Ableton piano roll limits

[Yorrrrrr]

Which are those 'basic' piano roll features Live still missing? I can do whatever I could wish for with the current features. I get it doesn't have some FL Studio's features, but those are mostly convenience. I don't know, maybe you guys compose very complex prog rock or jazz or whatever deep stuff with a computer and a mouse..

[melomood]

I guess Live is geared more towards people....who play live & record it in

[pdxindy]

Does the Tempo Follow option in Live 11 get recorded as a tempo track? The only examples I have seen are only Live following a live drummer playing. I have not seen any examples where a tempo track is created based on the live playing.

[clipnotic]

Which are those 'basic' piano roll features Live still missing? I can do whatever I could wish for with the current features. I get it doesn't have some FL Studio's features, but those are mostly convenience. I don't know, maybe you guys compose very complex prog rock or jazz or whatever deep stuff with a computer and a mouse..

Well with FL Studio you can produce / compose everything and every genre with just a computer and a mouse, if you have good plugins and a good masterkey

And one problem with Jazz musicians since years is, that they still are thinking, that they are the musician gods, but the reality is, that also Jazz is just a genre with some typical "rules" like every other genre! The only problem is, that Jazz musicians are still thinking they're are elitist!

[Reefius]

Now that the Bitwig fanclub no longer feels the need to mention in every Ableton thread how much better they think their DAW is, the FL Studio fanclub seems to have taken over that job

I guess the Reaper fanclub is next?

[ReleaseCandidate]

Does the Tempo Follow option in Live 11 get recorded as a tempo track?

Depends what a 'tempo track' is for you. It is recorder as tempo automation to the main track, but you can't get that out of Live as a MIDI tempo track.

But that has been you?! [see the following posts]
viewtopic.php?p=7949384#p7949384

[pixel85]

How you overcome these limits? Using another daw for midi editing? or some vst midi editor?

Yep. I'm using Cubase when I need to do more advanced stuff and Ableton for simple electronic/club music. Piano roll is probably the only thing that keeps me away from using Ableton Live more often.

[pdxindy]

Does the Tempo Follow option in Live 11 get recorded as a tempo track?

Depends what a 'tempo track' is for you. It is recorder as tempo automation to the main track, but you can't get that out of Live as a MIDI tempo track.

Is it only audio that can be used to follow tempo? How about live midi playing? Can that be used to as the source for Live to follow?

[Yorrrrrr]

How you overcome these limits? Using another daw for midi editing? or some vst midi editor?

Yep. I'm using Cubase when I need to do more advanced stuff and Ableton for simple electronic/club music. Piano roll is probably the only thing that keeps me away from using Ableton Live more often.

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

[pixel85]

How you overcome these limits? Using another daw for midi editing? or some vst midi editor?

Yep. I'm using Cubase when I need to do more advanced stuff and Ableton for simple electronic/club music. Piano roll is probably the only thing that keeps me away from using Ableton Live more often.

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

First of all: no full window for the piano roll. For me, it's the most annoying thing ever that I have to resize it all the time (I don't have 60" 4k monitor).
I have Expression Maps right there in the piano roll in Cubase.
Cubase has way more tools for sculpting velocity.
Cubase has Logical Editor and a lot of functions which speed up my work and all of this under a shortcut that I can change to whatever I want.
There's way more than that but I don't have the whole day to mention every single thing I use in Cubase which Live does not have.

[alberto_balsalm]

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

No full window, and you have to constantly fiddle with resizing it because if the MIDI editor is large - the arrange view/mixer are small, and vice versa.

Defaults to a specific non user changeable horizontal and vertical zooming when you create a new clip, so you constantly have to fiddle with that too. If you're changing length, it will zoom out so that it fits the entire length of the item in the view. Which means extra fiddling with the zoom if it zooms out too much.

No remappable shortcuts. Biggest wtf for me by far, and that's not just the MIDI editor of course, it's the whole program. Who the hell thought it was a good idea to hardcode ctrl+1 and ctrl+2 to change grid size, while simply pressing 1 and 2 does nothing? Surely it's much less aggravating and much more ergonomical to just press keys without holding a modifier key, right? And you can't remap that

Zero "advanced" features for MIDI editing, literally. Just select a bunch of notes right click. There's nothing. You have to do every single stupid task manually. Wanna change quarter notes into half notes in your MIDI clip (just doubling the size of every note)? Gotta do it manually. Gotta do every little thing manually, there's no automation for MIDI editing at all.

If you just put in a bunch of notes, something really simple, it's fine. It works for that. Simple bass line, simple melody, simple drum loop, triggering samples, and so on, in simple, short MIDI clips, with simple time signatures. Something more complicated? Good luck.

[apoclypse]

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

Zero "advanced" features for MIDI editing, literally. Just select a bunch of notes right click. There's nothing. You have to do every single stupid task manually. Wanna change quarter notes into half notes in your MIDI clip (just doubling the size of every note)? Gotta do it manually. Gotta do every little thing manually, there's no automation for MIDI editing at all.

In Live 11 they added some functionality to the PR that doubles or half’s note lengths among other things like Legato as buttons right in the PR.

[ReleaseCandidate]

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

Zero "advanced" features for MIDI editing, literally. Just select a bunch of notes right click. There's nothing. You have to do every single stupid task manually. Wanna change quarter notes into half notes in your MIDI clip (just doubling the size of every note)? Gotta do it manually. Gotta do every little thing manually, there's no automation for MIDI editing at all.

In Live 11 they added some functionality to the PR that doubles or half’s note lengths among other things like Legato as buttons right in the PR.

No, they have all been there at least since 9.

[melomood]

Which are those 'basic' piano roll features Live still missing? I can do whatever I could wish for with the current features. I get it doesn't have some FL Studio's features, but those are mostly convenience. I don't know, maybe you guys compose very complex prog rock or jazz or whatever deep stuff with a computer and a mouse..

Well with FL Studio you can produce / compose everything and every genre with just a computer and a mouse, if you have good plugins and a good masterkey

And one problem with Jazz musicians since years is, that they still are thinking, that they are the musician gods, but the reality is, that also Jazz is just a genre with some typical "rules" like every other genre! The only problem is, that Jazz musicians are still thinking they're are elitist!

Why do you pretend to know what everyone who listens to,or plays jazz thinks?

[PieBerger]

Piano roll in Ableton is so basic compared to other daws

You can't even rebind key shortcuts in Live. I don't think we'll see any kind of serious workflow improvements from them any time soon, if ever. Live seems to be focused on loop-based music with relatively simple piano roll inputs.

and that's what make it's awesome. If I wanted a tonne of bloat that is useless 95% of the time for making loopy electronic music , I would use another DAW