Honest question for mac users

[Hink]

[pekbro]

A mac is like a lexus, there are faster cheaper cars out there, but the lexus is a nice ride, I mean c'mon
macs are nice, aluminum bodies, premium screens etc. You gotta buy a pretty expensive PC laptop to
get one that is as luxurious as your general mac.

Absolutely nothing wrong with driving a lexus if you want and can afford it.

I like macs definitely, but I use PC for one reason or another. I have bought them in the past, and even made them with hardware that I bought or had lying around. Though I guess they are going to put the kibosh on the hackintosh guys now, at least personally I don't see much point in continuing down that road.

Anyway, there really isn't a wrong choice between pc, mac, linux whatever, that much is true certainly.

btw: ^^ that is definitely how to proceed while in Sasquatch country...

[Passing Bye]

And there's more. Mac OS is harder to fix problems with and in my few months of using it I came across more of them than I have in 11 years of Windows usage (such as files and apps behaving weirdly), less intuitive to use (again I used it for months so it's not that I didn't take the time to learn the basics), you actually still can get malware on mac OS (only time I've ever gotten it was on mac), and there's more but this is already getting really long, and I'd rathewr hear what you have to say first.

Cool story bro, so you bought a Mac, when and which one?

Than you used it for few months, but managed to get malware on it and screw up whole system? Which one, where, what, warez, porn sites, what did you do?

[quincy]

I'll join in and I'll try to be honest. I currently have a late 2013 macbook pro with a 4-core i5 processor and 8GB RAM. It's not a powerful machine by modern standards but it's not a slouch either.

I'm a software developer by trade (about 15 years) and a hobbyist producer so I have medium-to-high needs in terms of performance depending on what I'm doing. If I'm running heavy development tools like IDE and also docker to run my web development "stack" then it gets a bit heavy in terms of memory and CPU usage. In terms of music production I use Bitwig and sometimes Ableton or Reason. I've never had any issues even when I run tens of tracks of modern synth plugins like Pigments, for example. That's enough for me and, I suspect, the average hobbyist music producer. Mileage may vary and I appreciate that "pro" users would need more power.

I can't speak for modern windows machines but this 7 year-old Macbook pro has given me almost no trouble ever. I don't get badgered to install tiny updates and patches. I don't get viruses. It has crashed a handful of times but only due to my own stupidity of having chrome open with 50 tabs and also a DAW and an IDE and everything else at once. That's just me being an idiot. 8GB RAM can only go so far. I've certainly had considerably less trouble than the previous 15 odd years of using Windows when I had all kinds of annoyances and problems. My friends and family who use Windows also need my help regularly when they have problems with Windows and upgrades and patches etc. I don't have any of that hassle.

I entirely 100% acknowledge that Apple charge me a premium for the hardware but, for me, the quality of life stuff that I get in return is well worth it. It's very simple for me to back up and restore the entire laptop with time machine and it just works. Application and file management is easier. Installing and uninstalling software is easier and less error-prone. If you have an Apple phone or tablet (which I do) the integration between all these things is so easy. I can send or receive files wirelessly with no trouble and it just works. Lots of ordinary day-to-day stuff just works.

Like many other people I found the transition from PC/Windows to Mac/OSX was a bit of a learning curve but I don't know a single person who has made that transition that would go back even if you paid them. I have friends and family who have had the opportunity to "go apple" in the time I've had my Macbook and they bought a windows machine and are now looking at buying new machines again because they reach a point where things have changed so much or the machine has become outdated or they're having software problems and a "clean start" is their best option if they aren't technically minded. And they have no idea how to back up the old machine and save their stuff. In the meantime, my 7 year-old Macbook Pro works nearly as well as the day I bought it and if I bought a new mac tomorrow I could restore my entire system with one click. I reckon this thing could keep going for another 3 years at which point I've had a single laptop for 10 years. I don't know many people who've ever got that sort of mileage from a PC. And yes, if you're a techie then you can upgrade the components but that's not straightforward for most people and there are often issues with incompatible hardware etc. I know that I'm currently stuck with the same hardware (and I cannot upgrade) but it runs like a dream so what difference does it make? I paid £950 in 2013 and I've got a laptop that still runs like a dream without a single upgrade or any messing about. I believe that's good value.

It comes down to this - if you're prepared to pay the premium then IMO the quality of life stuff is well worth it. You might have some teething pains but in the long run I think the average user is likely to have an easier time. I think that there is a reason that Apple is so popular and successful (despite legitimate criticisms around price) and that's basically that you can buy their stuff and it "just works" for the average non-technical consumer. Most people don't, in a million years, want to "upgrade" their computer or open it up or even install a software update. So if you sell them a product that will "just work" for 3-5 years or even longer then they'll be happy.

[Dafydd Powell]

I also don't care what system someone chooses, nor do I care why and as such, I couldn't be invested to provide counter arguments to something that I don't care to argue (since that's what you seem to be after).

This is an honest response to your honest question.

I do have a question for you (the OP)...

Why do you care?

Is it FOMO? I mean you seem to have things decided for yourself and that's what's most important.

