Reason 3.0 announced

[AD80]

I'm also quite interested in the new 6-track mixers.

One thing I dont understand about the minimixers is why they only have six channels . It would have been more useful to me atleast if they had 10 channels like the Re-drum or 8 like the NNXT. Its like having a 12 pack of hot dogs and 10 buns. Ok I'm hungry, I need to get something eat.

[headquest]

I'm also quite interested in the new 6-track mixers.

One thing I dont understand about the minimixers is why they only have six channels . It would have been more useful to me atleast if they had 10 channels like the Re-drum or 8 like the NNXT. Its like having a 12 pack of hot dogs and 10 buns. Ok I'm hungry, I need to get something eat.

fair point. but for my rewire use I gues I would want to mix a few elements together prior to sending them to the host application. I agree that one channel per redrum voice would be good, but it will be interesting to try these out come the time...

[drez]

I'm also quite interested in the new 6-track mixers.

One thing I dont understand about the minimixers is why they only have six channels . It would have been more useful to me atleast if they had 10 channels like the Re-drum or 8 like the NNXT. Its like having a 12 pack of hot dogs and 10 buns. Ok I'm hungry, I need to get something eat.

Ches, that is a good point. I don't know what the significance of 6 is, other than maybe that's the most they could get in a 1U space without cramming it together....because they are still constrained by 800 pixels

...or maybe they got some investment dollars from a hotdog company

[zircon]

This is EXACTLY what you can do with Spiders in Reason! You can take copies of audio outputs and route them through as many pathways as you want. Youo can take an Waveform Sample from a Moog running in an NNXT and run that to an audio spider. Then you can take 4 copies of those audio streams and run them to whatever you want. You can even chain those audio spiders together for an unlimited number of audio stream copies.

Yes, but taking a sampled waveform and running it through stuff is really not what I'm talking about. You can do that in any other application, too.

You want bit reduction? Check out the Scream4, it does it. Do you want to frequency modulate something going through a Filter? Then use the OTHER side of the Audio spider that COMBINES streams and run them through a differen Malstrom Filter.

Not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about one osc frequency modulating another osc, but having complete control over the signal path of the osc. Can you take one subtractor *osc*, BEFORE it runs through envelopes, filters, or ANYTHING ELSE, send that through an effect, and have that result frequency modulate the signal of a DIFFERENT osc, which ALSO hasn't been run through anything else? If you can, I'll be extremely surprised.

Want to have everything sync up to an LFO? Create a Subtractor and use its LFO CV output run to a CV Spider and now you can control an unlimited number of CV inputs on all of the modules so you can sync up filter sweeps, formant changes on Malstrom Oscilators that you are running filters through, etc. Need a second, third, fourth (you get the picture) oscillator? Add another Malstrom/Subtractor and use it, route it through the spiders and so on.

Again, not what I'm talking about, I am referring to hard syncing oscillators.. not syncing to LFOs, which can be done in almost all synths + hosts.

NOW, with the combinator, you can control that LFO with a knob and change all of the modules with one turn of your controller knob because you have already connected them up via CV routing, and the Subtractor LFO is the master. Want to layer it up with some different synth sounds? No problem, just drop those into the combinator as well. Got about 50 modules going? No problem...you can save the whole thing as a preset and send it to me so I can hear what a great "synth" you just created

This has been possible in FL for a long time.. not much to say here.

This is just one example, but it does the same thing that the V-synth does except you aren't just limited to 2 osc because you can add as many modules as you want in a combinator and play them at the same time if you want, plus you can sequence all of the filter changes or misc modules that might give it some movement.

Well.. no, it can't. Just watch a video of the V-Synth in action - it's a sound unlike anything you'll ever hear. If you really think Reason is capable of emulating it, give it a shot If in fact Reason IS capable, well, then, awesome, I'll use it much more than I do. But I don't think that's the case.

[DHR53]

Unfortunately, all these little add-ons are making the rack a 12 headed dragon... so-to-speak I have some templates that I had to "write down" what was going on they were so complicated! It does get pretty scary hitting the tab key in my Reason

[drez]

Not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about one osc frequency modulating another osc, but having complete control over the signal path of the osc. Can you take one subtractor *osc*, BEFORE it runs through envelopes, filters, or ANYTHING ELSE, send that through an effect, and have that result frequency modulate the signal of a DIFFERENT osc, which ALSO hasn't been run through anything else? If you can, I'll be extremely surprised.

Well, you can take an a subtractor and run it it to an audio spider and duplicate that signal up to four times. You can take one of those outputs and run it through a Scream4 distortion, then run it into the audio input of a malstrom. If you then go out of the "osciallator output" of the Malstrom, it will not pass through the filters of the Malstrom, only Oscillator.

At this point you can run it through all of the various Graintables of that Oscillator including Sine, square, but also all the other cool ones like Didgerdoo, TibetanMonks, etc.

