Exponential Audio Verbs: PhoenixVerb, Nimbus, R4. Your Thoughts?

[Dirtgrain]

i wanted R4 for so long, ended up with 2 free licenses of R2 and a cheap Nimbus.
Fighting the GAS on this plugin boutique sale, but will I regret it?
R2 --> R4... what are the advantages?

More tweakable parameters, if you think you might get into that kind of specificity on your reverb. More presets.

[dickiefunk]

I have to say I'm really loving the really natural clean sound of Nimbus! I've been using it on a choir today and it sounds beautiful!

[vurt]

Yes, all good over here (except that my mother in law decided to stay for another two weeks before returning to Spain - I kid, I kid - I was given the chance to veto - it's actually not bad at all: she plays Lego, I play guitar...)

I certainly hope the same goes for you too!

tough choice between lego and guitar for me

yup alls good here, would like to see more of kieran and my granddaughter, but better we are all safe

[acousticglue]

That's the problem with vst and hardware it all can sound good. It's a circus

[bmanic]

As we're discussing reverbs in general, I have to give a shout out to good old AriesVerb again. I got inspired by this thread to make some new reverb algorithms for it and ended up with a pretty cool one. It's most suitable for the typical big EDM trance sounds and you can mix it into the sound at a crazy level, without it getting muddied or even raising the main output of the combined sources at all! Basically it completely "phase stabilizes" things that go into it.

Example here (synth used: Anacreon)

EDIT: Here is a version without any reverb

Reverb is manually slowly introduced from about 7 seconds on. At most I boost it about +4dB louder than the original signal.

[revvy]

Really like the sound of R4 but the GUI is too small for me and the enlarged size option is laggy, so I just don't use it.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

For what it's worth, I barely use the Exponential verbs. They're usually too clean for my tastes, even with modulation and the warp features engaged and I just don't work as quickly with them (analysis paralysis looking for the perfect ER pattern and slope and width, etc.). I'd rather have a big, dark, chorused, noisy tail and stripped down feature set I guess. Did I mention dark? Favorite verbs are LX-480, Sonsig and VintageVerb. Those are my go-to's but will also use Blackhole, Eos, and plates/springs/shimmers when called for. 2016 on some sources too. If I specifically need something more clean I might look to Nimbus, or VSR-S24, or R4 as that in-between verb, but these days it's rare.

I get that someone might prefer the Exponential sound to Valhalla or whatever. I'm the opposite. It's all taste and what works for the genre.

[bmanic]

I've always found the Valhalla reverbs a bit hard to get to sit in a mix.. which is the opposite with LX-480, Sonsig and Exponential audio reverbs.

I have however slowly but surely improved my mastery over the valhalla reverbs so I tend to use them more than before. I especially like the early reflections part of both the room and vintage verb.. but getting long tails to fit in a mix is difficult.

For traditional music (rock, local folk songs etc.. singer/songwriter or basic band) I usually end up using Phoenix verb quite a lot. It's great at being invisible and just sort of livening up too dry studio recordings. Especially when so many record at home in a carpeted/semi-treated bedroom. These sources really benefit from a bit of longer reverb tail and more open/large spaces, without being obvious at all. Phoenix verb is also great for getting Snares, Toms and Kicks to sit in a mix properly.

[mholloway]

For what it's worth, I barely use the Exponential verbs. They're usually too clean for my tastes, even with modulation and the warp features engaged and I just don't work as quickly with them (analysis paralysis looking for the perfect ER pattern and slope and width, etc.). I'd rather have a big, dark, chorused, noisy tail and stripped down feature set I guess. Did I mention dark? Favorite verbs are LX-480, Sonsig and VintageVerb. Those are my go-to's but will also use Blackhole, Eos, and plates/springs/shimmers when called for. 2016 on some sources too. If I specifically need something more clean I might look to Nimbus, or VSR-S24, or R4 as that in-between verb, but these days it's rare.

I get that someone might prefer the Exponential sound to Valhalla or whatever. I'm the opposite. It's all taste and what works for the genre.

R4 really isn't that clean at all, it's total classic-digital Lexicon, from the guy who worked (programmed, I think?) the PCM.... calling Nimbus too clean, sure, it's supposed to be. But describing R4 that way, I don't get it. The Plate mode sounds pretty open and clean, but the Chamber and Halls are very 'colored' with that classic lexicon digital sound. Even the default patch (Famous Hall), as has already been noted in this thread, is based on the old lexicon Random Hall, and it's very, very far from clean sounding.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

R4 really isn't that clean at all, it's total classic-digital Lexicon, from the guy who worked (programmed, I think?) the PCM.... calling Nimbus too clean, sure, it's supposed to be. But describing R4 that way, I don't get it. The Plate mode sounds pretty open and clean, but the Chamber and Halls are very 'colored' with that classic lexicon digital sound. Even the default patch (Famous Hall), as has already been noted in this thread, is based on the old lexicon Random Hall, and it's very, very far from clean sounding.

