Sharing and export product?

[LaNonchalance]

Hello everyone,
There is something about the preset, device, and the product that I've trouble to really grasp. I will tell you what I've understood, correct me if I'm wrong.

1-let's say that I've made 50 presets in the global preset,
2-then i want them turn into devices so that i can make preset inside those exes preset that are now devices, and commercialize them,
3-If all my devices are part of same " bank of devices " i can group them and sell them under a product file, and they will all have the same serial key ( no need to install devices one by one )
is that right ?

if it is i have another question:

When you install a product, all your devices will be available in separate categories of the devices tree right ?
Now let's say that i only want to see all the devices of the bank that i've just purchased, where do i look?
is it possible to:
Export my devices into a new folder that i've created in my devices folder, and when someone wants to install the product on his computer, the product will automatic create a new folder inside the devices tree of his computer ?

[LaNonchalance]

Never mind I've just tried it. If you were wondering, the answer is yes to everything.

However I've met a problem when turning presets into devices, all the knobs moved randomly and changed the settings that I have made. I mean and can still put it the way it was but if i have to re order all the devices that where perfectly tuned is kinda annoying

[LaNonchalance]

Once again I've figured out, and if you were wondering again : it's seem that when you export your preset into device, all the multi parameters will go to their default value.

Keep that in mind when doing a large number of presets, it's save you a tone of extra work

[DarkStar]

Wouldn't it be handy for Device designers to be able to click a single button to store the current values as the defaults for every multiparameter. [Set current value] as Default in the Multiparameter Editor does that for that one MP. Perhaps Shift+click could be used?

That way you can design your device, play around with all the parameters, set the Device exactly as you want, then export it. Setting the Defaults one at a time is problematic; you will almost certainly miss at least one.

[I've sent a Feature Suggestion to Vojtech.]

[LaNonchalance]

I totally agree on this one!!

Actually while I'm working on this project I take note of every small details like this this. sometime it's not really that much but it could save a lot of time!

I will send those requests too when I'm sure of what I'm talking ( because sometimes it's just that I don't know how to)

[David]

Once again I've figured out, and if you were wondering again : it's seem that when you export your preset into device, all the multi parameters will go to their default value.

Keep that in mind when doing a large number of presets, it's save you a tone of extra work

Where's the work-saving come in? How does knowing you need to, keep you from having to convert all settings to defaults anyway, so you don't lose all the Global's settings?

_______


I must say I can't quite follow your workflow, so I can't yet see how to offer any constructive response, for whatever that might be worth.

OK, you're building a bunch of Global Presets. How are they related? Or ARE they? Are the ones you decide to convert simply the best of your recent GPs, or is there some common theme/structure that ties them all together, or…?

More specifically, at what point do they get Multi-parameters or Easy Screens? (I don't see the point in converting them to Devices if they don't…?)

And do they all have the same grids?

If they DO have Easy Screens, why not simply make Device Presets for them? And if all the same grids, even more sensible to skip making Global Presets and just make device ones. Nothing to convert. And if you want to change settings that don't have MPs you can still use the same device presets with them, just by importing them when you create a new device based on an existing one.

If you want to elaborate, I'd be very interested to hear more:)

Back to defaults, I notice that most of the newer built-in devices have as their first preset one called "Default", which seems to me just an adaptation to the fact that the device will load in a default state and it will LOOK like it's set to a preset that's SUPPOSED to sound like that, when actually it's not set to any preset, as far as I can tell, when just loaded, so it's not just when converted that devices open up in a default state, it's every time they're opened. On my own devices, I don't bother to set a bunch of interesting defaults to ensure the opening state is useable, I just save some presets and assume the first step after loading will always be to click either the left or right-pointing preset arrows or the Random Preset button to get to a sound I actually created. Calling the first preset Default doesn't change the likelihood that the first thing any user would do would be to switch to another preset.

And since these can't be demo'ed I don't see any real point in making sure the first patch is a stunner, except just because that'd be cool:) I need to find a lot of interesting options in the form of good presets before I decide any synth/device is worth spending any further time with, not just one killer one that it defaults to.

What I'd prefer is to be able to designate a created preset as the opening one, or to have devices simply remember the preset they were on when closed. But it's certainly not a big deal, just another odd little Melda quirk:)

[LaNonchalance]

Ho that's true my bad, I've never talked about how I ended up here.

I'm working on a bank of instruments that have the same Adn. They all share the same easy gui structure with enough options that justify the need of using a device I think. I've not taken an approach like the " super saw " where you have one big structure that you tweak to obtain different sound. i've chosen to make multiples small devices with a few options that define the charactere of the bank of instruments.

It will maybe clearer if I explain what i've done.

Since it was the first time, I did it one step at a time without considering the whole thing (I had to learn designing sound, designing the easy gui and export the product step by step ) . Now that i grasp it a little better, I would not do it like that again but here how it went.


1. I've fixed a number of instruments in different section ( the classic ones like bell, key, pad...) and then I've started designing my sound in the global preset.

2. I could leave it as it is, but i thought that it will be better if each preset had more options without having to go behind the scene. And this when the necessity of multi parameters and G.u.i came.

3. then once again I've could leave it as it is, but it's appear that's there were some instruments that I had to always tweak because I like them in this way too. So turning the presets into devices enabled me to add preset to them. That's why I turned everything into device.

4. Then once they were all devices, I've noticed that all the knob came back to the default multiparameter setting. And now I'm putting everything in order. Actually the devices still work as it is and I don't necessarily need to change the default setting of all my devices. I've structured my multi parameters in a way that no matter which option you choose, the devices will still be usable. I just want the user to ear the devices the way I've originally designed it right at the start. If I can go around this problem with just changing the default multi parameters setting it's okay for me !