Then you can run more copies of that Single subtractor through a bunch of different Malstrom Osc's, all of which you can then combine through the merge side of an audio spider into yet another Osc of a different Malstrom...or even the same osc by putting a merge in front of it. You could even loop the output to the original Osc with a Merge. You'd probably blow your head off because of the loop, but that's not the point.

Is this what you are talking about?

...I am referring to hard syncing oscillators.. not syncing to LFOs, which can be done in almost all synths + hosts.

On the Malstrom, You can sync 2 modulators that are identical/different and run those through the same oscillator on the Malstrom by merging them with an audio spider. Could you not merge multiple Modulation sources through the same oscillator by using a merge audio spider?

What would the two hard synced Osc's do for you? Are they identical or different and if they are different, how could they be hard sync'd?

(excuse my ignorance, this is educational for me )

NOW, with the combinator, you can control that LFO with a knob and change all of the modules with one turn of your controller knob because you have already connected them up via CV routing, and the Subtractor LFO is the master. Want to layer it up with some different synth sounds? No problem, just drop those into the combinator as well. Got about 50 modules going? No problem...you can save the whole thing as a preset and send it to me so I can hear what a great "synth" you just created

This has been possible in FL for a long time.. not much to say here.

But you can't step through presets of entire racks in FL. You can do this per song maybe, but you have to load a new song to get a new setup, correct? This doesn't help me live. I can step through multiple presets in a single combinator. How can you do that in FL?

[drez]

Unfortunately, all these little add-ons are making the rack a 12 headed dragon... so-to-speak I have some templates that I had to "write down" what was going on they were so complicated! It does get pretty scary hitting the tab key in my Reason

NOW the combinator doesn't look so bad, does it?

Once you put it all in a combinator, you can minimize it down to 1U! AND you can save it as a combinator patch so you don't have to do it again

[AD80]

Once you put it all in a combinator, you can minimize it down to 1U! AND you can save it as a combinator patch so you don't have to do it again

Yup thats a useful feature indeed. My drum setup in my last Reason song was 2 full Re-drums, 10 PEQs, 2 Spiders, 1 RV7000, 1 Scream, 1 CF101, and 1 Comp1, all ran into a separate mixer. So much scrolling just for drums. Not including all my other samplers and synths and mixers.

[Jeremy_NSL]

Well, you can take an a subtractor and run it it to an audio spider and duplicate that signal up to four times. You can take one of those outputs and run it through a Scream4 distortion, then run it into the audio input of a malstrom. If you then go out of the "osciallator output" of the Malstrom, it will not pass through the filters of the Malstrom, only Oscillator.

At this point you can run it through all of the various Graintables of that Oscillator including Sine, square, but also all the other cool ones like Didgerdoo, TibetanMonks, etc.

Umm, fancy ideas, but no... If you use the audio input on the malstrom, you are only running through the malstroms filters/shaper - audio input has nothing to do with malstroms oscs.

Not to take anything away from Reasons versatility; You can do a ton of interesting stuff, but what you mention just isn't possible.

[John Vulich]

Well, you can take an a subtractor and run it it to an audio spider and duplicate that signal up to four times. You can take one of those outputs and run it through a Scream4 distortion, then run it into the audio input of a malstrom. If you then go out of the "osciallator output" of the Malstrom, it will not pass through the filters of the Malstrom, only Oscillator.

I'm not sure that you are correct about running audio through the Malstrom's oscillators. I believe the audio inputs just route through it's filters.

But you can't step through presets of entire racks in FL. You can do this per song maybe, but you have to load a new song to get a new setup, correct? This doesn't help me live. I can step through multiple presets in a single combinator. How can you do that in FL?

You can save layers as patches but I'm not sure if you can "step though" them easily.

Anyway, IMO, the 3.0 update is extremely weak. The most interesting aspect of it is the Combinator. The most baffling aspect of the new version is the incusion of a "Mastering Suite". It seems very, very odd to me, for a company that has been so adamant that their product is a "Workstation Synth" and not a DAW, to include mastering.

Ultimately, it doesn't seem like very much for 2 years of development!

[drez]

Well, you can take an a subtractor and run it it to an audio spider and duplicate that signal up to four times. You can take one of those outputs and run it through a Scream4 distortion, then run it into the audio input of a malstrom. If you then go out of the "osciallator output" of the Malstrom, it will not pass through the filters of the Malstrom, only Oscillator.

At this point you can run it through all of the various Graintables of that Oscillator including Sine, square, but also all the other cool ones like Didgerdoo, TibetanMonks, etc.

Umm, fancy ideas, but no... If you use the audio input on the malstrom, you are only running through the malstroms filters/shaper - audio input has nothing to do with malstroms oscs.

Not to take anything away from Reasons versatility; You can do a ton of interesting stuff, but what you mention just isn't possible.

