Logic Pro 10.7 Released

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
Cinebient
KVRAF
5131 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:57 am

antic604 wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:16 am
Cinebient wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:09 am
"...internally the software can already use MIDI 2.0’s higher resolution – something we’ve been waiting on in MIDI for a long, long time. That means 32-bit resolution for controllers and 16-bit resolution for note velocities, they tell us. You can’t export that as a saved MIDI file, because the file format doesn’t exist yet as part of the standard, though presumably, that’s coming."
I don't think that's unique. Most DAWs - at least the new ones, like S1 or Bitwig - seem to represent MIDI internally as their own, high-res format and only translate it on-the-fly to official MIDI spec before passing it on to VSTs or external synths.
I also do not meant that intern part. This is indeed nothing new. Midi 2.0 of course has that chicken/egg problem.

logicfixbrowserplz
KVRer
5 posts since 19 Oct, 2021

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 5:13 am

Man when the hell are they gonna fix the browser? Literally the only DAW in the world that cant preview 32 bit audio files. It makes no sense to me and its been this way for years. There are tons of people who complain about this too yet they never fix it

ozinga
KVRist
307 posts since 12 Oct, 2003

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 6:32 am

logicfixbrowserplz wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 5:13 am
Man when the hell are they gonna fix the browser? Literally the only DAW in the world that cant preview 32 bit audio files. It makes no sense to me and its been this way for years. There are tons of people who complain about this too yet they never fix it
Honestly I was expecting it before all this spatial deal. Really strange.

morphex
KVRian
529 posts since 30 Oct, 2003 from Pacific NW, USA

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 10:13 am

Looks very tempting, but my iMac is fine-tuned and exceptionally stable right now with macOS Catalina 10.15.7. Can others confirm the new minimum system requirement of macOS 11 Big Sur? Logic was my first DAW from back in the 90's so I'll always be a Logic user. But man am I getting sick of Apple only supporting the two latest versions of macOS for a professional application.

I bought my iMac just last Christmas and already they're about to release another major update. I'll be two OS's behind on a year-old machine for goodness sake. I get it... they want to sell computers with new M1 processors. It just stings as a longtime and loyal Apple customer. Even now I'm holding off on upgrading to Big Sur because not all of my 3rd party plugins have been updated. Oh well, I don't always need to have the newest and shiniest of toys.

User avatar
Tronam
KVRAF
1921 posts since 15 Mar, 2002 from Seattle, WA - USA

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:28 am

morphex wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 10:13 am
Looks very tempting, but my iMac is fine-tuned and exceptionally stable right now with macOS Catalina 10.15.7. Can others confirm the new minimum system requirement of macOS 11 Big Sur? Logic was my first DAW from back in the 90's so I'll always be a Logic user. But man am I getting sick of Apple only supporting the two latest versions of macOS for a professional application.

I bought my iMac just last Christmas and already they're about to release another major update. I'll be two OS's behind on a year-old machine for goodness sake. I get it... they want to sell computers with new M1 processors. It just stings as a longtime and loyal Apple customer. Even now I'm holding off on upgrading to Big Sur because not all of my 3rd party plugins have been updated. Oh well, I don't always need to have the newest and shiniest of toys.
On principle it doesn't really feel that different to me compared to the old days. By the time I had everything stabilized and reliable I wouldn't upgrade any part of the chain for as long as possible, be it OS, DAW or hardware device drivers because updates to any of them could easily crash the system. One difference seems to be the rapid acceleration of software development and an increased sense of internet-fueled FOMO which has creeped into many of us. We hunger for the latest versions of everything and are installing dozens of new plugins every year. It's an endless cycle of constant change now.

User avatar
jacqueslacouth
KVRian
1151 posts since 18 Nov, 2004 from The Liberated People's Republic of Straya

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:39 pm

morphex wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 10:13 am
Looks very tempting, but my iMac is fine-tuned and exceptionally stable right now with macOS Catalina 10.15.7. Can others confirm the new minimum system requirement of macOS 11 Big Sur? Logic was my first DAW from back in the 90's so I'll always be a Logic user. But man am I getting sick of Apple only supporting the two latest versions of macOS for a professional application.

