VoS ThrillseekerVBL mkII released (Win 64bit)

[ampetrosillo]

Of course it's all subjective as well.

[Teksonik]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion? Then these are no longer discussion forums.

It wouldn't make any difference as to why I don't like the plugin since it's free and everybody else can try it for themselves and form their own opinions. I did not attack the plugin on a technical level. All I said was "Meh, I don't like it" and that triggered a storm of tears.

I think your attitude stinks to high heaven;

No, you just don't agree with my opinion. If you did you wouldn't be polluting this thread with your rambling diatribe.

You have a history of starting arguments just as a hobby so you're no angel here at KVR. I didn't call anyone "ignorant" or "tasteless" or tell them to "shut the f*ck" up as you have done me. I simply gave my honest opinion and thanked the developer at the same time and you got triggered.

I would have been happy to just move on but no, you have to keep digging and hence I'll keep responding.

Look I get it, you're triggered and that's fine. We all belong to one cult or another. It's not a derogatory term. It just means people are deeply passionate about something. I simply don't share the passion for these plugins and when a new one is released and I feel the same way I'll say so. If that triggers anyone then so be it. If he releases a plugin I like I'll be very happy to praise it like I did with EpicVerb:

EpicVerb imparts a nice character and attitude to drum tracks although I haven't tested it on other material yet. I'm generally not a huge fan of plate reverbs but this one is certainly worth keeping around for special occasions.
Thanks to VOS for setting it free.....

I don't like Thrillseeker VBL MKII, it's as simple as that. Those who do are free to disagree, simple as that. What you don't have the right to do is project your own anger and need for confrontation on my intentions.

Tired of my opinion? Fine then just stop and I'll move on. Keep quoting me and attacking me and I'll be right back to respond. If you can't resist at that point the person who is polluting the thread becomes painfully obvious.

[jens]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion?

OF COURSE there is none - however there is every reason to not do it.

Do you consider your own opinion much more valuable for the community than the opinion of others?

Just imagine everyone who doesn't like any certain plugin would post in every thread about it "meh, don't like it".

That idea is so absurd and so extremely anti-social that the mid boggles at your apparent inability to comprehend this.

I don't know if you share your music online somewhere, but imagine if everyone who doesn't like it would reply with a "meh don't like it".

Imagine everyone who doesn't like Chinese food would enter every Chinese restaurant he/she passes to shout out "meh, don't like Chinese food" before passing on. Gosh - is it actually possible that I really have to explain this to you?


B.t.w.- this was more that eight! years ago:

I always find it hilarious when Bootsie releases one of his Placebos ...

Typical Teksonik response for quite a while now.


I'm rolling with VoS plugins for some time. And while some of it is not my cup of tea, it's definitely not(!!!) placebo. The added effects (saturation, sound shaping from filter courves, etc) can be clearly measured with known tools. It can also be clearly heard (if overdone).
[...]
"The Emperor's New Clothes" analogy doesn't apply here - sorry.


Whether or not it's pleasant or usable lies on a whole different ballpark.

I always find it hilarious when Bootsie releases one of his Placebos that anyone who doesn't like them must be deaf or stupid or their monitors suck, they're on drugs or any number of other flaws relating to their DNA.........
Google: The Emperor's New Clothes........

You can always check it with a simple null test. With SlickHDR the best I could do when all 3 meters barely light the first few leds was around -18dBFS. Now if you can not hear that difference even though you should be easily able to then it means SlickHDR is doing it's job, as intended, rather brilliantly.

Now lets take a more subtle bootsie plugin, something like TesslaPro mk2. With the default settings on a simple drum loop I got a whopping -24dB of difference. Now this one can be a bit harder to hear but perhaps you are starting to get my point?

Your "placebo" or "impossible to hear" is perhaps not so much the lies of others but perhaps your own perception/monitoring chain?

Now it's a completely different discussion of you like or dislike the effect but spewing bullshit about the plugins being placebo or impossible to hear just shows your own ignorance.

It's all starting to sound more like some weird case of jealousy here on these forums. What do you guys have against Bootsie? What did he do to offend you? You haters just hating for the kicks of it or just the general type of person who wants to see the world burn?

"Typical Teksonik response for quite some time now" Compy wrote already BACK THEN FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!

[jens]

Tired of my opinion?

Frankly put I am convinced it's much more a thorough lack of competence and basic listening ability (either lack of skills or the required gear or both) on your part, which is why you are also completely incapable of giving any actual reason; an thus voicing anything that resembles even just a basic insight regarding the VOS plugins.

To me it is of as much consequence as if someone who never cooked a single meal in his whole life would say "making your own venison gravy? Meh, don't like it!". It is impossible to despise your opinion more than I do.

And btw. this isn't only regarding VOS - I don't think I ever read a single post from you that gave me the idea that you have anything insightful or relevant to say.

[Lesha]

I am starting to think that the type of behavior coming from him is closely represented by his avatar.

[jens]

And btw., here is my own post from the thread I quoted above:

Here's a short example (before/after) with about the same RMS, either you like it or not (of course dynamic range decreases).
http://www.leinilive.at/hdr/example1_before.wav
http://www.leinilive.at/hdr/example1_after.wav
If you want to download and have problems to do this with your browser, click here:
http://www.leinilive.at/slickhdr.html

I don't hear much difference. Is that the final verdict that I am not pro audio?

