Korg Wavestate and Opsix for Win/Mac

[T-CM11]

The power of wavesequencing for me is the ability to cycle through a series of full samples (as opposed to single cycle waveforms) to create long evolving pads and soundscapes that can be played from a keyboard just like you'd play any other synth.

Say you start with a Flute or Shaku sample then it morphs into a choir then to a string sample and so on. Then by layering up to 4 wavesequncer lanes you can build some truly incredible sounds. Then of course you can utilize the filters, effects, modulation, etc....

Of course Wavestate is capable of much more but the reason I want to add it my collection is for the wavesequencing.

It's not for everybody but WS is a very powerful form of synthesis.

I found the question a bit 'trollish' (a statement disguised as an 'innocent question').

[StefVR]

Was t meant it was a honest question. The wavestate got a lot of praise so I suppose it is me not seeing the point.

[kritikon]

Trying to program the Wavestate (without manual) feels... overwhelming. (context: I can work with the Wavestation, and most plugins don't require the manual, for me)

I checked the loopop video on the wavestate and can cant really get the point of the wavestate. It feels like a daw in the daw when using a daw.
Like having a sample wave based synth and then adding some automation lanes into the synth. Why not just use a synth and sequence and automate it in the daw?

Where are the advantages in using it in wavestate?

Is it just the other way of creative workflow or what really is the appeal of it?

IMO they made Wavestate a little bit easier to program than Wavestation, but it's certainly not intuitive. I think it's just a complicated synthesis mode that can't be made particularly easy to actually program. I would say anyone should at least read some of the manual for patching it - trying without is going to lead to frustration inevitably. I'm very familiar with Wavestation but i had to RTFM. Could not figure it all out on my own. A beginner to it would really struggle.

As for the DAW thing - nah. You technically can do some of what Wavestate does in a DAW but it's so long-winded you'd have to be a nutcase to try. You COULD import 37 individual samples in a lane then lay them out in the timing that you want and crossfade them (not even sure the crossfading would do the same thing a Wavestate does) but then you have to do that for every part and it would take forever. Never mind the fact that if you play notes - how do you transpose the samples in a DAW without mickey mousing them? Wavestate not only wavesequences, it's already mapped the samples across the keyboard, even within a wavesequence. Then the timings you can play with on the later ones - sorry but I can't see a way to do that at all in a DAW. Some of the fancier samplers can probably do some of what a wavesequencer does, but multiply that by 16 in a patch and I suspect they're way out of their league. Wavestate can not only layer/map/transpose etc - it can modulate the pitches, the gaps, the timing, the sample lengths and other shit. I'm stubborn but I wouldn't even attempt to do that in a DAW. I don't think it's possible, but if it is I know it would take me weeks to do the equivalent of 1 patch in a Wavestate.

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

I think we will see Korg Wavestate and Opsix as AUv3s in a year or so for iPad - maybe even way sooner!

[StefVR]

Thank you Kritikon. Exactly the kind of answer I was looking for.

[mididim]

Korg opsix Hardware vs Native comparison.

https://files.fm/u/ahgk3en4r

Link is active 2 months.
If someone have better way to leave these files in this thread forever - please do it.

opsix hw was recorded with Focusrite Clarett+ 8Pre + Fender California series cables into Cubase 11 Pro 48Khz 24bit.
opsix native was "rendered in place" in Cubase offline.
Same midi files for both instruments
Auto Normalized to - 6 dbfs

Some patches are not ported 1:1 ???
Most of them are.

Have fun and leave comments about your placebo

[kritikon]

Actually - one way to view the Wavestate is as the mother of all samplers to the power of 3. Samplers got pretty fancy but none of the ones I ever came across did what Wavestate does. Alchemy did some pretty fancy shit but it wasn't a Wavestate. Wavestation was pretty well that but now Korg took the mother of all samplers and gave it an injection of unobtanium steroids. They've quietly continued the technological progress of sampling without people really seeing it as sampling. And you can even use your own samples now, should you be so inclined. That's pretty f**king huge (not for me - I just don't have the time) but I recognise it as being the best sampler nobody ever made...until now.

[T-CM11]

Actually - one way to view the Wavestate is as the mother of all samplers to the power of 3.

Maybe you personally don't care for it, but this "mother" doesn't do granular / additive (resampling) / spectral.

[SLiC]

I think we will see Korg Wavestate and Opsix as AUv3s in a year or so for iPad - maybe even way sooner!

I’m not so sure, gadgets are already iOS and they are small and ideal for AUv3…but no ports…in fact I think only Module and Electribe wave have been ported….

