The next Live update?

[SLiC]

It's no surprise many of these types a drawn to software like Reaper and Bitwig, which are basically tinkering playgrounds for adults in a loosely music-related context.

I assume therefore you are a full time professional producer making a good living from music whilst the rest of us tinker?

Some professionals seem to manage with Bitwig and its pesky frequent updates and giving users what they ask for...https://www.bitwig.com/discover/?tag=Artists

[antic604]

MPC X and MPC Live have Ableton Live Set Export functionality, so you can move projects from the MPC to Ableton Live and continue working...

I'm aware of all this, but it's still useless - or perhaps a "curious novelty", rather - for the way I work and what I expect

Also, this same discussion - "who'd wanna use M+ when you can get Mk3 for 1/3 the price and connect it to your laptop/rig!?" - was happening ad nauseam elsewhere, but apparently it sells like hot cakes like MPC One or MPC Live Mk2 before it, so I guess they must be doing something right

[leeleema]

I don't really have any wishes for next Ableton. It's fine for me as it is

...

I'm not going to stop using Live to make music with because it's missing features that I want. I want to keep using it and enjoy using it more with improvements...

This. Ableton is great but somethings are just not well thought out although would be seemingly very easy to implement in a minor update. Everything PieBurger said, all of which seem to be easily fixed if they were addressed. Getting multiple clips from session to arrangement without 'recording' in real time, not being able to automate scenes such that one follows the other for say 16 bars and another for 8 bars. I mean it's obvious that it should be able to do that but it just doesn't, you have to click on everything and then crop in arrangement view. In theory Session view is the perfect planning space for a full track but for some reason Ableton seem to be holding back. And the vertical sizing of group tracks in arrangement makes no sense at all and is my own personal bugbear. There is a lack of seamlessness at times that flies in the face of its oft quoted superior workflow. And yes, they probably are concentrating their efforts on some shiny new whizz bang income stream like Push 3 or some new inbuilt plug-ins no-one needs. But the 'minor' fixes outlined by users surely wouldn't use up much staffing resource and would make elements of their user base happy.

[antic604]

...I don't want shiny features for the sake of it, I want QoL improvements with tangible benefits, to help me realise my goals more quickly.

I think the kind of people @.jon talks about want exactly the same - QoL stuff!

If you'd follow Bitwig's Discord for example, you'd see that there's barely ANY discussion about the headline 3.3 feature, i.e. Polymer synth. We've qickly agreed what it's good for and are now discussing actually useful - for Bitwiggers, anyway - stuff, like Wavetable oscillator in the Grid, new tricks with Phasor and Phase/Math modules, modulation modifiers, free content scaling ...and complaining about features that didn't make the cut this time

[antic604]

...Everything PieBurger said, all of which seem to be easily fixed if they were addressed [...] I mean it's obvious that it should be able to do that but it just doesn't.

Isn't that the worst?

We see all those low hanging fruits that seem possible to address by additional keyboard shortcut or some "behind-the-scenes" script that does all the things we do manually in quick sequence. And instead we get a synth, or some other esotheric device

[Reefius]

You know you could simply uninstall everything you don't need

That wouldn't work for me.

For example yesterday, 1st thing I'd do after work would be to instal S1 and Reason back again, to see what's in 5.1 update and how the new BeatMap maps sound like respectivaly...

I know the feeling, I purchased another year of updates for Bitwig, just because I wanted to check out the wavetable oscillator and Polymer.

But I don't think switching to Linux is the solution to GAS. Especially if you visit KVR frequently and see all the new stuff being released that you can't play with
Why not go dual boot? Best of both worlds

[SLiC]

MPC X and MPC Live have Ableton Live Set Export functionality, so you can move projects from the MPC to Ableton Live and continue working...

I'm aware of all this, but it's still useless - or perhaps a "curious novelty", rather - for the way I work and what I expect

Also, this same discussion - "who'd wanna use M+ when you can get Mk3 for 1/3 the price and connect it to your laptop/rig!?" - was happening ad nauseam elsewhere, but apparently it sells like hot cakes like MPC One or MPC Live Mk2 before it, so I guess they must be doing something right

I understand both arguments as I have a MPC Live Mk2, I also have a Maschine Mikro and Launchpad Pro so I can appreciate both options! The 'stand alone' option is about portability for me. The battery and the speaker make it worthwhile over a 'controller only' option as I don't need power, a laptop or even headphones to make music. I sit in the garden with t and an acoustic guitar and I am good!

When its in the studio the 8 CV outputs work great as a Eurorack controller and all of the 'Live' integration stuff (link, export to Live and control Live) is a bonus.

I am not sure if you could effectively make Live standalone on a screen like the current PUSH 2 - maybe, or maybe they will redesign it, AKAI did it on the force with a 7 inch touch screen, but its not a pretty device IMHO! Who knows, maybe Ableton will do something totally new like a clamshell (laptop) style device with a big screen and all of the push controls...After all, Live was pretty much built for laptops music making with QWERTY support from day 1.

[antic604]

But I don't think switching to Linux is the solution to GAS. Especially if you visit KVR frequently and see all the new stuff being released that you can't play with Why not go dual boot? Best of both worlds

Ultimate goal is to delete all social media accounts, incl. KvR. Slowly getting there

[antic604]

I am not sure if you could effectively make Live standalone on a screen like the current PUSH 2 - maybe, or maybe they will redesign it.

Yes, that's what I think - they need to redesign it for (standalone) hardware & touch screen workflow.