I just wanted to understand the benefits really, and what it is that makes people choose maca as it didnt make sense to me and i wondered if i was missing something and had made a mistake using pc. So yeah, i guess you could call it fomo

[Dafydd Powell]

A mac is like a lexus, there are faster cheaper cars out there, but the lexus is a nice ride, I mean c'mon
macs are nice, aluminum bodies, premium screens etc. You gotta buy a pretty expensive PC laptop to
get one that is as luxurious as your general mac.

Absolutely nothing wrong with driving a lexus if you want and can afford it.

I like macs definitely, but I use PC for one reason or another. I have bought them in the past, and even made them with hardware that I bought or had lying around. Though I guess they are going to put the kibosh on the hackintosh guys now, at least personally I don't see much point in continuing down that road.

Anyway, there really isn't a wrong choice between pc, mac, linux whatever, that much is true certainly.

btw: ^^ that is definitely how to proceed while in Sasquatch country...

By luxurious do you mean doesnt cool its processor properly? You can get pc laptops with better screens for much cheaper too, especially if we're talking about a macbook pro, which im assuming we are as i find it unlikely many people would use an air for music production.

Nobody here seems to understand this, so ill say it again: I was NOT trying to say that any choice is better, just trying to understand the methodology behind people's choice to buy macs.

[Dafydd Powell]

And there's more. Mac OS is harder to fix problems with and in my few months of using it I came across more of them than I have in 11 years of Windows usage (such as files and apps behaving weirdly), less intuitive to use (again I used it for months so it's not that I didn't take the time to learn the basics), you actually still can get malware on mac OS (only time I've ever gotten it was on mac), and there's more but this is already getting really long, and I'd rathewr hear what you have to say first.

Cool story bro, so you bought a Mac, when and which one?

Than you used it for few months, but managed to get malware on it and screw up whole system? Which one, where, what, warez, porn sites, what did you do?

2011 macbook pro. I got Flashback in 2012, google it if you dont know what that is. All I did was click on a link to update flash player, and poof, trojan. Didnt even know I had it for a few weeks, couldve been dangerous.

I like how you accuse me of lying because you dont believe that macs can get malware. This worldwide assumption macs are invincible and cannot get malware is only the result of a several year long marketing campaign by apple, and it isnt true at all, while they are still less likely than pcs to get malware.

[Dafydd Powell]

I'll join in and I'll try to be honest. I currently have a late 2013 macbook pro with a 4-core i5 processor and 8GB RAM. It's not a powerful machine by modern standards but it's not a slouch either.

I'm a software developer by trade (about 15 years) and a hobbyist producer so I have medium-to-high needs in terms of performance depending on what I'm doing. If I'm running heavy development tools like IDE and also docker to run my web development "stack" then it gets a bit heavy in terms of memory and CPU usage. In terms of music production I use Bitwig and sometimes Ableton or Reason. I've never had any issues even when I run tens of tracks of modern synth plugins like Pigments, for example. That's enough for me and, I suspect, the average hobbyist music producer. Mileage may vary and I appreciate that "pro" users would need more power.

I can't speak for modern windows machines but this 7 year-old Macbook pro has given me almost no trouble ever. I don't get badgered to install tiny updates and patches. I don't get viruses. It has crashed a handful of times but only due to my own stupidity of having chrome open with 50 tabs and also a DAW and an IDE and everything else at once. That's just me being an idiot. 8GB RAM can only go so far. I've certainly had considerably less trouble than the previous 15 odd years of using Windows when I had all kinds of annoyances and problems. My friends and family who use Windows also need my help regularly when they have problems with Windows and upgrades and patches etc. I don't have any of that hassle.

I entirely 100% acknowledge that Apple charge me a premium for the hardware but, for me, the quality of life stuff that I get in return is well worth it. It's very simple for me to back up and restore the entire laptop with time machine and it just works. Application and file management is easier. Installing and uninstalling software is easier and less error-prone. If you have an Apple phone or tablet (which I do) the integration between all these things is so easy. I can send or receive files wirelessly with no trouble and it just works. Lots of ordinary day-to-day stuff just works.

Like many other people I found the transition from PC/Windows to Mac/OSX was a bit of a learning curve but I don't know a single person who has made that transition that would go back even if you paid them. I have friends and family who have had the opportunity to "go apple" in the time I've had my Macbook and they bought a windows machine and are now looking at buying new machines again because they reach a point where things have changed so much or the machine has become outdated or they're having software problems and a "clean start" is their best option if they aren't technically minded. And they have no idea how to back up the old machine and save their stuff. In the meantime, my 7 year-old Macbook Pro works nearly as well as the day I bought it and if I bought a new mac tomorrow I could restore my entire system with one click. I reckon this thing could keep going for another 3 years at which point I've had a single laptop for 10 years. I don't know many people who've ever got that sort of mileage from a PC. And yes, if you're a techie then you can upgrade the components but that's not straightforward for most people and there are often issues with incompatible hardware etc. I know that I'm currently stuck with the same hardware (and I cannot upgrade) but it runs like a dream so what difference does it make? I paid £950 in 2013 and I've got a laptop that still runs like a dream without a single upgrade or any messing about. I believe that's good value.

