What is the future of Bitwig?

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j wazza wrote: Sat Mar 26, 2022 10:37 pm for jazz that makes sense, its a balance though as repetition can be a good thing, if something sounds good i wanna hear it again, it can get stale if repeat the exact same thing over and over, but it can also sound a bit unconnected if there isnt any repetition at all, most music does have some repetition, at least 1 part like a bass that repeats and other parts changing over the top, this is a great example that has a repeating bassline throughout but keeps it fresh with other parts changing

do you mean in your music every part is always changing, or there is always at least 1 thing changing?

that sheet music vst seems like a gap in the market if it doesnt exist as it seems like it should definitely be doable with a vst
First, the sheet music question: I think that for any really large works a plug-in would probably get pretty unwieldy. Years ago, I was heartened to see Finale produced as an application that could be run as a ReWire device. Many of us were waiting for it and once it happened, we waited for someone's DAW to get "talking" to it. And we waited. We waited some more. Cakewalk did finally allow one to run Finale as a ReWire, but there was no real communication between except for them running concurrently. Cakewalk had their own "Overture" notation SW before that, but eventually sold it off, giving up on the idea of getting Cakewalk and Overture to seamlessly integrate. The best I've seen so far is Studio One and Notion, unless one wants to go Cubase. What one does in Studio One shows up in Notion and vice-versa.

As far as repetition is concerned, it really depends on the piece; ostinato basslines are an obvious jazz technique that gets a fair amount of mileage, but even in that scenario, I like to add glissandi, slides, small fills, and other ornaments so that the line is not static. The last composition I finished (last week actually) was a through composed tone poem for choir, children's choir, and piano. In that piece and for only the opening section, there was a piano motif that I repeated against the opening children's vocal (which did not repeat). After that, nothing repeated exactly. Since it was through-composed and a tone poem (at least for this tone poem), there weren't repeating sections either: it was a straight-through form. Yes, one could say that there were demarcated sections in a sense, but they did not repeat (ala AABA or some identifiable structure).
“Madness, as you know, is like gravity: all it takes is a little push.”

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I think they should just focus on rewriting their graphics engine. In the end I can wait for any feature, but Bitwigs slightly sluggish interaction compared to Live, FL, etc is just something that's just always there, slightly annoying me enough to not want to use it.

If they did that, I'll keep paying forever just to see what they come up with, but right now (at least on my computer) it's just not fun to use Bitwig.

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delete please
Last edited by dupont on Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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delete please

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j wazza wrote: Sat Mar 26, 2022 7:50 pm
dupont wrote: Sat Mar 26, 2022 7:23 pm bitwig will try to male poly and note grid even more complicated to use and you will need a PHD and countless hours to understand how it works :lol:
synths and modulars are always complicated, but bitwig is simpler to use than almost any other modular
I agree with you but I purchase a daw licence not a modular one !

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pierb wrote: Sun Mar 13, 2022 7:51 pm It's like being able to print MIDI you just played without recordiing.
I find it hard to believe this somewhat gimmicky feature is the most important thing Bitwig would need.

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Whytejacks wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 2:56 pm the future bitwig will allow you to write the most interesting tracks with just your mind :)
It already does that.

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pierb wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 8:18 pm
Dionysos wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:05 pm While personally I'd appreciate such updates as well (just out of curiosity), I feel like there's not much in it for the devs.
Of course all approaches have pros and cons, but I think transparency and actively engaging with users is a net positive for any software company. Radio silence is really not the approach one would expect of a small indie company.

I started this thread hoping to get some official info, like U-He regularly do here on KVR. But after a couple of weeks I ended up buying a license for another DAW and will most likely end up selling my Bitwig license.

Maybe I would have been willing to stick with Bitwig until the next major update. But I have no idea where this train is going and have nothing to look forward to.
So, really you're just very whimsical and chopping and changing things willy nilly. Which DAW did you buy?

I've used Bitwig for some years now and find it, by far, the best DAW I've used for writing and composing. The flow when making music is incredible for me.

It seems to me you maybe didn't even try it long enough to make any music with it.

I don't really have a huge need for, or orchestral articulations, multi channel audio warp, Ara or some of things people are asking for. Sure would be nice to have these things in the future, but it's not a top priority for me.

I would like a few things people ask for. Improved groove tools, additional features in piano roll, a looping envelope like mseg, thought lfo modulators and using e.g. dynamics for ducking cover most of what I might want that for.

I hope that the focus remains on the good workflow. Bitwig has much better flow than other DAWs I have.

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dupont wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:59 am
j wazza wrote: Sat Mar 26, 2022 7:50 pm
dupont wrote: Sat Mar 26, 2022 7:23 pm bitwig will try to male poly and note grid even more complicated to use and you will need a PHD and countless hours to understand how it works :lol:
synths and modulars are always complicated, but bitwig is simpler to use than almost any other modular
I agree with you but I purchase a daw licence not a modular one !
bitwig is a modular daw, you purchased both! if you dont dig into the modular aspects, bitwig is as simple to use as any other easy to use daw ive tried (fl studio, studio one) and i found it easier to use than live, cubase and reaper

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docbot wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:47 am I think they should just focus on rewriting their graphics engine. In the end I can wait for any feature, but Bitwigs slightly sluggish interaction compared to Live, FL, etc is just something that's just always there, slightly annoying me enough to not want to use it.

