KVR Audio

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Fri May 08, 2020 5:51 pm

You could try Africa.

Sorry, I had to.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Fri May 08, 2020 7:33 pm

sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:34 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:19 pm Easy! It's Thorn! It even has the same harmonic filter.
thank you! thorn does look very appealing, i will definitely have to demo it.

You can get Thorn CM from latest Computer Music magazine online issue. I'm using this one and love it

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Fri May 08, 2020 7:52 pm

chk071 wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 5:51 pm You could try Africa.

Sorry, I had to.

Why You...!

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Fri May 08, 2020 7:57 pm

EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:33 pm
sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:34 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:19 pm Easy! It's Thorn! It even has the same harmonic filter.
thank you! thorn does look very appealing, i will definitely have to demo it.
You can get Thorn CM from latest Computer Music magazine online issue. I'm using this one and love it

does it lack any features that regular Thorn holds? and how does the subscription model work? do I get to keep the collected plugins if I ever cancel my subscription?

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Fri May 08, 2020 8:30 pm

sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:57 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:33 pm
sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:34 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:19 pm Easy! It's Thorn! It even has the same harmonic filter.
thank you! thorn does look very appealing, i will definitely have to demo it.
You can get Thorn CM from latest Computer Music magazine online issue. I'm using this one and love it
does it lack any features that regular Thorn holds? and how does the subscription model work? do I get to keep the collected plugins if I ever cancel my subscription?

CM should pay me for this

You can buy only one issue online (Google it, I think it's Zinio website) then read the instructions to download the contents. You'll also find another great synths from u-he and others

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Fri May 08, 2020 8:41 pm

EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 8:30 pm
sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:57 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 7:33 pm
sidesword wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:34 pm
EnGee wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:19 pm Easy! It's Thorn! It even has the same harmonic filter.
thank you! thorn does look very appealing, i will definitely have to demo it.
You can get Thorn CM from latest Computer Music magazine online issue. I'm using this one and love it
does it lack any features that regular Thorn holds? and how does the subscription model work? do I get to keep the collected plugins if I ever cancel my subscription?
CM should pay me for this

You can buy only one issue online (Google it, I think it's Zinio website) then read the instructions to download the contents. You'll also find another great synths from u-he and others

Checking it out right now! Also includes a good sample library. Thanks

hlecram · Post by **hlecram** » Fri May 08, 2020 9:08 pm

I also want to suggest image line harmor , which is on sale on some reseller sites if I’m not mistaken...

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Fri May 08, 2020 9:15 pm

hlecram wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 9:08 pm I also want to suggest image line harmor , which is on sale on some reseller sites if I’m not mistaken...

Alas!

it is windows only! It is definitely a different kind of beast that I would love to try and tame but Image Line does not want us to meet.

hlecram · Post by **hlecram** » Fri May 08, 2020 9:24 pm

Ouch, excuse me. Didn’t read the part where you stated that it has to run on Mac ...

Anyway, thorn is a great suggestion as well!

Calenberger · Post by **Calenberger** » Sat May 09, 2020 6:46 am

Rumours swirling in some places a successor is coming soon and will be named Aphrodite.
Surely the GUI will look a bit prettier.

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Sat May 09, 2020 9:00 am

Calenberger wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 6:46 am Rumours swirling in some places a successor is coming soon and will be named Aphrodite.
Surely the GUI will look a bit prettier.

a successor to thorn or europa? i find both still very refreshing and new

i can’t imagine how they’d improve or outperform either one.

eXode · Post by **eXode** » Sat May 09, 2020 9:43 am

I didn't understand one thing, do you (OP) own Europa already?

And yeah, for the record, Reason Studios seem to have discontinued the plugin (doesn't mean it doesn't work if you already own it though).

I know you say you want to stay away from the rack, but just highlighting the fact that Reason 11 Intro is $99 USD and includes Europa, that's cheaper than the VST was. You could choose to use the Rack plugin simply as a wrapper for Europa.

sidesword · Post by **sidesword** » Sat May 09, 2020 10:48 am

eXode wrote: Sat May 09, 2020 9:43 am I didn't understand one thing, do you (OP) own Europa already?

And yeah, for the record, Reason Studios seem to have discontinued the plugin (doesn't mean it doesn't work if you already own it though).

I know you say you want to stay away from the rack, but just highlighting the fact that Reason 11 Intro is $99 USD and includes Europa, that's cheaper than the VST was. You could choose to use the Rack plugin simply as a wrapper for Europa.

I own Reason Suite and it’s sensational, If discontinued does that mean they won’t update it further and have chances of losing stability upon future MacOS updates?

I understand it’s an incredible offer to get all those instruments for $99 but using the rack feels so alien to me compared to the full DAW i’m not sure why. I’m just trying to make music and If it comes to it where I feel I could be developing my sound with another DAW and VST(s) i would like to have my future options ready.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Sat May 09, 2020 9:31 pm

I wish they make a path for upgrading the intro version. Why it must be like Ableton and not Cubase?!
I have intro 10. Although, intro 11 has a good price, but no upgrade from previous version. Anyway, I have Europa vst from a previous license of Reason, and it works fine with my hosts

yellowmix · Post by **yellowmix** » Sun May 10, 2020 3:20 am

https://www.reasonstudios.com/en/reason/faq

What about Europa by Reason, the VST version of Europa?

Europa by Reason will be discontinued since Europa is included in all versions of Reason Rack Plugin. Everyone who owns Europa by Reason will be able to continue using it, but it will no longer be available for sale.

Only the VST version is discontinued. Europa as a rack instrument will in theory continue to be developed.

I have the VST version and have no interest in upgrading an entire suite for one synth. But It's 64-bit so I don't expect it to stop working any time soon. Did Catalina stop it from working or was it updated? Not sure when the discontinuation was announced, I was not notified. Definitely personally disappointed but I know they're struggling to stay relevant so theirs is a rational decision to me.

Forgotten wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 4:11 pm I use it to load my own wavetables and get some really messed up sounds.

I find Europa has a really lazy wavetable engine. There are several ways of moving through wavetable frames, the simplest is to switch frames when the previous one finishes, the most refined and CPU intensive methods will do spectral interpolation. Europa opted for switching. However, this can pose a problem when a frame ends at a different level from where the next one starts, creating switching artifacts.

Europa solves this by fading all frame edges in or out so they always meet the next frame at a zero-crossing. This drastically changes the spectrum of the wavetable frame. Even if you are doing no table movement, staying on one frame only, it is already modified. This cannot be disabled, you cannot adjust the fade lengths (which IMO is too long). So if you are used to how a wavetable sounds in other synths, this is why.

Note that changing table movement method can significantly affect how the table sounds. This is easy to hear in Hive 2, where you can easily switch between several methods to determine the preferred case. This isn't changeable in Europe, so you can ascribe it to the synth's character. The modifiers and spectral processor following the oscillator impart plenty of changes such that you can work with any wavetable as long as you don't expect it to sound like it's originally supposed to. So it's a good opportunity to try the wavetables you don't usually use in other synths to see what you can get.

As to OP, maybe check out Odin 2 from The Wave Warden, it is in beta, but has a similar mod matrix and approach to building patches, and it's free. VST3 for Mac available and there is a beta AU version.

Europa replacement suggestions