My sense is they've realised that trying to catch up to Cubases of the DAW world (i.e. super powerful in editing, mixing & mastering) is a futile pursuit and also NOT necessary. And instead decided to focus on the fun part of music creation - tactile experimentation, improvisation, seamless performance, happy accidents. There's new audience eager to just have fun with music, not necessarily bring it to "radio-ready" quality. We have - or will have very soon - new technologies and new devices, so Ableton would be smart to innovate again and jump ahead like they did 20 years ago, because they're not special or unique anymore.

[.jon]

Do I sense a whiff of superiority on your part?

Zero. Do you think I could write all that without personal experience

[.jon]

It's no surprise many of these types a drawn to software like Reaper and Bitwig, which are basically tinkering playgrounds for adults in a loosely music-related context.

I assume therefore you are a full time professional producer making a good living from music whilst the rest of us tinker?

Some professionals seem to manage with Bitwig and its pesky frequent updates and giving users what they ask for...https://www.bitwig.com/discover/?tag=Artists

Don't take it (or yourself) too seriously

[pdxindy]

MPC X and MPC Live have Ableton Live Set Export functionality, so you can move projects from the MPC to Ableton Live and continue working....There is also Live Link and Live Remote...they work hand in hand! If PUSH 3 can do 6 hours on a battery and has a decent built in speaker I will give it a look, otherwise I cant see much point in not sitting in front of a nice 40 inch monitor for the sake of 1 USB lead!

The MPC Platform has been adding new features at a phenomenal rate, rather like the software side, Ableton has all of this to catch up. The wireless Live control is now a superb bonus!

Earlier this year I was out of my home country for some months so I bought an MPC Live to play with during that time.

Turns out I didn't like it. The touch screen isn't very good. I'm spoiled by my iPad Pro where the touch feels precise and smooth and accurate. The MPC Live screen feels crude and clumsy by comparison.

I also didn't like the pads. For me they are too hard and require way too much force when striking them. I found the pads basically impossible to play a nuanced chromatic melody on.

Then there are too many menus and navigating and it didn't feel intuitive or inviting.

So the MPC Live was sold... I wont be buying anything like that again unless there is a paradigm shift. It is screen based, but a small and not high quality screen. I'd rather just use a computer then... or my iPad Pro.

Back when I was using Push, I did like the pads (should have used the poly AT though). But it also had too many button combos and too much navigating. Took me quite a while to learn to get around somewhat comfortably. In comparison, when I tried the new Logic Remote on my iPad it took me like 15-30 minutes to understand basically everything. For lots of stuff, a big screen just works better.

Maybe if someone came up with a hardware controller where one could dock an iPad Pro in it.

[SLiC]

MPC X and MPC Live have Ableton Live Set Export functionality, so you can move projects from the MPC to Ableton Live and continue working....There is also Live Link and Live Remote...they work hand in hand! If PUSH 3 can do 6 hours on a battery and has a decent built in speaker I will give it a look, otherwise I cant see much point in not sitting in front of a nice 40 inch monitor for the sake of 1 USB lead!

The MPC Platform has been adding new features at a phenomenal rate, rather like the software side, Ableton has all of this to catch up. The wireless Live control is now a superb bonus!

Earlier this year I was out of my home country for some months so I bought an MPC Live to play with during that time.

Turns out I didn't like it. The touch screen isn't very good. I'm spoiled by my iPad Pro where the touch feels precise and smooth and accurate. The MPC Live screen feels crude and clumsy by comparison.

I also didn't like the pads. For me they are too hard and require way too much force when striking them. I found the pads basically impossible to play a nuanced chromatic melody on.

Then there are too many menus and navigating and it didn't feel intuitive or inviting.

So the MPC Live was sold... I wont be buying anything like that again unless there is a paradigm shift. It is screen based, but a small and not high quality screen. I'd rather just use a computer then... or my iPad Pro.

Back when I was using Push, I did like the pads (should have used the poly AT though). But it also had too many button combos and too much navigating. Took me quite a while to learn to get around somewhat comfortably. In comparison, when I tried the new Logic Remote on my iPad it took me like 15-30 minutes to understand basically everything. For lots of stuff, a big screen just works better.

Maybe if someone came up with a hardware controller where one could dock an iPad Pro in it.

Not sure if the Live Mk2 has different pads, screen, but I have no issues at all with it...but the iPad screen is definitely better for resolution and touch, probably the best on any device.

Also the Live Mk2 is a big beast- heavier than a laptop and a controller so wont be going on a flight with me, but it does a lot of stuff and is the closest I have come to a none computer based DAW since the multi-midi (4 midi ports and 2 USB midi hubs and 8 x CV can control just about everything) The 2.7 and 2.8 updates were massive in this respect, even using the MPC as a BT midi controller for your iPad

I also have an iPad pro but I never seem to end up using it for music- too many distractions like a laptop (or my lack of discipline!).

[SLiC]

I am not sure if you could effectively make Live standalone on a screen like the current PUSH 2 - maybe, or maybe they will redesign it.

Yes, that's what I think - they need to redesign it for (standalone) hardware & touch screen workflow.

Check out how that works on the MPC (as a controller, but still pretty close to what you are talking about)...the controller in the MPC is now good I am thinking of selling my launchpad!!

Given the AKAI MPC can control Live 'wirelessly' it makes you wonder why Ableton just doesn't make a Rechargeable WIFI PUSH!

https://youtu.be/hY2PRqZLHos

[antic604]

Check out how that works on the MPC (as a controller, but still pretty close to what you are talking about)...the controller in the MPC is now good I am thinking of selling my launchpad!!

As I said, I'm aware of MPC integration with Ableton Live. Also, controller features are not supported on MPC One which is what I have