Arturia V Collection 8 official thread

[briefcasemanx]

Has anyone who owns a Juno 6 chimed in about the horrible tremolo sound of the chorus when I+II are engaged. I do not at all remember it sounding like that when I owned a Juno-6, and it absolutely doesn't sound like that on the Juno-106 I currently own.

If the Juno-6 really does sound like that then they should implement a "Juno-106" mode so you can switch between them. I+II is almost completely unusable.

[4damind]

This vibrato with 1+2 is also mentioned in the Arturia video. It seems to be the original behaviour of the Juno chorus.
Definitely a good free gift from Arturia! The chorus also works well on mono sounds like bass.
I tried this here with Mode I (bypassed the first bars).
Only Bass

...and all together with the enabled chorus on the bass (only 40s)
All

[dumbledog]

I've had good success using the new Juno chorus freebie plugin as an effect on the Juno synth, setting the synth's chorus to I and the effect to II so you get both choruses in series, or of course the other way around. Make sure you switch off the 'mono in' when doing so. Sounds much better than I+II in the synth.

[zzz00m]

Hi,
If you're confused because Analog Lab V has less presets than Analog Lab 4, it is a bug that occurs for users that have an ALV and AL4 licence but no VCollection licence. You should have all your AL4 presets in ALV as long as your AL4 licence is also activated on your computer.
This should be fixed in the Analog Lab V hotfix that will be released very soon, if the problem still occur after updating please contact the support !

The update/hotfix corrected my missing AL 4 presets in AL V! Thanks!

Two weeks ago, the messaging from Gaby in Arturia support was that many of the AL 4 presets were removed due to not reaching their "current standards" for AL 5. I wonder what changed?

Nothing really changed. If you just have AL V, you only get the 2000 or so presets. If you have a license for AL4, you get those presets added to AL V now.

[fmr]

Has anyone who owns a Juno 6 chimed in about the horrible tremolo sound of the chorus when I+II are engaged. I do not at all remember it sounding like that when I owned a Juno-6, and it absolutely doesn't sound like that on the Juno-106 I currently own.

If the Juno-6 really does sound like that then they should implement a "Juno-106" mode so you can switch between them. I+II is almost completely unusable.

Juno-106 is a quite different beast. And yes, that "horrible tremolo" is the original behavior of the Juno-6 and Juno-60 chorus. I own a Juno-60.

Here is a great site with extensive and very accurate analysis of the Juno Chorus: https://github.com/pendragon-andyh/Juno ... ter/Chorus

And here is a link to an old KVR thread where this was discussed too: viewtopic.php?t=489346

[briefcasemanx]

I pulled out my Juno-106. Apparently the Junos all have the same chorus module but the I+II mode is disabled on the 106. I can turn both buttons on on my particular synth for some reason but it's hard to tell if any difference is made from having one of the buttons on. I think I+II is literally just a copy of one of the other 2 settings.

I withdraw my comments about the I+II mode.

[Winstontaneous]

I pulled out my Juno-106. Apparently the Junos all have the same chorus module but the I+II mode is disabled on the 106. I can turn both buttons on on my particular synth for some reason but it's hard to tell if any difference is made from having one of the buttons on. I think I+II is literally just a copy of one of the other 2 settings.

I withdraw my comments about the I+II mode.

Hmmm, I spent a lot of time with one of my best friends' Juno-106 back in the '80s - and I+II on that definitely sounded different than I or II on its own. That's the first thing I test on any Juno emulation.

[dumbledog]

(oops, mispost, sorry)

[AdvancedFollower]

Has anyone who owns a Juno 6 chimed in about the horrible tremolo sound of the chorus when I+II are engaged. I do not at all remember it sounding like that when I owned a Juno-6, and it absolutely doesn't sound like that on the Juno-106 I currently own.

If the Juno-6 really does sound like that then they should implement a "Juno-106" mode so you can switch between them. I+II is almost completely unusable.

Juno-106 is a quite different beast. And yes, that "horrible tremolo" is the original behavior of the Juno-6 and Juno-60 chorus. I own a Juno-60.

Here is a great site with extensive and very accurate analysis of the Juno Chorus: https://github.com/pendragon-andyh/Juno ... ter/Chorus

And here is a link to an old KVR thread where this was discussed too: viewtopic.php?t=489346

I much prefer the "I+II" sound of the free TAL Chorus module and the TAL Juno emulation, even if it's less accurate. It's weird that it sounds so different given it's also supposedly modelled after the real thing. The Arturia version does indeed just sound like a crappy, exaggerated tremolo effect on "I+II", where as the TAL versions sound rich and wide.

[fmr]

Has anyone who owns a Juno 6 chimed in about the horrible tremolo sound of the chorus when I+II are engaged. I do not at all remember it sounding like that when I owned a Juno-6, and it absolutely doesn't sound like that on the Juno-106 I currently own.

If the Juno-6 really does sound like that then they should implement a "Juno-106" mode so you can switch between them. I+II is almost completely unusable.

