Live 11!

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
User avatar
KVRAF
29968 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Post Tue May 11, 2021 4:53 pm

dayjob wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 12:35 pm
the new M4L stuff they released today is quite awesome.

https://youtu.be/s8saPbkr9KI

more info about the devices here:

https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/live-11 ... e-devices/
cheers :tu:

User avatar
KVRAF
8863 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Tue May 11, 2021 9:10 pm

liquidsound wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 3:19 pm
antic604 wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 2:27 pm
dayjob wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 12:35 pm
more info about the devices here:

https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/live-11 ... e-devices/
Damn :o
Don't do it! :hihi:
Not planning to. But one has to admire the pace, variety & depth of stuff they've been adding since v10 really. I guess having 30x the employee count compared to that of e.g. Bitwig pays off :hihi:
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

KVRAF
3397 posts since 30 May, 2006 from Hollow Earth

Post Tue May 11, 2021 10:37 pm

antic604 wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 9:10 pm
liquidsound wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 3:19 pm
antic604 wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 2:27 pm
dayjob wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 12:35 pm
more info about the devices here:

https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/live-11 ... e-devices/
Damn :o
Don't do it! :hihi:
Not planning to. But one has to admire the pace, variety & depth of stuff they've been adding since v10 really. I guess having 30x the employee count compared to that of e.g. Bitwig pays off :hihi:
And perhaps millions of more users as well :phones:
Diva - Dune - Omnisphere - Serum - Spire

User avatar
KVRAF
8863 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Tue May 11, 2021 10:46 pm

liquidsound wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:37 pm
And perhaps millions of more users as well :phones:
That's actually a negative for me. The number of uninformed, ignorant and plain stupid posts one have to go through to find any good info on Reddit's or FB's Ableton groups is staggering... Or perhaps I'm too old & cranky for the "kool kids" on social media :)
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

KVRian
1178 posts since 23 May, 2012 from London

Post Tue May 11, 2021 10:56 pm

Call me grumpy but I'm not all that impressed and I actually feel more validated in my choice to use Bitwig as my main DAW. Shiny toys are cool, but it's all Ableton seem to really be focusing on these last few years and they don't really make up for the core application being somewhat neglected still. To me it smacks of a quantity vs quality mindset, which is great for pulling in new custom "look at how much stuff we're giving you" but it's not conducive to getting work done. Personally, I just want to be able to work faster, more efficiently with the many excellent tools and workflows Live already provides, not be distracted noodling around with the yet another new M4L device.
Always Read the Manual!

KVRian
1178 posts since 23 May, 2012 from London

Post Tue May 11, 2021 10:57 pm

antic604 wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:46 pm
... Or perhaps I'm too old & cranky
There I fixed it for you :lol:
Always Read the Manual!

KVRist
478 posts since 2 Nov, 2014

Post Wed May 12, 2021 4:15 am

PieBerger wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:56 pm
Call me grumpy but I'm not all that impressed and I actually feel more validated in my choice to use Bitwig as my main DAW. Shiny toys are cool, but it's all Ableton seem to really be focusing on these last few years and they don't really make up for the core application being somewhat neglected still. To me it smacks of a quantity vs quality mindset, which is great for pulling in new custom "look at how much stuff we're giving you" but it's not conducive to getting work done. Personally, I just want to be able to work faster, more efficiently with the many excellent tools and workflows Live already provides, not be distracted noodling around with the yet another new M4L device.
Same here. Ableton keep ignoring a lot of basic, boring but essential workflow features for years.

KVRAF
7382 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales

Post Wed May 12, 2021 4:46 am

PieBerger wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:56 pm
Call me grumpy but I'm not all that impressed and I actually feel more validated in my choice to use Bitwig as my main DAW. Shiny toys are cool, but it's all Ableton seem to really be focusing on these last few years and they don't really make up for the core application being somewhat neglected still. To me it smacks of a quantity vs quality mindset, which is great for pulling in new custom "look at how much stuff we're giving you" but it's not conducive to getting work done. Personally, I just want to be able to work faster, more efficiently with the many excellent tools and workflows Live already provides, not be distracted noodling around with the yet another new M4L device.
It's all about what the individual needs, there is no generic workflow. Studio On is still my main
DAW, but personally I now use Live more than Bitwig as comping is more important to my workflow as I record a lot of live instruments and MP is now pretty good in Live. I would say the core features added to Live 11 were very useful and most of them were very popular and requested features (follow actions, comping, MPE, linked track editing, more macros etc) the new reverb is among the best of any DAW and the other 'toys' are just a bonus as far as I am concerned.

Meanwhile, back on the Bigwig threads all you will see a lot of requesting (nay, demanding!) new features, last time we got wavetable, polymer, 'grid stuff', similar to getting MAX stuff- I would have personably preferred comping and audio/midi editing tools. Bitwig are also ignoring the basic workflow stuff (it is being drip fed) in favour of 'grid' development...
PC, Studio One, BWS, Live, FL Studio, Renoise, Reason, X32 Desk, Hardware Synths, Drum Machines + Eurorack, TD27 V Drums, Guitars & Basses

KVRian
1178 posts since 23 May, 2012 from London

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:13 am

SLiC wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 4:46 am
Meanwhile, back on the Bigwig threads all you will see a lot of requesting (nay, demanding!) new features, last time we got wavetable, polymer, 'grid stuff', similar to getting MAX stuff- I would have personably preferred comping and audio/midi editing tools. Bitwig are also ignoring the basic workflow stuff (it is being drip fed) in favour of 'grid' development...
For me personally at least, the basic worfklow stuff is already leagues ahead in Bitwig compared to Live; bounce-in-place, hybrid tracks, properly functioning PDC, multiclip fading (on the same track), container clips for audio events, much better mix console, to name but a few. I'd argue that keeping on top of basic workflow is less of a concern for them because they got ahead early on. We're still waiting on basic workflow stuff to be implemented in Live that has featured highly on across multiple generations of beta program suggestion list's, since before Bitwig even existed.

