Roli: Equator 2 is here !

[ChamomileShark]

So has anyone tried out the new Roli Seaboard hardware? Did they improve the "playability" ? Although it was a very innovative controller, very difficult to play, confirmed by professional piano players (like my jazz pianist cousin)

I'm not sure that I would say that it is very difficult to play but it's true if you try and play it like a piano then you probably are going to run into problems.

[Ou_Tis]

So has anyone tried out the new Roli Seaboard hardware? Did they improve the "playability" ? Although it was a very innovative controller, very difficult to play, confirmed by professional piano players (like my jazz pianist cousin)

They already made it much easier to play (without unintentionally going off-pitch) with the Seaboard Block. Not difficult to play IMO and scales and chord shapes are much easier to learn than for piano.

The new Rise 2 won't start shipping until October, but:

"This is something we progressively improved from the GRAND to RISE to Seaboard BLOCK, but our research into the neuroscience of musical performance — particularly the cognitive loop that takes place between fine motor control and tactile perception — led us to identify a design flaw in the Seaboard.

In trying to make the Seaboard continuous, I had initially given it a curved sine wave-like structure. But our research suggested that auditory and visual perception is not fast or accurate enough to track the finger-by-finger micro adjustments that are necessary to play a continuous pitch instrument like the Seaboard in tune across multiple voices. Not only would one’s fingers slip off the keys, one couldn’t easily perceive exactly where on the key one’s finger is touching. You must have a muscle memory trigger to make the required micro-corrections in real time that enable mastery of an instrument. But because the Seaboard offers so many expressive variables (effectively 50 because you can modulate each of your 10 fingers in 5 dimensions), it is even more essential to be able to rely on muscle memory instead of a visual or audio reference of where your fingers are on the Keywaves.

In designing a solution, we took some of the advances we made with the Seaboard Block surface shape and also looked to other branches of the instrument family tree that also have relatively expressive gestural control, especially string instruments where continuous pitched playing creates profound expressiveness but also real challenges associated with playing in tune. The result is Keywave2, and what we feel is the most approachable, easiest to play interface we’ve ever made. It features precision frets, small embossed lines of silicone down the centre of each key which, like a guitar’s fretboard, serve as a motor-sensory guide. We’ve also broadened the surface and articulated the shoulders of each keywave to further improve register.

Collectively, they are subtle changes that lead to an entirely new playing experience. When we shared the new surface with seasoned composer A. R. Rahman, a long time supporter whose advice we trust deeply, noted that when playing he could now just close his eyes, play a solo, and feel it."

https://roli.com/stories/seaboard-rise- ... -of-making

[Dirk Diggler]

Traditional keyboard players have a tough time with it. It requires practice to play well.
As does any expressive fretless instrument. It's just about learning the movements and getting comfortable with all that expression under each finger.

FYI pay now and expect delivery in November 2022. Yeah I just read that fine print !!!

[Ou_Tis]

Traditional keyboard players have a tough time with it. It requires practice to play well.
As does any expressive fretless instrument. It's just about learning the movements and getting comfortable with all that expression under each finger.

FYI pay now and expect delivery in November 2022. Yeah I just read that fine print !!!

1. The Rise 2 has tactile and visual frets (still subtle enough not to get in the way of gliding, hopefully). It's one of the major changes, arguably the biggest one.

2. For the Seaboard Block, a struck key will initially default to the exact note pitch no matter where you strike, unless glided (pitch bent) into. So it's not as difficult to play as a fretless instrument. Personally I don't have trouble gliding from one note to the next without tuning issues. IDK what the default behavior of the Rise 2 will be for a struck note not glided into.

[trackbout]

I have a Rise 25 and it's very little like playing a piano, the new one doesn't look much different. It's incredibly expressive but it takes quite a bit of practice to get used to, for one thing the "black" keys extend all the way to the end of the "white" keys, even though the bump doesn't the sensor does, so you can accidentally hit "black" keys while playing "white" keys. Also, after the initial key strike, you have to flatten your finger from the tip to the pad before you slide the note, stuff like that. Lots of little techniques that are not required with a piano.

