Plogue OPS7 (bit-accurate DX7 emulation!)

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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KVRAF
4644 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:43 am

mholloway wrote:
Mon Sep 27, 2021 8:06 pm
gentleclockdivider wrote:
Mon Sep 27, 2021 3:19 pm

I must be in the minority but I found the envelopes always intuitive and easy .
It's just 'time x' to reach 'level x ', 'time y' to reach 'level y' etc...
Respectfully, this is misleading and inaccurate, and just furthers a lot of people's (totally understandable) confusion with the DX7 envelopes:

It's not 'time', it's rate. And that means moving the knob forward (right) = Faster, and moving it back (left) = Slower, for the four rate knobs. Which is, you must agree, exactly the opposite of what people generally expect from such knobs!

Usually we think "if the knob is all the way forward, it's a long or slow amount of time." But on the DX7, again (as you know) forward is not "lots of time / slow" it's "increased rate" and thereby Fast or short. I mean, about 99% of popular synths follow the 'turn it right means longer and slower" logic. Yamaha said "eff that", turned them from Time to Rate, and flipped everything around. (I know, I know, the DX7 itself didn't have knobs; thus the further confusion when its envelopes are translated to knobs or sliders in modern day UIs, etc.)

It takes some getting used to, no doubt. As for possible noobs reading this and wondering about Time vs. Rate, just think about how 99 seconds is longer than 1 second, but 99 MPH is FASTER than 1 MPH, and it will click in....
Sure it's rate , but it's still passing time between level stages .
Don't know why make a fuzz about
Lfo's( in general) are rate in hertz which is just the same as time in (milli)seconds .
Take the reciprocal of your rate in hertz and you've got your time in
True , the rate values on the dx are not exoressed in time , but it's time nonetheless
Last edited by gentleclockdivider on Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies

KVRAF
13133 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:51 am

jbraner wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:27 am
ghettosynth wrote:
Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:54 pm
davidv@plogue wrote:
Mon Sep 27, 2021 3:28 pm
ghettosynth wrote:
Mon Sep 27, 2021 3:24 pm
It is definitely priced right. Is this using Plogue's standard license file copy protection, ala bidule?
Bidule uses our older .bin file (2001 called)
All our products since then use our ARIA/Fermata personalized keycard registration system.
Install on as many machines as you want. Your name and address are on the card.

This video is nearly 10 years old and in dire need of a refresh but it should give you an idea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhObtpl39OU
Thanks, to be clear though, does it require activation on every install, or, once the card is created can it just be copied to another machine, e.g., one that is offline?
You just drag the png file over the plugin once - and it's activated.
That's it ;)
I'm trying to be very clear here. If I activate on an online computer my card gets created. So I have a card. I move the card and the plugin to an offline computer. Can I activate that computer while it's offline with just the card? Or, is it an online activation process, i.e., dragging the card onto the plugin initiates an activation process with Plogue for that new computer?

User avatar
KVRian
532 posts since 27 Aug, 2020

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:53 am

gentleclockdivider wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:43 am
Sure it's rate , but it's still passing time between level stages .
Don't know why make a fuzz about
Lfo's( in general) are rate in hertz which is just the same as time in (milli)seconds .
Take the reciprocal of your rate in hertz and you've got your time in
True , the rate values on the dx are not exoressed in time , but it's time nonetheless
From what I understand, he says it's a bit misleading because the higher the values of the parameter are, the faster the envelope stage is, so calling it "rate" instead of "time" makes more sense.

If we call it a time parameter, higher values should logically denote a slower envelope stage in this context, as in, more miliseconds, "more time" if you will, needed to reach the designated level within the envelope stage. Something along those lines anyways.

KVRist
300 posts since 18 Jul, 2021

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:17 am

ghettosynth wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 12:51 am
I'm trying to be very clear here. If I activate on an online computer my card gets created. So I have a card. I move the card and the plugin to an offline computer. Can I activate that computer while it's offline with just the card? Or, is it an online activation process, i.e., dragging the card onto the plugin initiates an activation process with Plogue for that new computer?
https://www.plogue.com/support/f-a-q.html

"End users can buy a license key that will unlock the product for ANY NUMBER of their personal computers, laptops and workstations, Mac or PC. One key, no challenge/response web accesses or telephone calls for any of your stations."