I bought my iMac just last Christmas and already they're about to release another major update. I'll be two OS's behind on a year-old machine for goodness sake. I get it... they want to sell computers with new M1 processors. It just stings as a longtime and loyal Apple customer. Even now I'm holding off on upgrading to Big Sur because not all of my 3rd party plugins have been updated. Oh well, I don't always need to have the newest and shiniest of toys.
I wouldn't sweat it. I am using an iMac that I bought back in 2015 with Yosemite as the factory installed Mac OS. Six years later and six OS updates (and might I add, no paid updates to logic), I have just updated Logic this morning and it still runs smoothly as does Big Sur.

User avatar
dupont
KVRian
1145 posts since 23 Jun, 2007

Post Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:58 pm

Great update for step sequencer.
I would have appreciate a better implemetation of APC40 for jaming with live loops like Bitwig or live.

Sergievsky
KVRist
32 posts since 27 Jan, 2005 from Manila, Philippines

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:12 am

They're never gonna implement wait-for-note are they?
Raul

User avatar
pdxindy
KVRAF
20509 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:26 am

dupont wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:58 pm
Great update for step sequencer.
Yeah, the Step Sequencer is really satisfying now. The ability to direct record (notes and automation) and also to convert midi regions to pattern regions were the two main things missing. They also added some nice workflow improvements as well.

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20509 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:29 am

antic604 wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:16 am
Cinebient wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:09 am
"...internally the software can already use MIDI 2.0’s higher resolution – something we’ve been waiting on in MIDI for a long, long time. That means 32-bit resolution for controllers and 16-bit resolution for note velocities, they tell us. You can’t export that as a saved MIDI file, because the file format doesn’t exist yet as part of the standard, though presumably, that’s coming."
I don't think that's unique. Most DAWs - at least the new ones, like S1 or Bitwig - seem to represent MIDI internally as their own, high-res format and only translate it on-the-fly to official MIDI spec before passing it on to VSTs or external synths.
All the DAW's have high resolution internally, but still communicate at low resolution with hardware (synths, controllers etc.). Logic adding Midi 2.0 support means Logic is now ready (presumably) for when there is Midi 2.0 hardware to work with.

User avatar
Bodhisan
KVRian
685 posts since 7 Aug, 2015 from H2O

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 7:13 am

jacqueslacouth wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:39 pm
morphex wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 10:13 am
Looks very tempting, but my iMac is fine-tuned and exceptionally stable right now with macOS Catalina 10.15.7. Can others confirm the new minimum system requirement of macOS 11 Big Sur? Logic was my first DAW from back in the 90's so I'll always be a Logic user. But man am I getting sick of Apple only supporting the two latest versions of macOS for a professional application.

I bought my iMac just last Christmas and already they're about to release another major update. I'll be two OS's behind on a year-old machine for goodness sake. I get it... they want to sell computers with new M1 processors. It just stings as a longtime and loyal Apple customer. Even now I'm holding off on upgrading to Big Sur because not all of my 3rd party plugins have been updated. Oh well, I don't always need to have the newest and shiniest of toys.
I wouldn't sweat it. I am using an iMac that I bought back in 2015 with Yosemite as the factory installed Mac OS. Six years later and six OS updates (and might I add, no paid updates to logic), I have just updated Logic this morning and it still runs smoothly as does Big Sur.
For those of us with mostly-earlier-than-2014 Macs, Big Sur/latest Logic is not compatible, which, on the one hand, surely sucks, but on a realistic hand (when we don't have a financial choice, it's easy to see only the pros), my well-featured late 2012 Mac Mini and Logic 10.6.3 do everything and waaaay more than I could ever use - and all of my old plugins work wonderfully, so keeping up with the OS and Logic updates are not of substantial benefit to me. Therefore, while this upgrade is "free" to those with newer Macs, it would cost tens of thousands of us a new computer, which is Apple's plan all along - that, as a business model, you have to admire if not simultaneously despise. I guess this officially puts me into a time capsule. But it's a very contented time capsule.

Passing Bye
KVRAF
3001 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 7:53 am

Bodhisan wrote:
Wed Oct 20, 2021 7:13 am
jacqueslacouth wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:39 pm
morphex wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 10:13 am
Looks very tempting, but my iMac is fine-tuned and exceptionally stable right now with macOS Catalina 10.15.7. Can others confirm the new minimum system requirement of macOS 11 Big Sur? Logic was my first DAW from back in the 90's so I'll always be a Logic user. But man am I getting sick of Apple only supporting the two latest versions of macOS for a professional application.

