Massive X 1.3 update!

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
KVRAF
1601 posts since 28 Sep, 2012

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:08 am

loungepanda wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:04 am
Just look at what happened to Reason after Verdane acquired them - Complete focus on wringing out as much profit possible from REs instead of improving on the core product, which has been left to stagnate. It's 2021 and it STILL does not have a hdpi interface.

And yes, MX sounds good. It sounds really good. However, I think it's pretty indicative of the state of NI that Vital, a synth that is more or less free and coded by 1 guy, has generated more hype and applause than MX.
How much of that hype is due to Vital being free...

KVRer
22 posts since 3 Aug, 2019

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:35 am

Please help me!
It is difficult for me to understand the comb filter in Massive X, in particular pitch settings (keytrack, ratio, fix) including Adjusts the tuning of the Comb in semitones and cents. When and how are these settings used? If anyone can explain to me. :pray:

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KVRAF
18460 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:15 pm

loungepanda wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:04 am
And yes, MX sounds good. It sounds really good. However, I think it's pretty indicative of the state of NI that Vital, a synth that is more or less free and coded by 1 guy, has generated more hype and applause than MX.
Vital is free so that would likely garner more praise right there.

The Vital GUI and Workflow is far better than MX. So many little things are better in Vital. Right click on a Vital Macro knob and you will see a list of all targets. Right click on an MX macro knob and it shows no target info. In MX you would need to click on something like 18 different tabs to be sure of all the possible targets. Of course by the time you click all the tabs to find all possible targets, one has long forgotten what they are.

Same thing for MX LFO's and Env's. There is no way to see a list of targets. There is no visual cue to determine if a tab has active modulations except clicking it and looking. So if LFO 5 is modulating LFO 7 rate, the only way to know that is to click on the LFO 7 tab and check. Awful.

In Vital the LFO's and Env's are the same as the macros. Right click and you see a list of targets.

Mouse scrollwheel works to adjust parameters in Vital. It doesn't in MX. The Vital preset browser is significantly better than MX. Vital browser has user tags, favorites and a search function. MX has none of that and all user presets are just thrown into a single container.

MX has limited modulation. Vital is unlimited. I will frequently have 4-6 modulators on filter cutoff... I might have velocity, pressure, keytracking, bit of randomization, filter env and a macro knob. MX has a max of 3 modulators on cutoff (it does have an additional dedicated keytrack but that cannot itself be shaped, modulated or non-linear). Vital has no limit. Every individual mod target in Vital can have its own curve to fine tune mod depth. Great for fine tuning MPE sounds which Vital supports. MX of course doesn't do either.

Vital LFO's are great... they are basically each an MSEG so they have an unlimited number of shapes. MX has rather limited LFO's with no way to make a custom shape. MX LFO's also have no phase control. Vital LFO's do.

In Vital parameters can be directly automated and there is midi learn. MX has neither.

Vital is a joy to use. Fast and straightforward yet when needed nearly unlimited modulation capability. MX is a tedious wreck by comparison.

KVRAF
5072 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:29 pm

I also must say that i find Vital is much better in every way as Massive X.
Really in every way.

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KVRist
486 posts since 11 Mar, 2010

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:33 pm

pdxindy wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:15 pm
loungepanda wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:04 am
And yes, MX sounds good. It sounds really good. However, I think it's pretty indicative of the state of NI that Vital, a synth that is more or less free and coded by 1 guy, has generated more hype and applause than MX.
Vital is free so that would likely garner more praise right there.

The Vital GUI and Workflow is far better than MX. So many little things are better in Vital. Right click on a Vital Macro knob and you will see a list of all targets. Right click on an MX macro knob and it shows no target info. In MX you would need to click on something like 18 different tabs to be sure of all the possible targets. Of course by the time you click all the tabs to find all possible targets, one has long forgotten what they are.

Same thing for MX LFO's and Env's. There is no way to see a list of targets. There is no visual cue to determine if a tab has active modulations except clicking it and looking. So if LFO 5 is modulating LFO 7 rate, the only way to know that is to click on the LFO 7 tab and check. Awful.

In Vital the LFO's and Env's are the same as the macros. Right click and you see a list of targets.

Mouse scrollwheel works to adjust parameters in Vital. It doesn't in MX. The Vital preset browser is significantly better than MX. Vital browser has user tags, favorites and a search function. MX has none of that and all user presets are just thrown into a single container.

