Paradigm shift - appreciating Bitwig

[xbitz]

Note Grid was the breakthrough for me

finally can be built sequencers in it, ^^^ for ex. different MIDI channels able to trigger different sequencer lines even with phase (position) reset or audio>triggering MIDI notes can be generated for modulators/effects on audio tracks etc. pretty useful

Yes - for me this was vastly beneficial for my music - though I am not skilled enough yet to build something as large as in your photo , I have found small Note Grid structures offer me wonderful sequencing control - I would have to pay 70$ for a M4L device to do the same thing and it would be a one trick pony at that - furthermore (as I wrote win the OP) using M4L for such things would increase the chances of the project crashing when being opened or when adding M4L devices --- so , yes -- the Note Grid was a massive benefit for me too

yepp the last package which was built around note generation

also insprative stuff

[SLiC]

Yes - for me this was vastly beneficial for my music - though I am not skilled enough yet to build something as large as in your photo , I have found small Note Grid structures offer me wonderful sequencing control - I would have to pay 70$ for a M4L device to do the same thing and it would be a one trick pony at that - furthermore (as I wrote win the OP) using M4L for such things would increase the chances of the project crashing when being opened or when adding M4L devices --- so , yes -- the Note Grid was a massive benefit for me too

I have dozens of MAX devices, they were all free…never paid for one (the ones I havecseen for sale are all under 30 bucks)

One of the big advantages of Live for me is Max, it’s been around longer so has massive community suppprt, there are almost 6000 mainly free devices here https://maxforlive.com/ just a handful on bitwiggers…so you really have to DIY with Bitwig, you can probably find what you. Red already made with MAX.

[DJ Warmonger]

As a sound designer I am always looking for ways to connect, combine and control synths as I wish. Unfortunatelly many great-sounding synth don't come with sufficient modulation options, and Bitwig could come in handy here. As it turns out, M4L (including native devices) in Live is just not reliable and sometimes stops working, ruining my workflow.

I have dozens of MAX devices, they were all free…never paid for one (the ones I havecseen for sale are all under 30 bucks)

I don't even buy any preset or sample packs, so didn't even consider purchasing some 3rd-party devices with are bound to specific environment that's not rock-solid in first place. Random free devices have been hit-or-miss so far so I stopped using them altogether.

But then, I already have many preconfigured Ableton Racks with bread-and-butter functionalities and bus setups. Plus, many features I can't think of at the moment but probably will be missing once I try to move to Live. I don't want to realize in a middle of a project that I can't do something I usually do.

Still, waiting for future developments. Maybe Bitwig will become more attractive in a few years.

[Fraggle]

As a sound designer I am always looking for ways to connect, combine and control synths as I wish. As it turns out, M4L (including native devices) in Live is just not reliable and sometimes stops working, ruining my workflow.

This is my experience too -- I persevered for over a decade -

I think bigwig at version 2 or 3 would not have had enough for me , but moving at version 4.2 seems to have been one of the best music software choices I have ever made - maybe the best

[Fraggle]

. Random free devices have been hit-or-miss so far so I stopped using them altogether.

I agree - I visited the M4L community device pages a few times , but rarely found what I needed - just because there are 6000 devices doesn't mean they are any use - size does not equate with quality

[xbitz]

^^^ with Reaktor can have the same lifestyle for ex. I'm using MSEG from toyboxaudio as I've posted viewtopic.php?p=8429442#p8429442 luckily the rack view with the cables is pretty user friendly

[melomood]

OP forgot 'TDLR'd by everyone with no investment in this singular opinion'

[liquidsound]

As a sound designer I am always looking for ways to connect, combine and control synths as I wish. Unfortunatelly many great-sounding synth don't come with sufficient modulation options, and Bitwig could come in handy here. As it turns out, M4L (including native devices) in Live is just not reliable and sometimes stops working, ruining my workflow.

I have dozens of MAX devices, they were all free…never paid for one (the ones I havecseen for sale are all under 30 bucks)

I don't even buy any preset or sample packs, so didn't even consider purchasing some 3rd-party devices with are bound to specific environment that's not rock-solid in first place. Random free devices have been hit-or-miss so far so I stopped using them altogether.

But then, I already have many preconfigured Ableton Racks with bread-and-butter functionalities and bus setups. Plus, many features I can't think of at the moment but probably will be missing once I try to move to Live. I don't want to realize in a middle of a project that I can't do something I usually do.

Still, waiting for future developments. Maybe Bitwig will become more attractive in a few years.

Modulat by Chaos Culture has been extremely stable and offers quite some power. It’s not free but the cpu usage is very low. I made a compare test with LFOs using a ridiculous amount of them in both Live (with Modulat) and Bitwig.
The cpu consumption was the same as in Bitwig.
That’s not an easy task for M4L!

It is not as elegant as BWS but it can do a LOT!
And ,as usual, for some users Live is unstable and for others, me for example, Live is a freaking Rock solid DAW.

The Grid is absolutely easier and certainly much more useful to the majority of light users.

[apoclypse]

I don't have paradigm shifts when I buy new things. Quite the opposite. I normally hate it for a good 3-6 months then it just clicks one day and next thing you know I'm pumping out music like nobodies business and it almost becomes essential to my setup. Don't know why it works that way for me but it does. I hated macOS when I first bought my first MBP way back when (2007). I was coming from Linux. Now I can't even imagine going back to Linux at all.

Anyway at this time I'm still on the hate/love relationship with Bitwig and its been like 3-4 years so I don't know when it will flip, but its not doing it for me. But I'm not a sound designer and I can see Bitwig being a great tool for people who like to design sounds, or do interesting things with sequencers and effects etc. Maybe that's the point of Bitwig and it will never be a tool made for my purposes, who knows. Glad the OP found something that they enjoy using though.

[zerocrossing]

I love Bitwig, but your analogy hasn’t been valid for the last 15 years or so. I have both Apple and Windows based machines and, sadly, there’s little benefit to Apple, unless you’re talking about their iOS devices.

[jamcat]

Maybe that's the point of Bitwig and it will never be a tool made for my purposes, who knows.

Yeah, that’s right.

If you just want something that’s going to help you record your songs and get to the sound you have in your head, none of Bitwig’s gimcrackery is going to help.

Bitwig is more for people who want to click around until something interesting happens in lieu of a song.

[apoclypse]

I love Bitwig, but your analogy hasn’t been valid for the last 15 years or so. I have both Apple and Windows based machines and, sadly, there’s little benefit to Apple, unless you’re talking about their iOS devices.

Oh boy this is going to turn into an Apple vs PC debate isn't it.

[Dionysos]

Bitwig is more for people who want to click around until something interesting happens in lieu of a song.

Put me to sleep with more tired takes please.

[cel4145]

Yeah, that’s right.

If you just want something that’s going to help you record your songs and get to the sound you have in your head, none of Bitwig’s gimcrackery is going to help.

Bitwig is more for people who want to click around until something interesting happens in lieu of a song.

If you're having great difficulty composing a song with Bitwig, it's not Bitwig that is the problem.

[jamcat]

I think Bitwig is used primarily for experimental and generative sound, which is the antithesis of composition. Isn’t that the point of it?