Juno-106 is a quite different beast. And yes, that "horrible tremolo" is the original behavior of the Juno-6 and Juno-60 chorus. I own a Juno-60.

Here is a great site with extensive and very accurate analysis of the Juno Chorus: https://github.com/pendragon-andyh/Juno ... ter/Chorus

And here is a link to an old KVR thread where this was discussed too: viewtopic.php?t=489346

I much prefer the "I+II" sound of the free TAL Chorus module and the TAL Juno emulation, even if it's less accurate. It's weird that it sounds so different given it's also supposedly modelled after the real thing. The Arturia version does indeed just sound like a crappy, exaggerated tremolo effect on "I+II", where as the TAL versions sound rich and wide.

You can get basically the same effect by instantiating two Chorus Jun-6 in series. First one set to I and the second set to II

[Vortifex]

Edited

[briefcasemanx]

I've been demoing all the Juno 6/60/106 softsynths that I can get my hands onto and comparing it to my real Juno-106. It's very hard because some of the most important functions on the hardware synth are in need of repair, but the presets still work. Have had to find creative ways to figure out what the parameter values of some of the presets are, like turning off all the oscillators and listening to just the noise to figure out what the cutoff frequency is since that slider doesn't work.

The conclusion that I'm coming to is that all of the emulations are usable and perfectly good, but none of them sound completely analog. I think I like the TAL and the Arturia ones the best as far as musicality, although I can see liking the Cherry one way better than others for certain types of patches. I feel (I have not measured it) like there may be some very slight spectral non-linearity in the adsr envelopes (where the envelopes can act as a very, very subtle type of filter). Seems like there is something magic happening during the analog envelope that's hard to describe.

Also the oscillators on all of them don't sound as "deep" and 3D as a real analog oscillator. I'm not sure why as it ***seems*** from a layman perspective like this would be easy to emulate compared to something like a filter if you can get super accurate readings (and honestly, a .wav file recorded in a daw with good AD converters seems like a very accurate reading). Look at the waveform shape, compare a bunch of different subsequent wavelenghts to get an average waveform and to see much the waveform fluctuates in the various variables (like pitch, harmonic series amplitude/waveshape, noise, etc), then do this for different notes to understand macro fluctuations in waveform shape as well as some of the variables I mentioned earlier, then add randomization to these variables within the bounds of measurement. Then do the same for different voice chips to calculate variance.

I've never programmed a synth before though, so it's probably way harder than what I've described or what I'm imagining. Maybe it's not the oscillator itself that sounds "deep" but distortion from simply running through analog electronics? Can someone describe why a very simple analog oscillator, raw and by itself, no filters or envelopes, can't seem to be properly emulated? Is it a CPU thing? Because I have no earthly idea how one would go about emulating an analog filter, but I ***feel*** like I have at least some idea how to go about emulating an oscillator.

I pulled out my Juno-106. Apparently the Junos all have the same chorus module but the I+II mode is disabled on the 106. I can turn both buttons on on my particular synth for some reason but it's hard to tell if any difference is made from having one of the buttons on. I think I+II is literally just a copy of one of the other 2 settings.

I withdraw my comments about the I+II mode.

Hmmm, I spent a lot of time with one of my best friends' Juno-106 back in the '80s - and I+II on that definitely sounded different than I or II on its own. That's the first thing I test on any Juno emulation.

I thought I remember it sounding different too. This is the first time i've fired up the synth in years and some of the buttons and sliders don't work correctly, so it might just be broken. Can't say for sure.

[mholloway]

Also the oscillators on all of them don't sound as "deep" and 3D as a real analog oscillator.

Sigh.
I'd bet 1,000 bucks that in a blind test, you wouldn't be able to tell which was which with any consistency.

[briefcasemanx]

Also the oscillators on all of them don't sound as "deep" and 3D as a real analog oscillator.

Sigh.
I'd bet 1,000 bucks that in a blind test, you wouldn't be able to tell which was which with any consistency.

Feel free to speak for yourself on that one when you have the hardware in front of you to do a comparison. Until then, have fun talking about it on the internet.

There was a youtube video of a blind comparison of repro patches vs the real thing, and I got 8/10 correct. 3 of the 10 I was completely unsure about and just picked which sound I liked better, 2 of the ones I was unsure about I got incorrect. 7/7 of the patches where I was sure about which one was analog, I was correct on. Out of the 7 I guessed correct I didn't even necessarily like the analog version better, I could just tell it was analog. As far as I can tell (from youtube videos since I don't own the synth repro emulates), repro is at least as good an emulation as the best of these Junos, if not better.

But if you really want to bet 1,000 bucks I might actually be down.

[mholloway]

Feel free to speak for yourself on that one when you have the hardware in front of you to do a comparison. Until then, have fun talking about it on the internet.

Huh? Uh, yes: I talk about it on the internet. You know you're in an online forum, right? You seem confused about your whereabouts, it seems.

And I don't need actual hardware in front of me to know that your bias is real, just as it is for every dude in this forum who says silly things like "the hardware oscillators are more 3D."