How you use clip launcher in your DAW?

[kritikon]

I still have absolutely no idea what a clip launcher is, so voted accordingly. Is it a dog called Clip that NASA are sending into space? "Good boy Clip, off you go and don't crap in the cockpit" kind of thing?

[Michael L]

I looked for 'Bach clips' and found this terrific project by the amazing Ethan Hein:

https://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2020/perpe ... a-prelude/

Ethan imports the midi (all notes are the same length) into Ableton and shows its structure by annotating/ color coding the chord phrases, and the motifs within those phrases which might be called 'clips.'

Thus a clip launcher could be a way for Bach to reorder phrases and motifs, n'est-ce pas?

( Sometimes, software is a poor alternative to musical skills. For me, learning new skills is way more satisfying than learning new software )

[legendCNCD]

Never use them in Live (or any other, havent tested BitWig though), way too restricted for my workflow.

[antic604]

...way too restricted for my workflow.

Just listened to your stuff on Bandcamp - it's brilliant, BTW! - and this is exactly the type of music that could benefit from being born in clip launcher / session view. You seem to have a very skewed perception of what it does

But on the other hand - if you don't need it, you don't need it.

[legendCNCD]

...way too restricted for my workflow.

Just listened to your stuff on Bandcamp - it's brilliant, BTW! - and this is exactly the type of music that could benefit from being born in clip launcher / session view. You seem to have a very skewed perception of what it does

But on the other hand - if you don't need it, you don't need it.

Thanks!

We usually start from melodies and sounds, not loops or drums etc. so I dont see how it could work

Well for me the clip launcher is just way too restricted as a view and as system. I think bitwig made it the best from what I've seen, mixing cubase patterns and live clips.

I'm from the Amiga tracker times so I want to see more note/arrange data too

[antic604]

We usually start from melodies and sounds, not loops or drums etc. so I dont see how it could work

Well for me the clip launcher is just way too restricted as a view and as system. I think bitwig made it the best from what I've seen, mixing cubase patterns and live clips.

I'm from the Amiga tracker times so I want to see more note/arrange data too

I too start from melodic stuff, usually chord progression - and I use Clip Launcher to start off. I feel like I constrain myself too much (i.e. comit to certain order / sequence) when working in Arranger first. Try it out!

And I'm ex-ProTracker guy too

[dellboy]

Never use them in Live (or any other, havent tested BitWig though), way too restricted for my workflow.

Listening to some of your stuff Its all very professional. Nice and relaxing. I liked "Tapani Rinne" .

I can sort of see where you are coming from not needing the session view as your songs often start with long pads etc. But of course there is nothing dictating how long a clip can be. It can be a 100 bars long if you want. And its not written in stone that the session view means it has to be pattern based or rhythmic. It could just as easily start off a long melodic pad. Why did you choose Live if most of your stuff is linear? It would not be my first choice for a linear DAW.

[dellboy]

In Ableton I tend to start in the Clip Launcher (Session View) to develop the original idea. I basically start with one row (scene): make a simple drum beat, add a melody, add chords, add bass, add counter-melodic elements, add other stuff ... (the order can change). Eventually I have most of the material I need for the entire song in one scene (row). Now I keep playing with different combinations of clips muting this and that clip. That way I create different scenes for different parts of the song. Once satisfied with what I have I go into the classical arrangement view and drag (or record) the different scenes onto the linear arranger, thus creating a song structure from the dedicated scenes I made previously.

I find this to be a much more intuitive approach then working in a linear sequencer only. I used to work in Cubase for many years and while Cubase has great MIDI capacities, I never found it to be particularly intuitive in terms of composition and going from a basic idea to full arrangements. Sure, in a linear sequencer you can also set a 4 bar or 8 bar loop and start from there, adding and removing elements, but the Clip Launcher approach feels more flexible, particularly since you quickly switch between scenes and try out new stuff, while keeping the original idea intact.

I work in session view in the same way.

[legendCNCD]

Never use them in Live (or any other, havent tested BitWig though), way too restricted for my workflow.

