set an example, in terms of customer reassurance around issues of copy protection. I think it's important that they figure a way to hopefully keep customer trust and confidence to the degree they can. Their position is such that what they do, as a company, goes beyond just NI.
Appreciate the feedback and I apologise if I sometime cut a bit too much of the original message.

We did put the idea of "giving some of our legacy instruments away" on the table and for x or y reasons it didn't seem to get a clear go ahead. I'll ask again but I would say that at this point, it's quite unlikely :/ I do agree that it would be a fantastic idea.

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Vertion
KVRian
674 posts since 29 Oct, 2016

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 5:57 am

We did put the idea of "giving some of our legacy instruments away" on the table and for x or y reasons it didn't seem to get a clear go ahead. I'll ask again but I would say that at this point, it's quite unlikely :/ I do agree that it would be a fantastic idea.
Matt_NI, Thank you for all you have done to keep us informed. I appreciate that you have been a great messenger through this situation. However, I would like someone from NI who actually has some pull in the company to answer these questions. A decision maker who can step up to the plate and give us concrete answers and reasons for these decisions. PAK has some solid points, I’d like to see what the decision makers have to say about it, if they are willing.
SLH - Yes, I am a woman, deal with it.

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
19687 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:05 am

Yeah that probably ain't happening. Decision makers speak through Matt, is how it goes.

imrae
KVRian
1090 posts since 2 Jul, 2010

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:34 am

It would also be nice to know if lessons have been learned from the underlying mistake (i.e. writing plugins with unmaintainable copy-protection code and no fallback version). Or will this happen again to plugins based on some of the Native Access methods?

Also, what happens if NI goes under? (Or, more likely, is bought up by a clueless Gibson-like entity and closed arbitrarily.)

rasmusklump
KVRian
1031 posts since 13 May, 2004 from Germany

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 7:11 am

Then you are the loser. Don't believe a single word if N.I. promises something in this case.
I have been there with three companies already although unlocked versions were promised prior...

surreal
KVRian
1477 posts since 3 Dec, 2006

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:22 am

EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 11:55 pm
surreal wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 11:46 pm
and I was told that a third of their workforce internationally were retrenched... maybe 1/5 of their workforce in Berlin was laid off
You were told incorrectly. NI had 500-ish people around the world before the layoffs, and 100 people (around the world, not just in Berlin office) were laid off. Do the math. :)


Now, what exactly was "hacked" on your computer by Service Center, because I find that hard to believe, as there is no malicious code in it whatsoever?
Ok.my sums dont add up in math as according to you I was misinformed... but when native access is installed and two month later my service center app just "mysteriously" dissappears into thin air off my computer after a native access update ..well that equates to "hacking" and equates malware activity in my opinion. Strange that your memory is shortlived, when I previously mentioned this unacceptable and hacking behavior your answer was just I should simply just reinstall service center and it should show up. It was this very act of Native Instruments disabling and crippling service center on my computer that threw red lights flashing, highlighting NI future plans to force this issue we have at hand. In other word their attitude was... well screw Pro53 (which was working pefectly on my system) make it "dysfunctional" and that it cant be "reactivated" so that the end user can simply just be forced to repurchase the equivalent in a different reactor form again.

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vurt
addled muppet weed
65238 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:24 am

well i still have service centre and native access.
as do many people.
why would they only hack your computer?

are you sure you didnt do a f**k up?

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vurt
addled muppet weed
65238 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:28 am

and yes, im on nis pay roll.
they just dont know it yet and will be recieving my bill just as soon as this whole "thing" (not this, that) is over.

surreal
KVRian
1477 posts since 3 Dec, 2006

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:44 am

vurt wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:24 am
well i still have service centre and native access.
as do many people.
why would they only hack your computer?

are you sure you didnt do a f**k up?
Yes I did... by buying and installing Native Instruments in the first place... and no Vurt.. I Did not screw up by simply installing Native Access and letting NI do its updating thing and then on restart .. gone is service centre and removed is the application. .. and NO THANOS from the Avengers Movie did not fingersnap his Jewel studded welding glove near my pc either ....
Last edited by surreal on Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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vurt
addled muppet weed
65238 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: NI have announced they will no longer activate discontinued products

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:46 am

thanos is not an avenger :shrug:

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