Have digital amp and effects improved drastically since my pod 2.0

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KVRAF
1639 posts since 2 Jul, 2010

Post Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:28 pm

zerocrossing wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:11 pm
In all honesty, you can’t buy much amp and pedal for $1000.
More than you'd think. For recording you don't need a big cab or power-amp, you can get away with a nice preamp and use it with IRs. Some nice studio-friendly preamps include Victory V4 series, Lany Ironheart, Jessup custom.

Of course you won't get the same versatility as a modelling setup.

KVRian
632 posts since 9 Aug, 2018

Post Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:53 am

imrae wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:28 pm
More than you'd think. For recording you don't need a big cab or power-amp, you can get away with a nice preamp and use it with IRs. Some nice studio-friendly preamps include Victory V4 series, Lany Ironheart, Jessup custom.

Of course you won't get the same versatility as a modelling setup.
Good point. I honestly hadn’t thought about why most people would want a modeller (at home) to start with, haha.

Instead, I was recalling being able to pick up, for example, a Laney GH50L for around $300, and seeing cheap but perfectly fine cabs everywhere. Then there’s the plethora of cheap(er) pedals these days. Oh, and throw in an SM57 for ~$50.

Buuut of course, the direct in (from preamp / preamp+cabsim) approach might be preferred. There is that. :oops:

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KVRAF
4715 posts since 16 May, 2002 from Brisbane , Australia

Post Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:25 am

Apparently the Boss Katana range are good. The difference between my PodXT and AX8 is like comparing a fart to a sine wave. I think the Pod effects are still usable though so I keep it around. Not worth selling anyway.
My Music >>> °morelia ° Intel Core i7 8700K, 16gb, Windows 10 Pro, Focusrite Scarlet 6i6

KVRist
222 posts since 27 May, 2003

Post Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:48 pm

yul wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:11 am
Hey guys thanks for your responses!

Yes I am looking for suggestions in the lower end of the price spectrum (I saw some stuff over 1K$ etc at that point I might get a real amp and pedals.)

So yes, amp + effects (like what the POD 2.0 did) would be much appreciated!
I know a lot of stuff gets done on the PC but I would want external..

Cheers
I am using some plugins but I was also through every Line 6 generation of modelers (using HX Stomp right now) but still enjoying some tube amps.
If you feel like learning about convultion impulses and using them by hooking up your old pod to the PC, you would be surprised how much better it sounds when you turn off his cab simulation and use an impulse of a speaker. There is a lot of free impulses to find, you don't have to use commercial stuff. So you may get some more mileage out of your old unit.
Latest Line 6 generation is much better, but it also relies heavily on impulses because they are much better than built in cab simulation. With Helix you have to add impulses yourself, some other units may have some already installed.
Also I think that there is a bit of a fault in logic "If I have to spend 1K I will get real amp". These days amp is not necessarily better than amp sim. I have JVM 410H and 5150 and I really enjoy playing them live and on the rehearsals, but tube amps are loud, and I think it is apples and oranges situation. 1000$ amp and 1000$ amp sim will work better than 300$ amp and 300$ amp sim in most scenarios. It is more about what you need. If you are bedroom player, buy the best hardware ampsim you can afford. If you need amp so you can play with people and if you have a place where you can turn it up, than just buy the amp. These days those two things are not alternatives but different tools for different use scenarios. I personally need both.

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KVRAF
3918 posts since 6 Nov, 2009

Post Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:53 pm

Yes, they have improved, but here's the kicker: if you listen to stuff from 2014, you may not need the improvements. Plug&Mix's California distortion is all I expect the computer to do for me. It has the old easycore Garageband/Logic sound I want and anything more would probably disappoint, actually.

Rad Grandad
33181 posts since 6 Sep, 2003 from Downeast Maine

Post Fri Apr 23, 2021 9:21 am

kvotchin wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:24 pm
Used, you can pick up a really nice tube amp plus some pedals for under $1000 total, easy.

New... yeah, okay. Harder to do.

Oh, and re: amp/cab modelling, yes - it’s come a fair way since the days when PODs where ubiquitous.
you can get some nice new tube amps built by Frenzel for well less than a grand, but that is not always the reasoning for sims...actually I have a pod 2.0 and an xt live, haven't used them since I lost the need...my need was living in an apartment. I actually lived right by the busiest street in my city, my problem wasn't being too loud (which I easily could be), my problem was outside noise getting picked by the mic (ambulances, police, fire, harleys, loud car stereos).