The Grid was the big thing for V3, so it makes sense that point releases thereafter have been quite Grid heavy. I'm curious to see what V4 brings and whether they continue this trend or divert some attention back to less sexy but still very welcome and much needed features such as comping, especially now Live has it and has likely swung tape-style DAW using fence-sitters over into the Ableton camp.
Always Read the Manual!

User avatar
KVRAF
8863 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:25 am

PieBerger wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:13 am
...Live has it and has likely swung tape-style DAW using fence-sitters over into the Ableton camp.
How does one sit on a fence tape-style? :scared:

My imagination went into really weird places reading this... :hihi: :D
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

KVRAF
7382 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:29 am

PieBerger wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:13 am
SLiC wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 4:46 am
Meanwhile, back on the Bigwig threads all you will see a lot of requesting (nay, demanding!) new features, last time we got wavetable, polymer, 'grid stuff', similar to getting MAX stuff- I would have personably preferred comping and audio/midi editing tools. Bitwig are also ignoring the basic workflow stuff (it is being drip fed) in favour of 'grid' development...
For me personally at least, the basic worfklow stuff is already leagues ahead in Bitwig compared to Live; bounce-in-place, hybrid tracks, properly functioning PDC, multiclip fading (on the same track), container clips for audio events, much better mix console, to name but a few. I'd argue that keeping on top of basic workflow is less of a concern for them because they got ahead early on. We're still waiting on basic workflow stuff to be implemented in Live that has featured highly on across multiple generations of beta program suggestion list's, since before Bitwig even existed.

The Grid was the big thing for V3, so it makes sense that point releases thereafter have been quite Grid heavy. I'm curious to see what V4 brings and whether they continue this trend or divert some attention back to less sexy but still very welcome and much needed features such as comping, especially now Live has it and has likely swung tape-style DAW using fence-sitters over into the Ableton camp.
I cant disagree, that why I bought Bitwig when I had Live!

However, I would also say the basic workflow stuff 'for me' is miles ahead in say Studio One (comprehensive midi and audio editing, best in class comping and take management (IMO), polyphonic pitch and time correction, score edit, step edit, articulation, 'much better' mixing console and mastering, etc). I don't expect Live or Bitwig to match a DAW that is dedicated to basic linier workflow (I don't think they ever set out to do that) but I prefer to use a DAW that has good take management and comping, Live wins over Bitwig right now and that feature is more important to me than some of the others you mention....hopefully that will be addressed at some point.
PC, Studio One, BWS, Live, FL Studio, Renoise, Reason, X32 Desk, Hardware Synths, Drum Machines + Eurorack, TD27 V Drums, Guitars & Basses

KVRAF
1791 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:36 am

have both, any discussion or arguments, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, etc. will not affect you.
so calming, to have and ableton live 11 suite and bitwig studio 3.3.7.

i read the posts zen-like. kra axis os sancrum!
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

KVRAF
7382 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:42 am

WasteLand wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:36 am
have both, any discussion or arguments, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, etc. will not affect you.
so calming, to have and ableton live 11 suite and bitwig studio 3.3.7.

i read the posts zen-like. kra axis os sancrum!
I have lots of DAWS as well just like I have lots of hardware sequencers. I like them all for different reasons, enjoy every update and no FOMO, I want them all to do well :tu:
PC, Studio One, BWS, Live, FL Studio, Renoise, Reason, X32 Desk, Hardware Synths, Drum Machines + Eurorack, TD27 V Drums, Guitars & Basses

KVRAF
1791 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:50 am

SLiC wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:42 am
WasteLand wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:36 am
have both, any discussion or arguments, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, etc. will not affect you.
so calming, to have and ableton live 11 suite and bitwig studio 3.3.7.

i read the posts zen-like. kra axis os sancrum!
I have lots of DAWS as well just like I have lots of hardware sequencers. I like them all for different reasons, enjoy every update and no FOMO, I want them all to do well :tu:
:party:

the same here! but work only ITB, and only 6 DAW's (7 if you count Maschine..). use them all, i know before i want something which one i must use. and sometimes devices/RE's, make the decision...
jumping around from DAW to DAW me also like, or programs in between...

:D
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

KVRian
1178 posts since 23 May, 2012 from London

Post Wed May 12, 2021 6:10 am

WasteLand wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 5:36 am
have both, any discussion or arguments, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, live - bitwig, bitwig - live, etc. will not affect you.
so calming, to have and ableton live 11 suite and bitwig studio 3.3.7.

i read the posts zen-like. kra axis os sancrum!
I admire your zen approach, I have both and now it's twice the complaining :lol:

As grumpy as I may get, it's nothing really in the grand scheme of things. I even went back to Live 10 to write a track with a friend who hasn't upgraded and it was fine. It's not my first choice, but if I have to use it, it's not painful/unpleasant/completely devoid of all fun!
Always Read the Manual!

Return to “Hosts & Applications (Sequencers, DAWs, Audio Editors, etc.)”