There is a world of difference though - I even think it's a tad overdone here...

to hear best what it does, you need to try to listen as carefully as possible to the release portion of the guitar... i.e. not the beginning of every individual note but how it sounds after its attack-phase - there is much more detail i.e. it sounds much more vidid.

I haven't had a chance to try the plugin myself yet, but Peter's example imo showcases quite well what this is all about, as I got it just from listening to it and reading the technical explanation.

Regarding HDR images consider the earlier posted image of the snow and the trees. Normally, either the snow is too dark or the trees are too bright. No conventional photograph will ever be able to capture the real image, which you see with your eyes, even just halfway appropriately, as there will always have to be a trade-off between capturing the extreme darkness and the extreme brightness. This is why back in the day Ansel Adams developed his zone system ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_System ).

A similar problematic interdependency as with with darkness vs. brightness in photographs you have with transients vs. the release section of audio material and Bootsie's new baby deals with this problem.

See the difference?

viewtopic.php?t=402221

[kvaca]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion? Then these are no longer discussion forums.

Even deaf person can give a negative opinion here, but then he /or she/ should not be surprised when some people call him idiot.

[digitalboytn]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion? Then these are no longer discussion forums.

Even deaf person can give a negative opinion here, but then he /or she/ should not be surprised when some people call him idiot.

I think that there's a few deaf people around here

[kPere]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion?

OF COURSE there is none - however there is every reason to not do it.

What?!?!

[jens]

What is unclear to you? Can you please ask a precise question, then I can give a precise answer!

[kPere]

What is unclear to you? Can you please ask a precise question, then I can give a precise answer!

We need negative opinions even more than the positive ones. Cannot believe there are so many people who cannot stand others opinions and criticism. Once again - we need those to get better with what we do. I love VoS plugins but I'm all behind the guy who said he doesn't in that discussion.

[Michey]

If I try a plugin and it does nothing for me - for whatever reason - I delete/uninstall it an move on. There is zero point in polluting a thread about it

So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion?

OF COURSE there is none - however there is every reason to not do it.

What?!?!

It took me a while, too, to wrap my head around his answer. I think the rephase should be :

Tek: So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion?
Jens: Of course you can give a negative opinion. however, there are a lot of reasons for you to NOT give a negative opinion.

---------

On a personal note, it kinda reminds me my feeling towards Kelvin. EIGHT downloads/deletions (most EVER IN MY LIFE), just to reach the same conclusion: MEH (if there was a movement called "MEH Too" I'd be the first in it). I personally wouldn't pay 1$ for it and would even not use it were it free. but it's me, my opinion, my genre of music-making and my ears. and I respect anyone and everyone who hails it (I also DO understand that the origin of the immense disparity is within ME, otherwise the majority of people would've thought the same)

In light of the past posts mentioned above... it seems like some kind of a personal vendetta (I wouldn't dare going beyond)

@kPere it is not about the mere existence of the negative opinions. it's about the repetitive fashion, and its longevity.

[jens]

What is unclear to you? Can you please ask a precise question, then I can give a precise answer!

We need negative opinions even more than the positive ones. Cannot believe there are so many people who cannot stand others opinions and criticism. Once again - we need those to get better with what we do. I love VoS plugins but I'm all behind the guy who said he doesn't in that discussion.

Don't take it completely out of context! Read everything before joining in like that please! Your post is basically off topic. OF course critique is important and I clearly never said anything against it.

But just saying "i don't like it" wihtout giving any reason whatsoever is something completely different. It has no possible, useful function at all. And that is clearly what I meant.

[jens]

It took me a while, too, to wrap my head around his answer. I think the rephase should be :

Tek: So there is zero point in giving a negative opinion?
Jens: Of course you can give a negative opinion. however, there are a lot of reasons for you to NOT give a negative opinion.

No, actually I meant it exactly as I said it - and again: this is specifically about just saying "meh - don't like it" without gving any specific information at all. That's just random noise.

On a personal note, it kinda reminds me my feeling towards Kelvin. EIGHT downloads/deletions (most EVER IN MY LIFE), just to reach the same conclusion: MEH (if there was a movement called "MEH Too" I'd be the first in it). I personally wouldn't pay 1$ for it and would even not use it were it free. but it's me, my opinion, my genre of music-making and my ears. and I respect anyone and everyone who hails it (I also DO understand that the origin of the immense disparity is within ME, otherwise the majority of people would've thought the same)

In light of the past posts mentioned above... it seems like some kind of a personal vendetta (I wouldn't dare going beyond)

@kPere it is not about the mere existence of the negative opinions. it's about the repetitive fashion, and its longevity.

Yes, exactly! Btw.: I can't count the times I thought "meh" about a plugin. Rarely I feel so strongly about it that I make one or even more posts about it. But when I do, I certainly explain why specifically I think so. (Excalibur comes to mind - but that one received so much praise and I had so many expectations built up over the years it required a ilok-dongle - what an utter let-down it was)

Probably more often than not when I test it later again my opinion changes for the better btw.

[Michey]

Probably more often than not when I test it later again my opinion changes for the better btw.

That line speak volumes of the "tragedy" (strong word, I know) of plugin developers (and us, as users who burden ourselves by virtue of their mere existence) : the sheer amount of them plugs that just float around in the cyber space makes it a certainty that we fall to a cognitive bias.

I can't even count the times I had the exact same experience. but I vividly remember two plugs fondly in that regard (and acted upon that experience ie. started re-using them):
CamelCrusher (VST hall-of-famer, IMO) and Photosounder's SplineEQ (the paid AND free version).