Listening to some of your stuff Its all very professional. Nice and relaxing. I liked "Tapani Rinne" .

I can sort of see where you are coming from not needing the session view as your songs often start with long pads etc. But of course there is nothing dictating how long a clip can be. It can be a 100 bars long if you want. And its not written in stone that the session view means it has to be pattern based or rhythmic. It could just as easily start off a long melodic pad. Why did you choose Live if most of your stuff is linear? It would not be my first choice for a linear DAW.

Thanks

Basically it suiting my needs in the arranger view - fast input of ideas and simplified interface without host of floating windows. I hated using cubase/logic as even with templates it took way too long to get into actually inputting notes also live audio engine is much quicker and can read changes on the fly instead of fex. logic.

I'd like a proper mixer view instead of clip view though. I'd might try the clips sometime, but how we do things its ... well more easy for us like this.

[dellboy]

I'd might try the clips sometime, but how we do things its ... well more easy for us like this.

For your type of music I think it might be counter productive, the way you work now is optimal so why change it?

[voidhead23]

You forgot to mention in the poll actually performing live with the clip launcher...follow actions in Live are insanely useful if you want backing tracks to follow a linear progression in some parts but then just loop until told to change for other parts where you want the band to be able to just jam for a while.

I've used the one in Live extensively and in many different contexts. Over the past few years i've been drifting further and further from the aesthetics of electronic music but still find the clip launcher invaluable. My typical process is to jam on one instrument and develop a series of ideas that are all related and build off of or extend from the song as a whole, similar to a linear songwriting flow. But a lot of my riffs end up in odd meters, and it speeds songwriting up considerably to be able to punch in one time sig, record the riff, then record another riff in a different meter but that first clip's meter and timing is still intact at the clip level, without having to fuss with global parameters in the Arrangement side of things. Additionally, i can very quickly create a one measure drum loop to record over and then just let it run while i record multiple measures over it, without having to worry about loop lengths of the drums or when my guitar/synth will start recording over itself. I've seen guitarists do demos in programs like Cubase and Logic and constantly hitting stop/play over and over again as they're riffing...it's infuriating.

Once i have a decent chunk of the song sketched out, i can then go in and really experiment, again, without disrupting a timeline. I can add or subtract parts, try out a synth doing the guitar part or vice versa, or remix sections entirely by chucking them in Granulator or Simpler, leading to entirely new sections and ideas. I can also get interesting variations by pitting two parts with different meters together, creating weird rhythms i wouldn't have thought to do in the abstract. All this can usually happen without even having to hit the stop button!

Once the song has all the parts i think it needs, i start dragging each section of it, one at a time, into the Arrangement and start fleshing it out by adding bass and doing the 'final take' of the drum programming. I like to flesh out each section at a time to leave room for moments where maybe the bass, overdubs or dum programming lead to yet another part or idea i hadn't had access to in the Session view. I like an annoying amount of parts in my songs.

I think if i was a proper composer this workflow would feel unnecessary. But i'm coming at it from a band paradigm, jamming it out in the rehearsal space approach, and clip launchers are as close as a computer can be to being my 'band' that can jam out ideas, tweak, explore and cull parts before committing to tape. Every time i try to work with Logic or Reaper (after getting thoroughly frustrated by Live grinding itself to a halt from one NeuralDSP amp in high oversampling mode) i just feel really stifled.

[antic604]

You forgot to mention in the poll actually performing live with the clip launcher...

That could be any one between #1 and #4

What you're describing further sounds like #2

[legendCNCD]

I'd might try the clips sometime, but how we do things its ... well more easy for us like this.

For your type of music I think it might be counter productive, the way you work now is optimal so why change it?

Well we do have very wide range of projects we work on, from producing different things (like ) to folk audio manipulation

Might be worth of investigating sometime.

[Synthack]

.........

[dellboy]

I've gotten good at playing 8-bar riffs and stopping just about exactly.

Its quite satisfying when you hit the space bar at the right time and get it to loop without further intervention.

But the real test is if you can manage to do it without a guide click track and pre-quantization turned off