If they did that, I'll keep paying forever just to see what they come up with, but right now (at least on my computer) it's just not fun to use Bitwig.
I doubt it will happen. I'm guessing the sluggishness comes from the fact they are using Java for the gui. Rewriting the whole gui in say C++ would be a massive task.

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_leras wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:24 am I find it hard to believe this somewhat gimmicky feature is the most important thing Bitwig would need.
I never use it either but lots of people find it useful on Live and Cubase.

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_leras wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:54 am So, really you're just very whimsical and chopping and changing things willy nilly. Which DAW did you buy?

I've used Bitwig for some years now and find it, by far, the best DAW I've used for writing and composing. The flow when making music is incredible for me.

It seems to me you maybe didn't even try it long enough to make any music with it.

I don't really have a huge need for, or orchestral articulations, multi channel audio warp, Ara or some of things people are asking for. Sure would be nice to have these things in the future, but it's not a top priority for me.

I would like a few things people ask for. Improved groove tools, additional features in piano roll, a looping envelope like mseg, thought lfo modulators and using e.g. dynamics for ducking cover most of what I might want that for.
I used Bitwig for almost 2 years exclusively. I'd say that's plenty of time to decide if it works for me or not.

And now I'm back to Cubase, after 15 or so years since I used it last time. It has its pros and cons for sure, like any other DAW, but overall I find it much more efficient than Bitwig.

Here's a little example. In Cubase I open the piano roll and it stays the way I set it up between tracks or even projects. I always want to see velocities and CC1, so that's what I see. In Bitwig I need to configure this on every new track.

In Cubase if I want to see the 8 lanes of midi CC to control Zebra XYs I can just open a preset that shows those 8 lanes at the same time in two clicks. Or if I'm using an orchestral instrument I can open a preset which shows CC1 and CC11. In Bitwig you can't even see more than 1 CC lane at the same time in the piano roll, you have to go to the arrangement view.

Bitwig is more efficient in other aspects like creating track groups which have really a minor impact in my workflow. I create groups at the most maybe 50 times per project, but I use the piano roll hundreds if not thousands of times per project.

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pierb wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 4:18 pm
docbot wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:47 am I think they should just focus on rewriting their graphics engine. In the end I can wait for any feature, but Bitwigs slightly sluggish interaction compared to Live, FL, etc is just something that's just always there, slightly annoying me enough to not want to use it.

If they did that, I'll keep paying forever just to see what they come up with, but right now (at least on my computer) it's just not fun to use Bitwig.
I doubt it will happen. I'm guessing the sluggishness comes from the fact they are using Java for the gui. Rewriting the whole gui in say C++ would be a massive task.
Too bad. I really don't know why they thought this was a good idea to begin with. Oh well, guess we just have to wait for CPUs to become insanely fast, maybe Bitwig is already more fluid on the M1?

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docbot wrote: Mon Mar 28, 2022 6:09 pm
pierb wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 4:18 pm
docbot wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:47 am I think they should just focus on rewriting their graphics engine. In the end I can wait for any feature, but Bitwigs slightly sluggish interaction compared to Live, FL, etc is just something that's just always there, slightly annoying me enough to not want to use it.

If they did that, I'll keep paying forever just to see what they come up with, but right now (at least on my computer) it's just not fun to use Bitwig.
I doubt it will happen. I'm guessing the sluggishness comes from the fact they are using Java for the gui. Rewriting the whole gui in say C++ would be a massive task.
Too bad. I really don't know why they thought this was a good idea to begin with. Oh well, guess we just have to wait for CPUs to become insanely fast, maybe Bitwig is already more fluid on the M1?
i think its the computer as the graphics arent sluggish on my current computer but was on my old one

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j wazza wrote: Mon Mar 28, 2022 6:16 pm
docbot wrote: Mon Mar 28, 2022 6:09 pm
pierb wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 4:18 pm
docbot wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:47 am I think they should just focus on rewriting their graphics engine. In the end I can wait for any feature, but Bitwigs slightly sluggish interaction compared to Live, FL, etc is just something that's just always there, slightly annoying me enough to not want to use it.

If they did that, I'll keep paying forever just to see what they come up with, but right now (at least on my computer) it's just not fun to use Bitwig.
I doubt it will happen. I'm guessing the sluggishness comes from the fact they are using Java for the gui. Rewriting the whole gui in say C++ would be a massive task.
Too bad. I really don't know why they thought this was a good idea to begin with. Oh well, guess we just have to wait for CPUs to become insanely fast, maybe Bitwig is already more fluid on the M1?
i think its the computer as the graphics arent sluggish on my current computer but was on my old one
nice! is wiggling a knob looking as fluid as in Fl or Ableton? if you have any of those installed, would be cool if you could check this out.

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