If you flip the Malstrom around, you'll notice that there are inputs to the filters and yes ,you are correct, if you leave the default route out of the Malstrom it will go through the Filters.

But if you look in the lower middle you will see alternative outputs...These are the Oscillator outputs for OSC A and OSC B. There is also a little note that says if you use these outputs, the input signal will NOT go through the Filters.

Can someone double check this for me? I'm not near Reason, I'm at the salt mine

[drez]

Anyway, IMO, the 3.0 update is extremely weak. The most interesting aspect of it is the Combinator. The most baffling aspect of the new version is the incusion of a "Mastering Suite". It seems very, very odd to me, for a company that has been so adamant that their product is a "Workstation Synth" and not a DAW, to include mastering.

I think the Mastering Suite is a marketing term for those that use it as their only sequencer. Personally, I'll be using the effects as inserts on individual channels. The modules are way better than the old ones, so I'll be substituting them out for the new ones.

Plus, if you say "Mastering Suite" it SOUNDS like they are better....say it with me..."Maaaaastering Sweet"...don't you feel better already

Ultimately, it doesn't seem like very much for 2 years of development!

According to Tage, they haven't been working on it for 2 solid years, they started on it after Recycle 2.1 and some of the other stuff they did like the adapted and Educational stuff.

[digitaldoom]

Well, you can take an a subtractor and run it it to an audio spider and duplicate that signal up to four times. You can take one of those outputs and run it through a Scream4 distortion, then run it into the audio input of a malstrom. If you then go out of the "osciallator output" of the Malstrom, it will not pass through the filters of the Malstrom, only Oscillator.

At this point you can run it through all of the various Graintables of that Oscillator including Sine, square, but also all the other cool ones like Didgerdoo, TibetanMonks, etc.

Umm, fancy ideas, but no... If you use the audio input on the malstrom, you are only running through the malstroms filters/shaper - audio input has nothing to do with malstroms oscs.

Not to take anything away from Reasons versatility; You can do a ton of interesting stuff, but what you mention just isn't possible.

If you flip the Malstrom around, you'll notice that there are inputs to the filters and yes ,you are correct, if you leave the default route out of the Malstrom it will go through the Filters.

But if you look in the lower middle you will see alternative outputs...These are the Oscillator outputs for OSC A and OSC B. There is also a little note that says if you use these outputs, the input signal will NOT go through the Filters.

Can someone double check this for me? I'm not near Reason, I'm at the salt mine

I pretty sure the Malstrom only lets you run stuff through it's filters. Seems like the only advantage of trying to use stuff as the OSC (For the Malstrom) is that you could theoretically use it's graintable functions. But that is a feature people have wanted for awhile. That's why people always talk about wanting a Malstrom that that will let you load up WAV's as the OSC, instead of being limited to its internal WAV's used for the OSC. I wish the Malstrom creator would make a synth that could do that and post it on Sonic Charge. The MicroTonic is awesome.

I've been using FLStudio alot for VST sequencing, but I do miss the audio/cv routing capabilities of Reason. There are definatley routing configurations in Reason that just aren't possible with most other popular VST sequencers. I do think that someone should write a VST host that has those types of routing features, but then it would only work for audio routing anyway. Reason's cv routing structure would seem hard to implement in a VST world.

Actually...

I think I'll just stick with Reason for Audio/CV routing and I'll stick to VST sequencers for VST's.

[zircon]

On the Malstrom, You can sync 2 modulators that are identical/different and run those through the same oscillator on the Malstrom by merging them with an audio spider. Could you not merge multiple Modulation sources through the same oscillator by using a merge audio spider?

What would the two hard synced Osc's do for you? Are they identical or different and if they are different, how could they be hard sync'd?

(excuse my ignorance, this is educational for me )

Well.. I'll try to explain what I mean. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Ring modulation is when you have the signal from one normal oscillator (not an LFO) modulating the amplitude of another one. This usually creates an odd metallic/ringing sound.

Frequency modulation, in the context I'm using it, refers only to oscillator signals, not LFOs. I believe Subtractor has simple FM capabilities, but there is no way in Reason to do complex FM routing. Perhaps a "modulation matrix" type machine would solve this.

Finally, oscillators can be synchronized in two ways: hard and soft. When you "hard sync" two oscillators, you are basically using one oscillator's output waveform to reset the phase position of the other oscillator's waveform, which can create some really interesting effects. Sync leads are particularly cool.

[drez]

I pretty sure the Malstrom only lets you run stuff through it's filters. Seems like the only advantage of trying to use stuff as the OSC (For the Malstrom) is that you could theoretically use it's graintable functions. But that is a feature people have wanted for awhile.

No, I'm almost positive about this.

Its got 2 sets of outputs. The OSC outputs on the back are for OSC A and OSC B. Theres a little sticky note that says if you use these outputs, then the Filters are bypassed.

This is what you are looking for, right?

Can somebody confirm by taking a look?