If you don't get it, don't worry I will soon release it here as a beta. It will be simpler and I could get feedback. But either way thanks for your reply and your help !! It helped me getting a better understanding of my choices ,because I was not really sure about the way i did all this!

[David]

No, I totally get it, at least the part about being already deep into fiddling with MSF before you really understand it and can see how it's SUPPOSED to be done, or get the "Melda Way" at all. Both are totally weird and unique, and oh so powerful:)

At the start, I did something very similar to what you describe, except I saved everything as a Device for a long time, mostly without MPs even, since I didn't get them at all and didn't even know there WAS such a thing as Global Presets:) But I also struggled for a long while trying to build things that met Vojtech's list of goals and suggestions. Happily, that all fell away when he suddenly decided to just sell MSF as is for $100, so I could stop worrying about how to earn a free copy:)

Also, I've no ambition to ever have MSF products to sell, so I can just do whatever I want—AH, at last!

[David]

Fwiw, I've bought one MSF presets pack, from Simon Stockhausen at Patchpool. His are all Global presets, even though some have some Easy Screen controls, none are devices. There are a few others that I've heard about but not bought, but I very much doubt any of them are Device collections. Devices take a LONG time to make!!

There's a bit more to this distinction, I find. I tried converting a few of Simon's presets with MPs to devices, but didn't find that they actually were useful starting points for saving new presets from. Whereas my personal goal when designing in MSF is precisely to create tools that are preset-creation engines, NOT single, one-off killer sounds or finished polished performance instruments, such as Simon's sounds seem to be, by intention.

So, two really quite different options that MSF offers, unlike any other synth I know of—including Reaktor! It really IS a sort of "factory"—for building more factories:)

[LaNonchalance]

Exactly!! it's like every time i open MSF i end up thinking " ho, we can do that ?! "

Haha, lucky you! It took me also some time to understand where Vojtech wanted to go with his list of goal ( and i still not sure if i really get it haha) and like you i just thought let just do things ! Doing what ever you want is actually why MSF is fun to work with !

Whereas my personal goal when designing in MSF is precisely to create tools that are preset-creation engines, NOT single, one-off killer sounds or finished polished performance instruments, such as Simon's sounds seem to be, by intention.

I totally agree with ! This approach is a new way of thinking the product that I've never heard about ( to be fair I've just started ). Either ways, to be able to do all this inside MSF is really crazy !

If you have link to other MSF preset pack, i would love to ear them ! I'm looking forward to your super engine too !!

[dmbaer]

Wouldn't it be handy for Device designers to be able to click a single button to store the current values as the defaults for every multiparameter. [Set current value] as Default in the Multiparameter Editor does that for that one MP. Perhaps Shift+click could be used?

That way you can design your device, play around with all the parameters, set the Device exactly as you want, then export it. Setting the Defaults one at a time is problematic; you will almost certainly miss at least one.

[I've sent a Feature Suggestion to Vojtech.]

That's a wonderful idea. It would have saved me a lot of time (frustration) had it been there all along.

[David]

…
If you have link to other MSF preset pack, i would love to ear them ! I'm looking forward to your super engine too !!

https://vintagesynthpads.com/ocart/msoundfactory

http://www.wagsrfm.com/msf/

https://www.patchpool.net/msf_synth_factory.html

Oh, I'm not after a "super engine"! Lots of little weird preset-making engines is more my goal:)

And here's a few, posted already here elsewhere (good thing they're not for sale; nobody ever seems to download them:)

A pretty straight forward PM instrument, with an arp which might be confusing, as it sometimes makes the preset initially seem to not be working if it's set to slow, so keep the panel that shows it on or not visible and check it both on and off… There's a rate control on the main tab, so you don't have to open the arp panel itself.

TBZ Factory w Guitars.zip

This one's definitely an oddball; turn the limiter ON!:

Madman'sKeys MSF instrument and presets.zip

And I've even tried to create a product; would very much appreciate some feedback on if it actually works when installed!

RezoString 1.mproduct.zip

Thanks for asking; not required that you like them or comment! But if you have any questions or confusions, please ask, here or via PM.

[David]

Wouldn't it be handy for Device designers to be able to click a single button to store the current values as the defaults for every multiparameter. [Set current value] as Default in the Multiparameter Editor does that for that one MP. Perhaps Shift+click could be used?

That way you can design your device, play around with all the parameters, set the Device exactly as you want, then export it. Setting the Defaults one at a time is problematic; you will almost certainly miss at least one.

[I've sent a Feature Suggestion to Vojtech.]

That's a wonderful idea. It would have saved me a lot of time (frustration) had it been there all along.

I agree, certainly. But I seem to recall this being already requested and nixed:(

[LaNonchalance]

Thanks for asking; not required that you like them or comment! But if you have any questions or confusions, please ask, here or via PM.

Thanks for all those link and for sharing your project !
I've tried reso string and now i understand what you mean by "preset-making engines" !
Im impressed by the fact that even if it's not a big engine this is really versatile, good work!

[David]

Thanks for asking; not required that you like them or comment! But if you have any questions or confusions, please ask, here or via PM.

Thanks for all those link and for sharing your project !
I've tried reso string and now i understand what you mean by "preset-making engines" !
Im impressed by the fact that even if it's not a big engine this is really versatile, good work!

Ah, glad to hear it loaded up OK; thank you!