KVRist
139 posts since 12 Nov, 2020

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am

gentleclockdivider wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:52 am
BenfordLaw wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:25 am
gaggle of hermits wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 am
i'm not sure something based on a dx7 is what you're after.

"here's bit-exact dx7 clone"

"does it make sounds that don't sound like they come from a dx7?"

"er..." <insert gif of nation fillion in castle attempting to explain something here>
I'm asking if there is a video that shows decent DX7 patches, apart from the factory sounds. Like LOTS of decent presets that aren't all variations on the very (in my opinion) limited number of different presets that the DX7 has.
If you don't know how to program fm synths , this synth is not for you , simple as that .
Fm is capable of amazing basses and pads etc ,ops7 even expands on this by providing feedback per operator which is beyond what the tg77 can offer ( only 3 feedback loops )
Maybe just start learning the principles of operator ratios , 2-1 for square etc.. , subhertz operators inbetween for chorus like effects etc...instead of wading through 40 year old pathces .
Yes, that sounds like a really good idea, instead of writing music, I'll spend hours and hours of my time trying to come up with a decent preset in OPS7... Does it ever occur to you that the vast majority of people who use synths don't create presets?

I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?

KVRAF
1652 posts since 19 Apr, 2003 from Copenhagen, Denmark

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:05 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
gentleclockdivider wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:52 am
BenfordLaw wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:25 am
gaggle of hermits wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 am
i'm not sure something based on a dx7 is what you're after.

"here's bit-exact dx7 clone"

"does it make sounds that don't sound like they come from a dx7?"

"er..." <insert gif of nation fillion in castle attempting to explain something here>
I'm asking if there is a video that shows decent DX7 patches, apart from the factory sounds. Like LOTS of decent presets that aren't all variations on the very (in my opinion) limited number of different presets that the DX7 has.
If you don't know how to program fm synths , this synth is not for you , simple as that .
Fm is capable of amazing basses and pads etc ,ops7 even expands on this by providing feedback per operator which is beyond what the tg77 can offer ( only 3 feedback loops )
Maybe just start learning the principles of operator ratios , 2-1 for square etc.. , subhertz operators inbetween for chorus like effects etc...instead of wading through 40 year old pathces .
Yes, that sounds like a really good idea, instead of writing music, I'll spend hours and hours of my time trying to come up with a decent preset in OPS7... Does it ever occur to you that the vast majority of people who use synths don't create presets?

I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
Watch a video about the DX7, and if nothing inspires you for writing music, forget about DX/OPS7
___The Jepptunes___
"Accept All the Good"

Sound design for SQ8L and Alchemy

KVRist
300 posts since 18 Jul, 2021

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:12 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
i think i've figured out your problem. your long-term memory is shot, which is why you keep posting the same thing in this thread.

i can only conclude, you've not only heard loads of great dx7 presets but you've forgotten them...and even forgotten that the dx7 existed in the first place which is why you keep banging on about the ops7.

User avatar
KVRAF
2278 posts since 8 Dec, 2008 from Global Cowboy

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:33 am

gaggle of hermits wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:12 am
i think i've figured out your problem. your long-term memory is shot, which is why you keep posting the same thing in this thread.
:lol:
No auto tune and iLok free...

KVRAF
1652 posts since 19 Apr, 2003 from Copenhagen, Denmark

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:46 am

Or you could listen to this album with Howard Jones
There is DX7 all over it, and a great way to judge the sounds in a musical context
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... TFB0brlav9
___The Jepptunes___
"Accept All the Good"

Sound design for SQ8L and Alchemy

User avatar
KVRian
532 posts since 27 Aug, 2020

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 3:03 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
Yes, that sounds like a really good idea, instead of writing music, I'll spend hours and hours of my time trying to come up with a decent preset in OPS7... Does it ever occur to you that the vast majority of people who use synths don't create presets?

I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
Why won't you get Nexus or Avenger then? Seriously, if you don't intend to use softsynths to synthesize sounds of your own, why not just get a ROMpler? I bet they offer a lot of digital sounding patches, which will fit your needs.

I really don't understand you.

