alternatively: DAW acting out or me being a tool... please help me figure out.
MAudioPlugins 14.16
VST 3.6.5
Nuendo 11
Windows 10 Pro
1. MIDI channel 1, note C2: MDrummer will not trigger the corresponding rhythm. Triggers normally on notes C#2 to B2.
Have my playhead on the left edge of (or well before) MIDI event beginning with C2 to be sent to MDrummer, press PLAY on host, nothing happens in MDrummer... until I press STOP in host, then the host's playhead jumps to the initial position (with the note C2), and MDrummer starts playing the rhythm (the play button in MDrummer's Rhythm Editor becomes depressed).
Tried to change to MIDI channel 2, filled in some data for the rhythm 1 (C2) on channel 2. Changed the MIDI output in host correspondingly. MDrummer triggered properly, at first, then... same thing, rhythm won't trigger, EXCEPT when I move the host's playhead around. Everytime the playhead comes to new position, MDrummer now starts playing the rhythm it flat-out refuses to play on command.
WHAT is going on? Is this some DAW feature I have accidentally enabled, or is something broken in the DAW or in MDrummer? Is there a setting in MDrummer that I've missed? I've never encountered anything like this before.
2. MDrummer often just skips hits. It seems to be consistent. For example, with a 4/4 steady kick pattern being repeated over and over, there is a certain beat in a certain bar where the kick seems to be completely silent. Not on every instance of the exact same rhythm being repeated, but on a specific instance out of many. Which may relate to...
3. The volume of some hits seems random, although I've quadruple-checked that in the rhythm editor the parameters shouldn't create this behavior, and I have all randomization and shuffling turned off everywhere I know. When creating a new rhythm, I noticed the kick had very low volume in the beginning (first note), and then the subsequent notes were much higher volume, and I think some in between were again lower in volume. I've not found a setting that would cause this.
Been pretty smooth sailing until now, but this is driving me mad! If anyone has any pointers as to where to look next or what to try, I'd appreciate it.
MDrummer going haywire in a multitude of ways
-
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 187 posts since 6 Jun, 2019
After meticulous investigation I have homed in on the primary suspect:
[ ] MDrummer going haywire
[ ] DAW acting out
[x] me being a tool
Turns out I had a custom expression map active (but not in use!) on my MDrummer MIDI command track, and somehow this likely caused all the weird behavior. Phew, I'm an idiot!
[ ] MDrummer going haywire
[ ] DAW acting out
[x] me being a tool
Turns out I had a custom expression map active (but not in use!) on my MDrummer MIDI command track, and somehow this likely caused all the weird behavior. Phew, I'm an idiot!
-
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 187 posts since 6 Jun, 2019
You're too nice. 
Honestly made me scratch my head for hours.
There are some shortcuts I miss from Xfer Nerve, but that's it. MDrummer is the one that gets me into the most creative mindset - I feel like I'm composing for drums instead of just whipping up beats.
Honestly made me scratch my head for hours.It does! Having a lot of fun with it and the "new" Drum Empire sounds. I tried so many drum VST's before I discovered Melda and ultimately MDrummer and took the plunge.
There are some shortcuts I miss from Xfer Nerve, but that's it. MDrummer is the one that gets me into the most creative mindset - I feel like I'm composing for drums instead of just whipping up beats.
-
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 187 posts since 6 Jun, 2019
I still do have a problem with timing.
At first the beats would not trigger if they followed another beat, as if the first beat blocked the second one from triggering, although timing looked right and MDrummer was synced to the host's tempo.
Then I messed around with nudging the notes slightly, and it seemed like if I added just a little time between the note-ons, then the second beat would trigger. But then I'd have to move every consecutive note further into future, effectively stretching out and desyncing the beat with rest of the arrangement.
I eventually found this thread: Inconsistent MIDI command triggering in MDrummer Large
I had no idea the pit of these timing issues would be this deep. My whole project was offset by four bars from the beginning (first MIDI event started at bar 4) and the part I was having trouble with started at bar 121. I moved it to 129 and I can't remember anymore if I did something else, but the beats would now trigger properly.
I was also fiddling with the time signatures in both Nuendo and MDrummer, and at some point the sequencer in MDrummer was acting totally erratic if I was using 8/4 time signature. For example, the playhead would sometimes stop after certain beat, then MDrummer would play nothing for the next beat duration plus/minus some, then start playing the pattern again without external trigger from seemingly random position towards the end of the pattern. It felt like there was no rhyme or reason to what it did half of the time.
Eventually, I got it to trigger consistently with 4/4 time in both Nuendo and MDrummer. However, the loops were way too short to work with at 245 tempo. Now, when I change the time to 8/4, MDrummer stops after it has played the first half of the loop (which in 4/4 was the full loop).
I've been pulling my hair out with this thing, so frustrated I've started considering alternatives, which really is the last resort and something I'd rather not do at this point. I just don't get why this is so difficult. How do I get MDrummer to do what I want? Why can't it just trigger a loop when I command it, and keep playing it until it finishes or it receives another command, without having an opinion on anything else that is or isn't going on at the moment.
