are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

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magicmusic
KVRian
1175 posts since 11 Nov, 2013

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:45 am

for good guitar sound it is also very important to have a good reverb and delay. so maybe there are impulses that contain delay and reverb ?.
Last edited by magicmusic on Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
27405 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: are there impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:50 am

There are a ton of impulses from reverb units ...

magicmusic
KVRian
1175 posts since 11 Nov, 2013

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:51 am

sorry i edit title. i mean speaker cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay too.
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BertKoor
KVRAF
11824 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:54 am

Then it's not a cabinet IR anymore ;-)
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CapnLockheed
KVRAF
2348 posts since 12 Mar, 2002 from Central NY

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:35 am

i mean speaker cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay too.
Sorry, AFAIK no such animal. But......

There are MANY IR loaders that allow you to load multiple IRS. So just load your cab IR, then a verb and/or delay IR.....mission accomplished.
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Daimonicon
KVRian
1008 posts since 30 Aug, 2012 from Sweden

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:45 am

A real cab does not have any effects so ask for a cab impulse with delay and reverb, very odd question. Anyway double or quadtrack if you want a bigger tone. Or use a widener plugin. But any widener plugin should be used sparingly for best result.

fese
KVRian
1155 posts since 14 Sep, 2004 from $HOME

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:50 am

It wouldn’t really make sense to include delay and reverb in a cab IR, as they need to be adapted to the song’s tempo, especially delay. You’d have to sample the IR for every delay and reverb setting people would want to use. No one will do that.

The closest you’ll get is with IRs that include a room mic. Two Notes wall of sound plugin has that (even variable), as do others.

magicmusic
KVRian
1175 posts since 11 Nov, 2013

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:07 am

The problem is, when i add reverb or delay to a cabinet and tweak reverb, delay so it sound good for this cabinet and when i change cabinet then sound not so good with this cabinet. so a ready for mix combination of reverb and cabinet and delay is very usefull i think.

Wall of sound i test, but it sound not good. it sound as other VST amp sims very muddy in compare to my real amp or records play at 75-80 db loud. maybe the sounds are made that it sound as a real cabinet at 100 db. when sound is 100 db loud then muddy sound is not hear. but i wish do mixes that sound good in room volume at 75-80 db. i want save my ears and i hear never 100 db loud guitar.
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miloszz
KVRist
95 posts since 5 Jul, 2019

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:06 pm

Most cabinet IRs used in modeling are very short specifically to exclude room reverb, much less unnatural reverb and delay effects - the Helix truncates IRs to 42ms or something like that.

For what you're asking you could try a convolution reverb that mixes two IRs, like Liquidsonics Reverberate and throw in a cabinet impulse and a delay or reverb.

CapnLockheed
KVRAF
2348 posts since 12 Mar, 2002 from Central NY

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Sat May 23, 2020 10:06 am

miloszz wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:06 pm
Most cabinet IRs used in modeling are very short specifically to exclude room reverb, much less unnatural reverb and delay effects - the Helix truncates IRs to 42ms or something like that.

For what you're asking you could try a convolution reverb that mixes two IRs, like Liquidsonics Reverberate and throw in a cabinet impulse and a delay or reverb.
Like I already said:
There are MANY IR loaders that allow you to load multiple IRS. So just load your cab IR, then a verb and/or delay IR.....mission accomplished.
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BlitBit
KVRist
319 posts since 28 Nov, 2013 from Germany

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Sat May 23, 2020 12:01 pm

magicmusic wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:51 am
sorry i edit title. i mean speaker cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay too.
Because this is a rather special request I assume that ready to use IRs of this type do not exist.

However, you can build them yourself if you want. You basically do this by taking the individual IRs and mixing them down into one new IR file. This should work because IRs describe a linear time-invariant system. To do so follow these steps:
  1. Get an IR loader that lets you load multiple IRs as was proposed by CapnLockheed.
  2. Load the cab IR, delay IR and reverb IR into the IR loader.
  3. Play your guitar into the IR loader and adjust it until you have something you like.
  4. Turn off any plugins/effects before the IR loader, e.g. amp sims, pedals, etc.
  5. Now replace your guitar signal with a sample of a so called dirac pulse. You can find wav files with a dirac pulse in my post here.
  6. Record the result into a new track.
  7. Normalize the track.
  8. Put the new track into an IR loader. It should give you the same result as the IR loader with the multiple IRs.
Please note that IR loaders which are intended to be used for cabinet IRs might not really be optimized for the potentially long IRs that can result when using reverb with long tails.
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BlitBit
KVRist
319 posts since 28 Nov, 2013 from Germany

Re: are there Cabinet impulses that contain reverb and delay so they sound big and great as in final mix ?

Post Sat May 23, 2020 12:11 pm

miloszz wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:06 pm
Most cabinet IRs used in modeling are very short specifically to exclude room reverb, much less unnatural reverb and delay effects - the Helix truncates IRs to 42ms or something like that.
I think there might also be another reason. A cabinet IR is basically the description of a very detailed filter/EQ. With an IR of 42ms the cutoff of the lowest frequency that you can filter should be around 12Hz. Longer IRs will only let you filter lower frequencies, i.e. they will move the cutoff frequency down. Because the guitar definitively lives above 12Hz using 42ms should more than suffice.

Put differently: A 42ms IR should give you an EQ in the range of 12Hz to Nyquist.

Edit: Corrected the frequencies because I forgot that we only need to be able to store a half wave to filter out a frequency.
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