I bought my iMac just last Christmas and already they're about to release another major update. I'll be two OS's behind on a year-old machine for goodness sake. I get it... they want to sell computers with new M1 processors. It just stings as a longtime and loyal Apple customer. Even now I'm holding off on upgrading to Big Sur because not all of my 3rd party plugins have been updated. Oh well, I don't always need to have the newest and shiniest of toys.
I wouldn't sweat it. I am using an iMac that I bought back in 2015 with Yosemite as the factory installed Mac OS. Six years later and six OS updates (and might I add, no paid updates to logic), I have just updated Logic this morning and it still runs smoothly as does Big Sur.
For those of us with mostly-earlier-than-2014 Macs, Big Sur/latest Logic is not compatible, which, on the one hand, surely sucks, but on a realistic hand (when we don't have a financial choice, it's easy to see only the pros), my well-featured late 2012 Mac Mini and Logic 10.6.3 do everything and waaaay more than I could ever use - and all of my old plugins work wonderfully, so keeping up with the OS and Logic updates are not of substantial benefit to me. Therefore, while this upgrade is "free" to those with newer Macs, it would cost tens of thousands of us a new computer, which is Apple's plan all along - that, as a business model, you have to admire if not simultaneously despise. I guess this officially puts me into a time capsule. But it's a very contented time capsule.
You can extend your Mini's life
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znlhI6f7x1Q

User avatar
Bodhisan
KVRian
685 posts since 7 Aug, 2015 from H2O

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 8:01 am

Passing Bye wrote:
Wed Oct 20, 2021 7:53 am

You can extend your Mini's life
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znlhI6f7x1Q
Thank you, I do appreciate the input. I did watch part of a similar video, and it's tempting, but I do worry about the compatibility of some of my older plugins (that I highly use and prize) as we "move up the ladder" with Apple and Logic. It would be such a headache to go through all that, have an issue, and then have to reload/authorize everything yet again. Practically speaking, for me, this is a case of "if ain't broke, don't fix it."

medienhexer
KVRian
1031 posts since 16 May, 2007 from At home. Good bye city ways!

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 8:29 am

My top-of-the line, all BTO options maxed (CPU, GPU), iMac Late 2013 was deemed unfit for Mac OS 11. And hence, Logic 10.7.

The MacBook Pro Late 2013 Core i5 with integrated graphics is still supported. That is the only thing I'm a bit miffed about. My iMac could easily get another two generations of OS support, as the hardware is way more capable. The GPU is even metal compatible, so this feels like a very artificial restriction. I won't really be able to produce on an old i5, so that doesn't really do anything for me.

On the other hand, this was the single longest-lasting and stable music production computer I have ever had. And if I divide the initial purchase price by 8 years of reliable service, I paid way less than 400 bucks a year. During my PC phase, I spent more than that.

And when I compare that system to the new MacBook Pros (desktop vs. mobile)...

550 MB/s SSD vs 7600 MB/s SSD
4 Cores/8 Threads vs. 2+8 cores. And my i7 started out way faster before all those security patches over the years
Geekbench estimates at least double the performance.
And apparently, the shared memory architecture allows for very low sample buffers/latency without

I'm okay with upgrading now.
I would probably see things very differently if I had invested in one of the top-of-the-line Darth Vader Trash Cans.
But as it stands, I don't feel cheated. I could just freeze all software versions and keep using it as-is. I don't have that kind of self-restraint. Also, I hope I'll never have to freeze tracks, again. And even if I had to, it would probably freeze at least 15x as fast.

I still hope for additional benefits out of other areas of the M1 CPUs like ML, so that Logic Drummer can maybe react in real time to what I play, perhaps the mixer could become less mathematically precise and dynamically apply psychoacoustic principles to make mixing more easy.. Perhaps mixing desk emulation like Avid Heat? Maybe allow control of instruments via hand gestures in front of the webcam? Intelligent Noise removal for Post? Improve the real-time performance even more by using the lowest latency or more specialised areas on the CPU which can stream without input/output buffers?
..off to play with my music toys - library music production.
http://www.FiveMinuteHippo.com

Smack Dammit
KVRist
49 posts since 19 Mar, 2012

Post Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:29 am

logicfixbrowserplz wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 5:13 am
Man when the hell are they gonna fix the browser? Literally the only DAW in the world that cant preview 32 bit audio files. It makes no sense to me and its been this way for years. There are tons of people who complain about this too yet they never fix it
Literally my biggest gripe with Logic. All the wonderful things logic can do, it can't read a 32bit audio file! That can't be that hard to implement, I mean geez you guys just invented the M1 chip...
A shame that some people actually use finder and 3rd party programs to browse through samples,myself included...

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