EDIT: I opened an earlier copy of the project to restore all the drum patterns I had created in 8/4 time in MDrummer, which got destroyed when I fiddled with the time signatures inside MDrummer and the host. Other than this, there were very few changes between the versions. I saved the whole thing from 'Menu > Save song', closed the old project, opened the new one, went in MDrummer 'Menu > Load song'. Now the loops were being triggered as expected. Note that at this point, nothing else has changed in the new project except I have loaded the old rhythms that were not working properly before, into the new environment with the timeline adjustments made (in which the new rhythms hadn't worked properly).
It certainly seems like something is broken in MDrummer, but Melda being Melda I've learned not to be too certain. After all, there could be an options screen inside an options screen inside an options screen that I haven't yet stumbled upon... I'd be happy to help with homing in on the problem in any way I can.
At first the beats would not trigger if they followed another beat, as if the first beat blocked the second one from triggering, although timing looked right and MDrummer was synced to the host's tempo.
Then I messed around with nudging the notes slightly, and it seemed like if I added just a little time between the note-ons, then the second beat would trigger. But then I'd have to move every consecutive note further into future, effectively stretching out and desyncing the beat with rest of the arrangement.
I eventually found this thread: Inconsistent MIDI command triggering in MDrummer Large
I had no idea the pit of these timing issues would be this deep. My whole project was offset by four bars from the beginning (first MIDI event started at bar 4) and the part I was having trouble with started at bar 121. I moved it to 129 and I can't remember anymore if I did something else, but the beats would now trigger properly.
I was also fiddling with the time signatures in both Nuendo and MDrummer, and at some point the sequencer in MDrummer was acting totally erratic if I was using 8/4 time signature. For example, the playhead would sometimes stop after certain beat, then MDrummer would play nothing for the next beat duration plus/minus some, then start playing the pattern again without external trigger from seemingly random position towards the end of the pattern. It felt like there was no rhyme or reason to what it did half of the time.
Eventually, I got it to trigger consistently with 4/4 time in both Nuendo and MDrummer. However, the loops were way too short to work with at 245 tempo. Now, when I change the time to 8/4, MDrummer stops after it has played the first half of the loop (which in 4/4 was the full loop).
I've been pulling my hair out with this thing, so frustrated I've started considering alternatives, which really is the last resort and something I'd rather not do at this point. I just don't get why this is so difficult. How do I get MDrummer to do what I want? Why can't it just trigger a loop when I command it, and keep playing it until it finishes or it receives another command, without having an opinion on anything else that is or isn't going on at the moment.
EDIT: I opened an earlier copy of the project to restore all the drum patterns I had created in 8/4 time in MDrummer, which got destroyed when I fiddled with the time signatures inside MDrummer and the host. Other than this, there were very few changes between the versions. I saved the whole thing from 'Menu > Save song', closed the old project, opened the new one, went in MDrummer 'Menu > Load song'. Now the loops were being triggered as expected. Note that at this point, nothing else has changed in the new project except I have loaded the old rhythms that were not working properly before, into the new environment with the timeline adjustments made (in which the new rhythms hadn't worked properly).
It certainly seems like something is broken in MDrummer, but Melda being Melda I've learned not to be too certain. After all, there could be an options screen inside an options screen inside an options screen that I haven't yet stumbled upon... I'd be happy to help with homing in on the problem in any way I can.
-
Chandlerhimself Chandlerhimself https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=318799
- KVRAF
- 1821 posts since 19 Dec, 2013 from Japan
I'm not sure exactly what is happening with your project, but I'll release a video showing how to change time signatures in Mdrummer in 2 days. It will hopefully solve your problem.
My Youtube page https://www.youtube.com/user/GuitarChandler
-
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 187 posts since 6 Jun, 2019
That's hilarious, because yesterday I was watching your videos (again) looking for explanation on what was/is going on, thinking "Why doesn't Chandler explain this stuff to me?" So... looking forward to it!
In the meantime, and independently of that, I would appreciate it if somebody explained all-encompassingly how MDrummer makes the decision what loop to play, when (and in relation to what, in what time units), and from what position within the loop's internal timeline, and when will it stop. For starters.
Because I don't get it. I thought I did, but alas, here I am.
In the meantime, and independently of that, I would appreciate it if somebody explained all-encompassingly how MDrummer makes the decision what loop to play, when (and in relation to what, in what time units), and from what position within the loop's internal timeline, and when will it stop. For starters.
Because I don't get it. I thought I did, but alas, here I am.
-
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 187 posts since 6 Jun, 2019
Still cracking on this...stearine wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:16 pm I would appreciate it if somebody explained all-encompassingly how MDrummer makes the decision what loop to play, when (and in relation to what, in what time units), and from what position within the loop's internal timeline, and when will it stop.
1. Sometimes when I change from 4/4 to 8/4, MDrummer stops playing halfway through (where the 4/4 pattern would have ended), then when I increase it further to 10/4 or so, AND THEN lower back to 8/4, MDrummer will happily play the whole pattern.
2. The timing is broken and it either relates to the host's tempo linearly (MDrummer can't keep up at higher tempos) or the timestep must be in certain ratio or something. I have not figured it out. MDrummer can play the pattern nicely 10 times and then randomly fail to trigger it.
3. Recently I changed the project sample rate from 48kHz to 96kHz and had to adjust all timings. MDrummer started skipping beats again, even though the relative speed is the same.
4. Sometimes after changing time signatures (see #1) I have to go "Save/Load song" and restore the otherwise identical set of loops and everything, to make MDrummer behave again.
I've wasted so many hours on this and it kills my creativity.