I have a few tube amps now (6 I think), three are Frenzels and an amazing amount of capabilities with it being modular capable too. One of my frenzels (the centerpiece as it were) is the champ supersportster...mine was made 9 or 10 years ago, single ended so it can use any octal based power tube and I have yellow jackets so I can run a el 84 as well, I had Jim Frenzel add a pentode/triode switch (is now, wasnt an option then) and a few other features making it a great recording amp (still run mostly into an iso cab) but no cage, the amp is open, also mine does not have the tube selector like in the description.. The other two are pres with a single tube output (a 12au7 as a power tube) if one chooses...my second was is hi-gain and was designed to work with my main Frenzel...but now I live in a house in the woods of Maine :hihi:

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KVRist
108 posts since 2 Mar, 2017

Post Sat Apr 24, 2021 2:41 pm

Vervil wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:48 pm
Also I think that there is a bit of a fault in logic "If I have to spend 1K I will get real amp". These days amp is not necessarily better than amp sim. I have JVM 410H and 5150 and I really enjoy playing them live and on the rehearsals, but tube amps are loud, and I think it is apples and oranges situation. 1000$ amp and 1000$ amp sim will work better than 300$ amp and 300$ amp sim in most scenarios. It is more about what you need. If you are bedroom player, buy the best hardware ampsim you can afford. If you need amp so you can play with people and if you have a place where you can turn it up, than just buy the amp. These days those two things are not alternatives but different tools for different use scenarios. I personally need both.
Of course if you have a $1000 amp sim you would be perfectly able to go straight to board, not needing an amp. And it's common practice to run amp sims into plain clean/power amps (keyboard amps, fx returns on solid state amps, etc), which are going to be less expensive than $1000.

On the other hand, if you have a quality amplifier you still have the issue of how much your effects will cost you.

KVRist
222 posts since 27 May, 2003

Post Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:16 pm

Magic Russ wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 2:41 pm

Of course if you have a $1000 amp sim you would be perfectly able to go straight to board, not needing an amp. And it's common practice to run amp sims into plain clean/power amps (keyboard amps, fx returns on solid state amps, etc), which are going to be less expensive than $1000.

On the other hand, if you have a quality amplifier you still have the issue of how much your effects will cost you.
Well it all depends, there are different scenarios depending on what you need and want.
When it comes to big festivals I tried both taking my amp head with me and just taking my effects and going direct. Playing with industrial rock band when there is a backing track with a lot of synth sounds, going direct was a good solution, because I am mostly just chugging and riffing. With my own band, using valve head was MUCH better, because even if it may sound close in a mix through the PA, the interaction with loud amp is something different, and makes me enjoy playing. And in some cases when there is not much time between bands, using head with 4x12 box that is already there is much more straightforward for our sound guy . So for different people and different situations / different solutions.

When it comes to cost, you may be right, although, if someone just needs few pedals, there is some quite inexpensive decent stuff to be found, and if someone prefers the amp and has a place where to turn it up - it is just so much more satisfying. Also, have in mind that amp and guitars are always solid investment. You can buy an amp second hand in great condition, play it and take care about it and in 10 years it will still hold its value. Same goes for analog pedal effects. On the other hand, modern digital FX platforms will lose most of their value in time. So this is also something to have in mind.
Last edited by Vervil on Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KVRist
86 posts since 22 May, 2020

Post Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:09 am

Since I just switched from Ampero One to Mooer Preamp Live, I wanted to share my feelings about the latter device, and it compares to the Ampero.
The 2 devices are not exactly of the same type, one being a multi-fx, the other an ampsim/preamp with some boost pedal options. I will focus on amp and can simulation.
Overall, I enjoyed Ampero, but the built in cabs were not satisfactory. I struggled to get good tones with no IRs. Luckily, there are 10 IR slots you can use. In comparison, Mooer Preamp Live has much better cabs, and I don't feel the need to use IRs at all, at least for low-to-midgain tones.
The amp simulations were audibly more fizzy in Ampero, and I prefer the response of the Mooer. Playing it simply feels more fun, more alive.
Both units are ok, and Ampero gives you more tone shaping options - EQs, modulation, reverbs and delays, etc. Mooer does one thing, and does it really well - it provides a basis for your pedal-only, direct-to-PA rig. I think it simply sounds better too.
So far, i've added a compressor before the Mooer, and will surely add a reverb in the effects loop, maybe a delay later on. Other than that, I feel I'm set.

KVRer
8 posts since 30 Apr, 2021

Post Mon May 10, 2021 3:13 am

Hi, if I can be honest, wait for some m ore cash and go for a Kemper, it's crazy good imho!

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