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

I think we will see Korg Wavestate and Opsix as AUv3s in a year or so for iPad - maybe even way sooner!

I’m not so sure, gadgets are already iOS and they are small and ideal for AUv3…but no ports…in fact I think only Module and Electribe wave have been ported….

You might be right but now even the new iPad Air comes with the M1 Chip so, say two years from now, the standard cheap ipad will probably have the M1 and the RAM will also be increased so these will easily be able to run the same stuff found for desktops

[kritikon]

Actually - one way to view the Wavestate is as the mother of all samplers to the power of 3.

Maybe you personally don't care for it, but this "mother" doesn't do granular / additive (resampling) / spectral.

You're right, I don't care about it. Granular is for f**king stuff up. Wavestate type sounds don't need (and most people don't want) to f**k it up. If you want a pad to sound like a choral/string symphony morphing, then you want to hear the voices and strings. If you want to get a rhythm sequence like an Indonesian street player with a set of pots and pans...you want to hear the pots and pans. You can get granular FX, spectral FX etc to do that. IMO not needed at all in any sampler that I want.

You can find any number of ways to dis any synth. You're really just flailing about here - you don't like it, fine. Don't be silly trying to find things it doesn't do. Point to me any other mega sampler that does what you prefer, and I'll rip it to shreds about how it doesn't do any of what Wavestate does. Pointless? Yes.

[bermudagold]

Was t meant it was a honest question. The wavestate got a lot of praise so I suppose it is me not seeing the point.

Your question is not trollish, and your point is valid...calling it a form of synthesis is a bit of a stretch IMO, it is mainly cross-fading samples sequentially in the time domain under a single master performance envelope...as I said in my earlier post, there are therefore lots of ways to "wavesequence"...there is this style, the wusikstation style...lunacy cube is essentially wavesequencing 8 samples...all of the procedural audio physics engine tools that allow samples are also "wavesequencing"....at its simplest you can create wavesequences in a DAW or audio editor and drop them in a sampler....or you can layer samples and samplers in a plugin rack and isolate sound layers sequentially with envelope design and MSEG tools....Can you get as complex as quickly as wavestate?, which looks like a fun rabbit hole btw; ....probably not...but complex and evolving can get gimmicky pretty quickly...even the developer of Hyperion said this very thing about the pitfalls of this method...and said how the results can be hard to fit/use in a track as playable instruments...even as the wavestation was his inspiration for Hyperion
I agree with Teksonik, its a very useful sound design method...I particularly appreciate how wide a palette of timbres are achievable when using your own samples, and the deterministic nature of it...but it's not rocket science and you don't need wavestate to do it....and seems like some of wavestate's workflow time savings will be lost having to use their sample converter instead of just loading your files directly.

[Atlatnesiti]

I think we will see Korg Wavestate and Opsix as AUv3s in a year or so for iPad - maybe even way sooner!

I’m not so sure, gadgets are already iOS and they are small and ideal for AUv3…but no ports…in fact I think only Module and Electribe wave have been ported….

Really?
On my iPad Pro I have Installed Korg:
- iELECTRIBE
- iDs10
- iM1
- iMono/Poly
- iMs-20
- iPolysix
- iWAVESTATION
- Module Pro
- ODYSSEi
All of these are full apps not gadgets that work in stand alone mode or auv3

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

I think we will see Korg Wavestate and Opsix as AUv3s in a year or so for iPad - maybe even way sooner!

I’m not so sure, gadgets are already iOS and they are small and ideal for AUv3…but no ports…in fact I think only Module and Electribe wave have been ported….

Really?
On my iPad Pro I have Installed Korg:
- iELECTRIBE
- iDs10
- iM1
- iMono/Poly
- iMs-20
- iPolysix
- iWAVESTATION
- Module Pro
- ODYSSEi
All of these are full apps not gadgets that work in stand alone mode or auv3

[T-CM11]

You're right, I don't care about it. Granular is for f**king stuff up. Wavestate type sounds don't need (and most people don't want) to f**k it up. If you want a pad to sound like a choral/string symphony morphing, then you want to hear the voices and strings. If you want to get a rhythm sequence like an Indonesian street player with a set of pots and pans...you want to hear the pots and pans. You can get granular FX, spectral FX etc to do that. IMO not needed at all in any sampler.

Ah, the "danger" of using the word "sampler" online.
f**king stuff up is what I call making music, ... sometimes, often.... My Indonesian street player has Parkinson and plays his pots and pans while being attacked by mutated rabbits from outer space

But seriously; "the mother of all..." usually has a very convoluted interface. Look at Halion 6.
Edit: (a bit of topic, like this entire post) My favorite sample mangling synth these days is Pigments.