It comes down to this - if you're prepared to pay the premium then IMO the quality of life stuff is well worth it. You might have some teething pains but in the long run I think the average user is likely to have an easier time. I think that there is a reason that Apple is so popular and successful (despite legitimate criticisms around price) and that's basically that you can buy their stuff and it "just works" for the average non-technical consumer. Most people don't, in a million years, want to "upgrade" their computer or open it up or even install a software update. So if you sell them a product that will "just work" for 3-5 years or even longer then they'll be happy.

Yeah i get that tbf but i dont understand why everyone says backing up windows is hard. You literally just get onedrive or an external hdd / ssd, and set it to backup to that drive the first time you plug it in in the case of the external drive, or change one easy to find setting in the case of onedrive. I know it varies person to person but i personally find using time machine much harder than this.

As for your argument of non technical people wanting something easy, i do understand the appeal there. I thought most people that do more "techy" things like music would probably know what they're doing anyway, though (this question was mainly about music production)?

[Michael L]

One person will never understand how or why or what another person does and somtimes that other person thinks they understand why but its really something else that they only discover much later or it may not matter and then wrong may turn out to be exactly right or then change back to wrong again or something totally arbitrary like there is no right or wrong at all and we will look back late in life and perhaps wonder why we even bought a computer and didn't spend that money chasing beautiful women in Paris?

[pekbro]

Well I cant say much about recent macs, but I have a power book G4 that still runs great after 17 years, and music production is the main reason I use it on occasion, it runs protools and Reason 2 also
a bunch of other stuff. I can say that no PC laptop I've ever seen has had that kind of longevity.

*shrugs

[elxsound]

Well I cant say much about recent macs, but I have a power book G4 that still runs great after 17 years, and music production is the main reason I use it on occasion, it runs protools and Reason 2 also
a bunch of other stuff. I can say that no PC laptop I've ever seen has had that kind of longevity.

*shrugs

I've got an HP Laptop, 15 years old that still works! It was never capable of running Pro Tools, but it used to run Live 6 & 7.

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

One person will never understand how or why or what another person does and somtimes that other person thinks they understand why but its really something else that they only discover much later or it may not matter and then wrong may turn out to be exactly right or then change back to wrong again or something totally arbitrary like there is no right or wrong at all and we will look back late in life and perhaps wonder why we even bought a computer and didn't spend that money chasing beautiful women in Paris?

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[pekbro]

I've got an HP Laptop, 15 years old that still works! It was never capable of running Pro Tools, but it used to run Live 6 & 7.

That is pretty amazing

[Passing Bye]

And there's more. Mac OS is harder to fix problems with and in my few months of using it I came across more of them than I have in 11 years of Windows usage (such as files and apps behaving weirdly), less intuitive to use (again I used it for months so it's not that I didn't take the time to learn the basics), you actually still can get malware on mac OS (only time I've ever gotten it was on mac), and there's more but this is already getting really long, and I'd rathewr hear what you have to say first.

Cool story bro, so you bought a Mac, when and which one?

Than you used it for few months, but managed to get malware on it and screw up whole system? Which one, where, what, warez, porn sites, what did you do?

2011 macbook pro. I got Flashback in 2012, google it if you dont know what that is. All I did was click on a link to update flash player, and poof, trojan. Didnt even know I had it for a few weeks, couldve been dangerous.

I like how you accuse me of lying because you dont believe that macs can get malware. This worldwide assumption macs are invincible and cannot get malware is only the result of a several year long marketing campaign by apple, and it isnt true at all, while they are still less likely than pcs to get malware.

I like how you make assumptions about what I “believe” in, only asked you to back up your story. So you used mac for few months in 2012 and waited for 8 years to open this pointless thread about your experience....

[Dafydd Powell]

And there's more. Mac OS is harder to fix problems with and in my few months of using it I came across more of them than I have in 11 years of Windows usage (such as files and apps behaving weirdly), less intuitive to use (again I used it for months so it's not that I didn't take the time to learn the basics), you actually still can get malware on mac OS (only time I've ever gotten it was on mac), and there's more but this is already getting really long, and I'd rathewr hear what you have to say first.

Cool story bro, so you bought a Mac, when and which one?

Than you used it for few months, but managed to get malware on it and screw up whole system? Which one, where, what, warez, porn sites, what did you do?

2011 macbook pro. I got Flashback in 2012, google it if you dont know what that is. All I did was click on a link to update flash player, and poof, trojan. Didnt even know I had it for a few weeks, couldve been dangerous.

I like how you accuse me of lying because you dont believe that macs can get malware. This worldwide assumption macs are invincible and cannot get malware is only the result of a several year long marketing campaign by apple, and it isnt true at all, while they are still less likely than pcs to get malware.

I like how you make assumptions about what I “believe” in, only asked you to back up your story. So you used mac for few months in 2012 and waited for 8 years to open this pointless thread about your experience....

Sorry, I thought you were trying to accuse me of lying. I didn't start this thread because of that experience, I just wanted to know, as I've explained countless times by now, people's reasoning for using macs. This thought popped into my head 2 minutes before I started the thread, not 8 years.