MX has limited modulation. Vital is unlimited. I will frequently have 4-6 modulators on filter cutoff... I might have velocity, pressure, keytracking, bit of randomization, filter env and a macro knob. MX has a max of 3 modulators on cutoff (it does have an additional dedicated keytrack but that cannot itself be shaped, modulated or non-linear). Vital has no limit. Every individual mod target in Vital can have its own curve to fine tune mod depth. Great for fine tuning MPE sounds which Vital supports. MX of course doesn't do either.

Vital LFO's are great... they are basically each an MSEG so they have an unlimited number of shapes. MX has rather limited LFO's with no way to make a custom shape. MX LFO's also have no phase control. Vital LFO's do.

In Vital parameters can be directly automated and there is midi learn. MX has neither.

Vital is a joy to use. Fast and straightforward yet when needed nearly unlimited modulation capability. MX is a tedious wreck by comparison.
To each their own. I do like the GUI in Vital, but still prefer MX's (yeah, call me crazy).
And, more importantly, the core sound: I'm sorry, but IMO Vital doesn't hold a candle to MX.

KVRist
289 posts since 7 Sep, 2012

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:35 pm

+1000

KVRAF
5273 posts since 7 Feb, 2013

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:50 pm

Sinisterbr wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:33 pm
And, more importantly, the core sound: I'm sorry, but IMO Vital doesn't hold a candle to MX.
This!

And this is still the most important thing.

I was quite enthusiastic about Vital at first because I liked the GUI and the workflow and it was free and all, but I found that aside from some very specific kinds of patches (mostly very experimental and abstract ones, which are supposed to sound kinda weird and unnatural) I don't really like its sound.

MX is absolutely one of the best sounding software synths out there
You may think you can fly ... but you better not try

https://soundcloud.com/recursion-loop/s ... travels-ep

KVRist
416 posts since 11 Nov, 2010 from ny

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:25 pm

Vital is a work of art, it truly is. Its very pretty. Its lacking a lot in the wavetable editor, and it cant even touch Serum in that dept. MX does just sound better by miles, it just does. Vital sounds very good, very capable, intuitive. MX has a better core sound, and the effects are just in another dimension

I actually dont have a problem at all with MX UI. Its the browser that is utter trash.

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KVRAF
18460 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:49 pm

recursive one wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:50 pm
MX is absolutely one of the best sounding software synths out there
I agree... I especially like the MX Comb filter... I think it is the best I have heard. The low notes are very satisfying!

I wish I liked the GUI... even a little bit. (by GUI I mean overall workflow and visual feedback, the visual appearance is fine)

KVRAF
2062 posts since 12 Nov, 2014

Post Sun Feb 07, 2021 3:47 am

Given the fact that NI was just taken over and the new owners want to create a more unified experience, there is a strong possibility that user experience will be updated along side it.

We’ll just have to wait and see how this works out over the course of the year

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KVRist

Topic Starter

269 posts since 22 Nov, 2018 from UK

Post Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:17 am

Don't forget to grab the "OUR HOUSE" expansion pack. Free till March 4th. 👍

KVRist
67 posts since 11 Feb, 2018

Post Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:44 pm

I contacted NI about the preset browser, because it's really, really bad and I can't work with it in any sane way. The response was:
Thanks for contacting Native Instruments.
Unfortunately it is not planned in the near future. I will forward your rightful comments to the developers team.
I responded that I won't buy any of their products again if this isn't a priory. It's really too bad, because it sounds great and I can live with the UX being clumsy.

KVRAF
27651 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:58 pm

skottish wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:44 pm
I responded that I won't buy any of their products again if this isn't a priory.
I'm sure they're working their asses off on the preset browser in NI HQ now, after such an ugly threat.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

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KVRAF
2008 posts since 8 Dec, 2008 from Global Cowboy

Post Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:08 pm

chk071 wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:58 pm
skottish wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:44 pm
I responded that I won't buy any of their products again if this isn't a priory.
I'm sure they're working their asses off on the preset browser in NI HQ now, after such an ugly threat.
:lol:
Sorry - I don't use auto-tune....

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KVRist
486 posts since 11 Mar, 2010

Post Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:38 pm

chk071 wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:58 pm
skottish wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:44 pm
I responded that I won't buy any of their products again if this isn't a priory.
I'm sure they're working their asses off on the preset browser in NI HQ now, after such an ugly threat.
Yeah, but I think he has a really good point that should be taken seriously by NI. I personally also feel disappointed by their response.

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