My favorite thing to use it with though, after Equator 2, is drums. It's much more straightforward with drums, you just bang on it. It may actually be the best midi drum pad ever made. I sold my Akai once I figured that out.

[BONES]

I've also found it the best way to play drums. It's really, really good at it and I find my timing is way better when I use it and that it is easier to be expressive with it than with anything else - pads or keys.

Now that the RISE 2 rollout is over, where are the much needed update to Equator 2? Four months into 2022 and nothing major and basic functions still missing lol whats going on.

What's missing from E2? It's a f**king powerhouse! That said, I find I prefer the original version and tend to use it more than v2. I'm glad that Roli didn't stop supporting it.

So has anyone tried out the new Roli Seaboard hardware? Did they improve the "playability" ? Although it was a very innovative controller, very difficult to play, confirmed by professional piano players (like my jazz pianist cousin)

AFAIK it's not available yet, they are just taking pre-orders. And, to be completely clear, the idea behind the Seaboard isn't to reinvent the wheel, it's to offer something new and different to what your cousin would be used to. If he didn't find it difficult to play, I'd be very disappointed because I don't think it is aimed at people like him.

[Echoes in the Attic]

E2 needs some kind of user sample folder management. It only lets you dump them into the main directory. Which is a huge shame considering that you modulate the sample by index in a folder.

[kNarf_]

Does this synth have a proper midi learn function which lets you assign functions to your (non-MPE) controller? The manual is not very clear about this.

[Examigan]

AFAIK MIDI learn isn't included.

[Spitfire31]

The lack of 'conventional' control options is the big Achilles heel of Equator 2. It's a real PIA.

[kNarf_]

That's a real shame... even most freeware synths have these options. Makes it definitely a no go for me, even if it's currently on sale for 30% off

[emasters]

The lack of 'conventional' control options is the big Achilles heel of Equator 2. It's a real PIA.

Not sure I understand what you mean by conventional? They have both "MPE" and "Standard" patches. With MPE patches, it's true that they don't map well to non-ROLI keyboards... but that's the point -- they are MPE specific. In the MOD section you can select Standard with an MPE patch, but it's also not ideal, but works. I use Standard patches fine with a traditional MIDI keyboard/controller. It's nice because those are all pre-mapped with Aftertouch, MOD and Pitch wheel, two X-Y CC controllers and 3 Macro rotary controllers. That said perhaps you were referring to something else? As far as filtering the browser for Standard patches that have adjustable parameters, it works fine here. Am anxious to try the MPE patches with Seaboard 2... alas, it's a long wait until November...

[Spitfire31]

With conventional I mean arbitrary CC controls on a non-MPE controller.

For instance, I have tried in vain to get the keyboard patches respond to, i.a. CC11 without success. Frustrating.

[emasters]

With conventional I mean arbitrary CC controls on a non-MPE controller.

For instance, I have tried in vain to get the keyboard patches respond to, i.a. CC11 without success. Frustrating.

I see what you mean - thx. Seems like having generic CC's as a modulation source, would be a nice enhancement. One way to currently do this, is map CC 11 to one of the five Macro knob CC numbers using an external MIDI processor (like MIDI-Ox on PC or MIDIPipe on Mac) before going to the stand-alone app or DAW. There are 5 Macros that can be assigned as modulation sources in the Mod Matrix. Not ideal since it's an extra external step (MIDI learn would be a nice addition). But it would let you use CC 11, routed to one of the Macro CC's, that's then assigned to the parameters in the Mod Matrix, you want to control.

[Spitfire31]

@emasters: Thank you! I did mess with something along the lines that you suggest, but it's not very, er… spontaneous. Since I like the sounds, I might try again and see if I can cook up some sort of template, if that's possible. Thanks again!