So in other words, you don't like the way the original DX7 sounds, don't like the way FM sounds, don't like creating sounds from scratch and you're planning on buying a softsynth, let alone an FM softsynth, which is a clear-cut emulation of the DX7? :clap:

User avatar
KVRAF
4644 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:49 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
gentleclockdivider wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:52 am
BenfordLaw wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:25 am
gaggle of hermits wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 am
i'm not sure something based on a dx7 is what you're after.

"here's bit-exact dx7 clone"

"does it make sounds that don't sound like they come from a dx7?"

"er..." <insert gif of nation fillion in castle attempting to explain something here>
I'm asking if there is a video that shows decent DX7 patches, apart from the factory sounds. Like LOTS of decent presets that aren't all variations on the very (in my opinion) limited number of different presets that the DX7 has.
If you don't know how to program fm synths , this synth is not for you , simple as that .
Fm is capable of amazing basses and pads etc ,ops7 even expands on this by providing feedback per operator which is beyond what the tg77 can offer ( only 3 feedback loops )
Maybe just start learning the principles of operator ratios , 2-1 for square etc.. , subhertz operators inbetween for chorus like effects etc...instead of wading through 40 year old pathces .
Yes, that sounds like a really good idea, instead of writing music, I'll spend hours and hours of my time trying to come up with a decent preset in OPS7... Does it ever occur to you that the vast majority of people who use synths don't create presets?

I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
Some of uss have decades of experience under their belt and designing sounds is an integral part of the composition , and it's just a lot of fun when your coping with writer'ss block :tu:
Fm have been used in pop , techno ,industrial etc.
It's a complex but verry rewarding synthesis method and awesome for bass,-->detroit techno<-- ,pads , and cheesy bells and woodblocks :lol:
If you can't even bring it up to do some basic googling about FM in general , then don't expect to be spoonfed .
Information is literally at your fingertips and all is takes is a little bit of effort , but no :roll:
Short answer : no the dx is not for you
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
10541 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 6:55 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
Take a look at these links: https://synthmania.com/2005/04/16/yamaha-dx7/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3rrjQtQe5A

Whether these classify as good or great, I'll leave it to you.
Fernando (FMR)

KVRian
1349 posts since 8 Jan, 2003 from Edinburgh

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:53 am

davidv@plogue wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:30 pm
aMUSEd wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:20 pm
How do I save the zoom level and turn off keyboard as default?

And where are user presets supposed to go? I tried saving a patch and it actually took me initially to my Omnisphere preset folder (because that had been the last plugin I'd saved a preset in).
Please try "save as default" when clicking in the top preset menu after your custom setup is done. The only thing it fails to save is the MTS-ESP flag that we know. Next instance/session should start with those defaults (unless you recall an old session that has other settings)
It also doesn't save chan mix or the CC7 settings either. There may be others.
I'm still trying to work out if these are preset settings or global plugin settings.
John Braner
http://www.soundclick.com/johnbraner
and all the major streaming/download sites.

KVRian
807 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:59 am

jbraner wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:53 am
It also doesn't save chan mix or the CC7 settings either. There may be others.
I'm still trying to work out if these are preset settings or global plugin settings.
Hmm it does here. The only case that I know where that can happen is if the standalone is used and you use its own save as default (which is independent). There are very little global plugin settings, only the sys paths are store in the registry.
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com

KVRAF
13133 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Post Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:16 am

BenfordLaw wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 1:59 am
I was hoping to see a video showing loads of great presets from OPS7, so far I haven't seen one, maybe there is one in this thread that I missed? If it doesn't have loads of good presets, are potential customers just supposed to believe that THEY can make good presets with it, when no evidence has been provided that it will be anything other than more of the same old, boring FM sounds?
To some extent, this is a fair point. Not from the POV of people who already like FM, but, from the POV of selling an FM synth to people who don't believe that they love FM. There are plenty of FM synths today that do include extensive preset libraries, e.g., FM8. The sounds in those libraries are often quite removed from what many remember about the DX7.

I'm not really a DX7 fanboi. I care more about FM qua FM than I do FM as envisioned by Yamaha. But if you're trying to sell synths to everyone and not just fanbois and nostalgia nuts, then it's not unreasonable to expect a big library of presets today. Especially if you're trying to sell the relevancy of FM to modern music. I'm pretty sure that Richard Devine would want to get in on the business.

Still, I also think that it's a bit of a lost cause.

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