It's hard to describe the qualities of a sound without sounding like a tool, but I know who Michael Carnes is and I'm very well aware of his pedigree. But I'm using my ears here and no matter what anyone says, R4 does not sound like vintage reverbs. It may be the product in the lineup that offers the most color/modulation/distortions, but it's still way more clean than characterful. At least when compared to my favorites.

Simple test:

1. Load up a Virtual Analog synth - set it to some saw key patch, or a Blade-Runner Brass lead type sound
2. Load up R4 - Famous Hall Patch - set the decay to like 4s, Mix to around 35-ish% (target this neighborhood for each)
3. Play some notes where there's enough space in between them to really hear the verb, how it blends, the tone, the modulation, etc.

Result: It's reverb! Not much to compare against just yet. So let's open up some other verbs...

4. Bypass R4
5. Load up ValhallaVintageVerb - Concert Hall Algo - 70's mode, 4s decay with some modulation
6. Play some notes where there's enough space in between them

Result: way, way, way different sounding. Much darker, much noisier tail . Tail is dense and very pronounced. Want to hear a dirtier/noisier tail just to be sure of what I'm describing? Load up the Dirty Hall mode and repeat. You'll hear it.

7. Go back to R4 and repeat the original test just to compare (try the Famous Hall Dark if you'd like - tweak settings to try to dial it in for all I care)

Result: way, way, way different sounding. Sounds "cleaner?" More "hi-fi?" More "Pristine?" "Modern? Transparent?" Hard talking about sound. But these are not in the same wheel house at all. Very different sounds. Now...

8. Bypass the verbs and call up Sonsig
9. Size around noon or later, dial up 4s of decay, character 2 or 3, ensemble 3, output mode on 224, brightness noon or less

Result: sounds dark like the Valhalla while still being more refined at the same time. Doesn't really sound like R4. Sounds more like VVV but smoother at the same time. Very cool. Now...

10. Bypass and load up LX480 and load up the Hall or Random Hall algo's, 4s decay, mix, etc.

Result: not as dark as VVV in 70's+Concert Hall mode or Sonsig. Tail feels less dense, blends more into the background, more mid-range focused. Gets a bit closer to R4 here in that it feels a bit more refined than Sonsig or Valhalla. But still way more "vintage" sounding (dumb adjective, sorry) than R4.

Note: I'm not trying to exactly match presets here. Just a simple way to say "hey, R4 ain't vintage or dirty sounding at all despite being from Michael Carnes." Also isn't Michael of the Lexi 960 and PCM series? Maybe he's just not as into shitty reverb as I am.

[vitocorleone123]

Interesting.

Of the 3, R4 can definitely sound both the smoothest and the most modulated "dirty". To me. You really have to get in there in Warp (Overdrive, Crush, compression, Word Size, etc.) and Chorus (make the tail move a bit with a Fat Chorus), though. But it's laid out fairly easily - though I admittedly forget what many of the dials do specifically as I don't use them all the time. Just spin them! Heh. If you want to make the EA verbs really "rich", there was a tip here or at GS to add a hint of chorus before the reverb. It definitely brings out the reverb more as an effect at that point.

VVV is just too low-midrange-y. I like aspects of it, and I like it in isolation a bit, but in a mix? I've had a hard time of it. My favorite experiment was 3 instances of Tyrell (tweaked) or the random chaotic hall, 80% pan L, center, 80% pan R, and send to all 3. Vangelis! There's a description of someone here on GS in some thread some year talking about it. I've slapped that on the OB-6 before and WOW. But that's just for playing around.

Sonsig. I love it (more than VVV), but it's not for dark reverbs in any mode. It's SO much brighter than R4 with both dialed in dark. I can almost always get the reverb I want between R4 and Sonsig (unless I need/want clean, then Nimbus).

Want a dirty reverb tail? Have it on a Send and throw Saturn 2 or Destructor after R4. Or a pedal from Audiority or Fuse Audio (ok there's lots of them out there but I love those and the price is right).

[claudedefaren]

...

[dickiefunk]

For traditional music (rock, local folk songs etc.. singer/songwriter or basic band) I usually end up using Phoenix verb quite a lot. It's great at being invisible and just sort of livening up too dry studio recordings. Especially when so many record at home in a carpeted/semi-treated bedroom. These sources really benefit from a bit of longer reverb tail and more open/large spaces, without being obvious at all. Phoenix verb is also great for getting Snares, Toms and Kicks to sit in a mix properly.

Yes these are my experiences with Nimbus as well. It sounds very clean and natural and is great at livening up and adding more depth/space to a mix without introducing colour.

I wasn’t expecting to find a reverb that I like as much as the LiquidSonics reverbs but Nimbus has really surprised me The fact that it only cost me £25 makes this an even bigger bonus!

[dickiefunk]

Oops double post

[gondii]

Exponential Audio Stereo Reverb Upgrade from any EA Plugin for $69:
https://www.audiodeluxe.com/products/st ... tial-audio

incl. Nimbus, R4, PhoenixVerb and Excalibur